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Climate Change & The Paris Agreement
jjanecka Offline
#151 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 2,220
In the 70's we were freezing due to massive CO2 in the 80's we were told to use plastics to save the trees, in the 90's we were told we are melting in 2000's we were told to use paper because it's "sustainable" and the world is supposedly still melting though science is showing an increase in polar ice.

The media needs to get their straight and stop the lies already.
Brewha Offline
#152 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
tailgater wrote:
I like the play on words.
But in this instance you seem to be incorrect, since the south isn't melting like the north.

Would it make you happy if I said "and no one will ever be sure if pollution is effecting the South Pole"?

I get the doubt. We have all been lied to - prolly more than we know.

But my meager wits tell me the pollution/climate change is for true......

In fairness, Drafter is convinced a politician is a large white sea going mammal. So who really knows.
Brewha Offline
#153 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
jjanecka wrote:
In the 70's we were freezing due to massive CO2 in the 80's we were told to use plastics to save the trees, in the 90's we were told we are melting in 2000's we were told to use paper because it's "sustainable" and the world is supposedly still melting though science is showing an increase in polar ice.

The media needs to get their straight and stop the lies already.

Dare to dream.....
DrafterX Offline
#154 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
I just watched parts of (was busy with other stuff) Bjørn Lomborg's Cool It.... I need to watch it again and I'd recommend it to anyone participating in this thread also... a view point some might not want to hear but it has some good info... basically he said we could spend trillions upon trillions of dollar to drop the temps 1/10 of a degree in the next hundred years.. he doesn't deny climate change but thinks it's a waste of money trying to fight it... the movie is more detailed of course... Mellow
Brewha Offline
#155 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
So China should burn more coal? Huh
DrafterX Offline
#156 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
No... China is a mess... but there are other solutions besides windmills. .. Denmark is taking theirs down in fact... Mellow
Brewha Offline
#157 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
Denmark cares about Bald Eagels????

I thought they were communist.



Besides, the coal China burns is "clean" so we all know I'd doesn't hurt the environment. Why should they not burn twice as much?

Have you been fooled by the liberal maid again?
DrafterX Offline
#158 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
Losing money. .. kinda like ethanol... Damn the ethanol..!! Mad
Brewha Offline
#159 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
No, no - the Chinese only loose money because they give a yen.....



That's what I heard.
DrafterX Offline
#160 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
Trump will fix them... Mellow
DrafterX Offline
#161 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
LOL



sorry... Mellow
Brewha Offline
#162 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
No - He's fix us all.....
DrafterX Offline
#163 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
He's all we gots.... he's all we gots.... Sad
tailgater Offline
#164 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 19,251
Brewha wrote:
Would it make you happy if I said "and no one will ever be sure if pollution is effecting the South Pole"?

I get the doubt. We have all been lied to - prolly more than we know.

But my meager wits tell me the pollution/climate change is for true......

.


If you read everyday that pollution was making the world colder, you'd believe it. Maybe it blocks the sun and prevents things from heating up.

If you read everyday that pollution was making he world hotter, you'd believe it. Maybe it acts like a blanket at night and keeps the warmth from dissipating.

If you read everyday that pollution was causing the earths climate to hold steady, you'd believe it. Maybe the sun blocking/blanket combination is doing TOO good of a job and the climate isn't changing for the first time in history! The stagnant climate is cause for concern!


A logical argument can be made for virtually any point of view. We choose who we listen to.
And they choose how they're funded.


Meanwhile, I think we should clean up the earth and invest in renewable energy technology.
Without all the doom and gloom it becomes sound policy rather than a partisan cash cow.

DrafterX Offline
#165 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
The movie I refered to mentions geo-engineering.. planting more trees and a one time billion dollar investment in replacing the asphalt in LA would drop the temp in that city 5 deg... interesting stuff. .. Mellow
tailgater Offline
#166 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 19,251
DrafterX wrote:
The movie I refered to mentions geo-engineering.. planting more trees and a one time billion dollar investment in replacing the asphalt in LA would drop the temp in that city 5 deg... interesting stuff. .. Mellow


Tax the asphalt!
tonygraz Offline
#167 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 8,409
DrafterX wrote:
The movie I refered to mentions geo-engineering.. planting more trees and a one time billion dollar investment in replacing the asphalt in LA would drop the temp in that city 5 deg... interesting stuff. .. Mellow


Didn't they try that in Death Valley ?
Brewha Offline
#168 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
tailgater wrote:
If you read everyday that pollution was making the world colder, you'd believe it. Maybe it blocks the sun and prevents things from heating up.

If you read everyday that pollution was making he world hotter, you'd believe it. Maybe it acts like a blanket at night and keeps the warmth from dissipating.

If you read everyday that pollution was causing the earths climate to hold steady, you'd believe it. Maybe the sun blocking/blanket combination is doing TOO good of a job and the climate isn't changing for the first time in history! The stagnant climate is cause for concern!


A logical argument can be made for virtually any point of view. We choose who we listen to.
And they choose how they're funded.


Meanwhile, I think we should clean up the earth and invest in renewable energy technology.
Without all the doom and gloom it becomes sound policy rather than a partisan cash cow.


So, let me get this straight - You dismiss the data and opinions of NOAA, NASA, the DOD and the governments of the world at large.

But - it's MY opinion that is steered exclusively by the media.



Ever considered conservative talk radio as a job?
gummy jones Offline
#169 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 4,888
hadnt watched this in a few years
decided to piece through it again

https://youtu.be/52Mx0_8YEtg
Stinkdyr Offline
#170 Posted:
Joined: 06-16-2009
Posts: 9,797
Brewha wrote:
Well, on the list China has the largest reductions (20%) scheduled.

The text is a cut and past from the UN web site. But you know the story with the UN....



If people cause global warming, then logically, more people cause more global warming.
So breeding more people aggravates global warming.
So END WELFARE breeding to stop making the problem worse.

Beer
elRopo Online
#171 Posted:
Joined: 02-17-2014
Posts: 887
Stinkdyr wrote:
If people cause global warming, then logically, more people cause more global warming.
So breeding more people aggravates global warming.
So END WELFARE breeding to stop making the problem worse.

Beer

You may be on to something but, it may take more than that. Maybe WWIII? Think
DrMaddVibe Offline
#172 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 46,296
Cows are STILL going to fart.

elRopo Online
#173 Posted:
Joined: 02-17-2014
Posts: 887
DrMaddVibe wrote:
Cows are STILL going to fart.


The survivors will need to become vegetarians.
MACS Offline
#174 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 59,856
http://news.wisc.edu/from-rocks-in-colorado-evidence-of-a-chaotic-solar-system/

Hmmmm... this is interesting. Whistle
victor809 Offline
#175 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 12,067
Damm
victor809 Offline
#176 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 12,067
Dammit macs... summarize a little so we can know what it's about without following the link. Mobile site doesn't let me follow a link easy. I see its from UW so it might be interesting.
DrafterX Offline
#177 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
they found evidence that white dudes are really from Mars... American Indians are the only true Earthlings.. Mellow
tonygraz Offline
#178 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 8,409
Damn illegal invaders !
gummy jones Offline
#179 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 4,888
Freaking white aliens better check their privilege
elRopo Online
#180 Posted:
Joined: 02-17-2014
Posts: 887
No wonder everything seems so alien here, I have blue eyes!
Speyside Online
#181 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 3,395
Geez, the term is undocumented immagrant!
MACS Offline
#182 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 59,856
victor809 wrote:
Dammit macs... summarize a little so we can know what it's about without following the link. Mobile site doesn't let me follow a link easy. I see its from UW so it might be interesting.


Yeah, no bias there, right? HA!

One of your fellow alum and another fella from Northwestern seem to have found support for a chaotic solar system theory and it's effect on the climate. I'm sure it would be a waste of your time reading it... then you'd just have to type out a long reply to how those scientists got it wrong and stuff.
tonygraz Offline
#183 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 8,409
Seems to be a trend recently that scientists have it all wrong according to non-scientists.
DrafterX Offline
#184 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
I have no doubt scientists know the truth. .. and I have no doubt it's not in their best interests to share it... Mellow
MACS Offline
#185 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 59,856
tonygraz wrote:
Seems to be a trend recently that scientists have it all wrong according to non-scientists.


Obviously, you did not bother to read the article. I'm shocked I tell you...
TMCTLT Offline
#186 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 18,601
Brewha wrote:
I donno Tail. By that rational cigarettes are only a health risk so the govmut can tax them. No I love me some cigar - but a health food they are not.

Also, they banned the production of incandescent light bulbs because they waste energy. So just like banning CFC's we can make changes without taxes.




Using this rational replace FOOD with cigarettes....my understanding is obesity related health issues now outstrip smoking related issues here in the US.

Now while I love me some FOOD....I do not abuse it and those who DO ultimately loose a good potion of " quality of life " in order to abuse it. Here in Indiana they're currently looking @ adding a $1.50 per pack tax on Cigs....while looking the other way when it comes to addressing obesity ( we are a leader in this health issue ) and it's cost to society and quality of life. I understand that is " seems " like these are completely different issues but in the end, does it NOT come down to how much health care dollars are being spent on smokers? I think the fact that WE ALL EAT FOOD probably distorts the conversation and will keep us from addressing it honestly. If we're gonna TARGET certain people or industries fine....but let's do it honestly. If your obese or morbidly obese....your Big Mac should cost you two or three times what the other guy pays etc.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012/04/30/obesity-now-costs-americans-more-in-healthcare-costs-than-smoking/#54d888ac53d7
SteveS Offline
#187 Posted:
Joined: 01-13-2002
Posts: 8,271
DrafterX wrote:
... a view point some might not want to hear but it has some good info... basically he said we could spend trillions upon trillions of dollar to drop the temps 1/10 of a degree in the next hundred years.. he doesn't deny climate change but thinks it's a waste of money trying to fight it...


I'm going to have to watch that ... I've got a book detailing pretty much that point of view ...

Thing is, all this stuff is quite cyclical ... 40-odd years ago, the scientific community was banging the drum with dire predictions of "a new ice age" due to global cooling ... plenty of data was cited to prove the point ... well, we dodged the new ice age and now we've got the opposite extreme being thrown at us ... and, inasmuch as the sun is the source of the earths heat and there's no off-switch, there's not a hell of a lot we can do ... oh, sure ... we could ignore a great many things that we might be able to do to benefit humanity and knock the temps down by a small fraction of a degree in the next century ... or, maybe the pendulum will swing back toward that new ice age and we'll REALLY have wasted our time and money since we'll now have to try to mitigate THAT problem ...

It might not be politically correct, but my vote goes to focus our resources on something that has at least a snowballs chance in hell of accomplishing something ...
delta1 Offline
#188 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 10,232
The difference between where the earth was 40 years ago and where we are now is the amount of CO2 that has been dispersed into the atmosphere in that period. Much more than has been measured occurring naturally in earth's past. The one major contributor to the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere is emissions from the combustion of fossil fuels which has accelerated in the past 40 years, as many countries modernized using that source of energy.

We should be focusing on CO2 removal technologies, which as stated above, is now very expensive...but the costs of adjusting to the consequences of climate change might be more expensive.

A Norwegian oil company, Statoil is giving it a go...

http://www.dw.com/en/removing-co2-from-the-atmosphere/a-18121685
ovid Offline
#189 Posted:
Joined: 01-24-2017
Posts: 140
I think you just uncovered an important truth.
Scientists disagree on just about everything
It's not the media making up fake news. It's the scientists in conflict and the media reports the latest findings.
DrafterX Offline
#190 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
Plant more trees. .. Mellow
frankj1 Offline
#191 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 15,652
DrafterX wrote:
they found evidence that white dudes are really from Mars... American Indians are the only true Earthlings.. Mellow

sweet for me! I'm a Member of the Tribe.
delta1 Offline
#192 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 10,232
Wasn't Lucy the original...from Africa?
DrafterX Offline
#193 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
Fake news.... Mellow
frankj1 Offline
#194 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 15,652
OK, maybe the Lost Tribes...
delta1 Offline
#195 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 10,232
Not Lucy?...OK...Snoopy...in MN...
DrafterX Offline
#196 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
Snoopy was prolly one of them Chippewas... Mellow
Brewha Offline
#197 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
ovid wrote:
I think you just uncovered an important truth.
Scientists disagree on just about everything
It's not the media making up fake news. It's the scientists in conflict and the media reports the latest findings.

A more in important truth I have learned is that the consistent mixing of fact and opinion in the media has lead to no one knowing what to think.

Take note that on this board, we have found no source that is considered believable or accurate on this subject. Even NOAA and NASA can't be trusted, not even the DOD (may be on to something with the last one).

I have also learned that when someone says "that's only a theory" that commonly means they do not possess a basic understanding of science.
Brewha Offline
#198 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 7,843
TMCTLT wrote:
Using this rational replace FOOD with cigarettes....my understanding is obesity related health issues now outstrip smoking related issues here in the US.

Now while I love me some FOOD....I do not abuse it and those who DO ultimately loose a good potion of " quality of life " in order to abuse it. Here in Indiana they're currently looking @ adding a $1.50 per pack tax on Cigs....while looking the other way when it comes to addressing obesity ( we are a leader in this health issue ) and it's cost to society and quality of life. I understand that is " seems " like these are completely different issues but in the end, does it NOT come down to how much health care dollars are being spent on smokers? I think the fact that WE ALL EAT FOOD probably distorts the conversation and will keep us from addressing it honestly. If we're gonna TARGET certain people or industries fine....but let's do it honestly. If your obese or morbidly obese....your Big Mac should cost you two or three times what the other guy pays etc.


https://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012/04/30/obesity-now-costs-americans-more-in-healthcare-costs-than-smoking/#54d888ac53d7

So what is your point?

We should think about the children?
DrafterX Offline
#199 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 74,680
Brewha. .!! Laugh
MACS Offline
#200 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 59,856
https://www.prageru.com/courses/environmental-science/paris-climate-agreement-wont-change-climate
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