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Last post 22 years ago by Todog. 16 replies replies.
Michael Jordan ll
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Todog Offline
#1 Posted: Fri, Jan 4 2002, 9:52 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
I while back, I posted that I was sick of Michael embarrassing himself. Well, he keeps proving me wrong! He may not fly like he used too but he's still better than 98.2 percent of all the other Michael wannabees in the NBA!
tailgater Offline
#2 Posted: Sat, Jan 5 2002, 6:23 AM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Michael has over-stayed his welcome. Had he not retired for the second time from the NBA, I would have much more respect for him. He is one of the greatest ever, but he is becoming a characature of himself. You either play or you don't play.
Todog Offline
#3 Posted: Sat, Jan 5 2002, 8:37 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
I don't know but 96 points on consecutive nights and a team that seems to be in playoff contention after winning just 19 games last year(16 already this year) would indicate that he is succeeding!
tailgater Offline
#4 Posted: Sun, Jan 6 2002, 6:49 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Stats don't mean anyting. Extrapolate that number to one game earlier and instead of 96 cumulative points in two consecutive games, you get 102 points in three games. Not bad, but not god-like.
Todog Offline
#5 Posted: Mon, Jan 7 2002, 8:33 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
Stats in the NBA or any other competitive pro sport are the only thing that which players are measured by. 96 points or 102 for that matter(34 ppg average) is still pretty good for a 38 year old player with no other support on his team that happens to be above .500 and is in contention.
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#6 Posted: Tue, Jan 8 2002, 4:15 AM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
tailgater: "Extrapolate" we will be watching you.
tailgater Offline
#7 Posted: Tue, Jan 8 2002, 2:19 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Rick: huh? Todog: Stats are only relevant when taken as a whole. Small tidbits mean NOTHING. If a guy hits back to back homers you aren't gonna expect him to hit all home runs for the rest of the season. And as far as your suggestion that Jordan is carrying this team, their won/loss percentage has Improved as Jordans numbers have decreased (at least in the ppg category). I don't suggest that MJ is untalented. Quite the opposite. But he is not the player he was with Chicago and he should stop retiring only to return. It is becoming obvious that he simply likes the media attention that surrounds him during his umpteenth "last game"...
Todog Offline
#8 Posted: Tue, Jan 8 2002, 2:42 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
I disagree! Mark McGwire is a perfect example! He is(was) recognized for hitting homeruns and that was the expectation every time he came to bat. People didn't care whether or not he was a pretty decent first-baseman or that his awesome overall statistics helped contribute to his team's success as a whole! You see Mark McGwire, you automatically think HOMERUN! Everyone had a heart attack because Jordan failed to score in double digits for the first time in 800 some games. That is what his play is measured by, how many points he scores. When he won the first of his Championships, everyone was enamored with the fact that he was the first guard to lead the league in scoring and win a title. Another example of statistical recognition! I just wish he was still in Chicago!LOL John
tailgater Offline
#9 Posted: Tue, Jan 8 2002, 3:22 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
I read your post and agree with every word of it. One question: What do you disagree with on my previous post? Stats do help define a player (for good or bad). My point is simply that statistics need to be taken in full context, not as a snapshot. Now if MJ could get Barkley out of retirement...
Todog Offline
#10 Posted: Tue, Jan 8 2002, 8:56 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
My point was that stats are rarily taken as a whole. Mark McGwire will only be remembered as a home-run hitter rather as a pretty complete player.
tailgater Offline
#11 Posted: Wed, Jan 9 2002, 5:58 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
That IS a whole statistic! His HR production, both in his record setting season and throughout his career has been phenominal. Had he simply hit a bunch of dingers for a two month span it would be insignificant. The other categories you mention are seperate items. And you have to admit that his HR output is the ONLY category that could earn him a trip to Cooperstown.
Todog Offline
#12 Posted: Wed, Jan 9 2002, 8:52 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
No! That is just one of many statistics to be measured by. You're the one who said that stats are only relevant as a whole! Babe Ruth is only remembered for the home-run! Many don't realize that he was also a great pitcher!
Todog Offline
#13 Posted: Wed, Jan 9 2002, 8:52 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
No! That is just one of many statistics to be measured by. You're the one who said that stats are only relevant as a whole! Babe Ruth is only remembered for the home-run! Many don't realize that he was also a great pitcher!
tailgater Offline
#14 Posted: Thu, Jan 10 2002, 7:29 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
You can dwell on the word choice all you want. My original comment was in response to the use of a TWO GAME output as a justification for greatness. Statistics are only significant as a whole, but that doesn't mean you have to include each and every CATEGORY for crying out loud. It's statistically accurate to log numbers from a single aspect of one's game. It is NOT accurate nor relavent to quote statistics from such a small segment, unless you are comparing it to other two game stretches. It is probably safe to say that MJ has the highest two game total this season. Big woop.
Todog Offline
#15 Posted: Fri, Jan 11 2002, 6:03 AM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
I never said his two game output was a justification for greatness. I thought it was pretty impressive for a 38 year old who has helped to improve his team! John
Todog Offline
#16 Posted: Fri, Jan 11 2002, 6:08 AM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
You said,"Statistics are only significant as a whole but that doesn't mean you have to include each and every category for crying out loud". This statement certainly seems to contradict itself! Doesn't "whole" mean to include "all"?
Todog Offline
#17 Posted: Fri, Jan 11 2002, 10:00 AM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
Again, I am not proud of the fact that he unretired AGAIN. It is amazing though, that at age 38, he is still able to put those kinds of numbers up and even more amazing that he has his team in contention. His team is winning with only one healthy player(Jordan) averaging double figures(stats not taken as a whole!) while Richard Hamilton and Christian Laettner are both out with injuries. That leaves Jordan with Popeye Jones, Chris Whitney, Hubert Davis and Brendan Haywood. Who the hell are these guys? You and I could pick three more stiffs off the street and compete with them!(LOL) It sure seems that Jordan is simply doing what he has always been successful at doing and that is proving his critics(myself included)WRONG! It is too bad that he cannot be as successful with his marriage as he is on the basketball court! John
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