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Last post 6 days ago by frankj1. 154 replies replies.
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Third party vote a wasted vote?
dstieger Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,129
For only the second time in over 30 years of voting, I'm seriously considering voting for a candiate that has no chance of even coming in second. I get the argument that it is a 'wasted vote'.....

But, until more voters willing to break, I don't know how we'll ever get fruitful discussion that moves us toward governing that's more independent of the big party machines.
kombat96 Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 04-12-2010
Posts: 9,330
I agree with the statement of a wasted vote. If u didn't vote against Obama then u voted for him with ur casting of a third party vote. Lesser of two evils. Have to choose. My opinion. But I respect anyone's choice on how or whom they vote for.
ZRX1200 Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 49,224
With voter fraud, nobody's vote matters.
bloody spaniard Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
I feel the same ambivalence, dstieger.
Problem is I have little faith in the voting public due to their track record of late. IMHO, the middle class's back is broken & they put pocket book issues over principles. So even though principled "constitutionalists" may be elected in local elections, the big stage is reserved for the status quo which is turning us into a dependent class.
DrafterX Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 88,677
Nothing really matters..
Anyone can see..
Nothing really matters - nothing really matters to me...

Anyway the wind blows... Whistle Whistle
tailgater Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 23,262
I think the ballots should eliminate the reference to party affiliation.
This would stop the bozo's from BOTH sides voting party over person, or at least it would make it more difficult.

If you know the person and their platform, then vote with confidence.
Otherwise, leave it blank.



HockeyDad Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 37,855
For Federal elections, the ballot should state how much Federal funds each voter should expect from each candidate based on income demographic so they can make the educated decision. An organization like the CBO could do the dollar estimates.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 47,729
dstieger wrote:
For only the second time in over 30 years of voting, I'm seriously considering voting for a candiate that has no chance of even coming in second. I get the argument that it is a 'wasted vote'.....

But, until more voters willing to break, I don't know how we'll ever get fruitful discussion that moves us toward governing that's more independent of the big party machines.



It's not a wasted vote.

You did your duty and voted.


WGAF if people tell you it's a wasted vote...this isn't a popularity contest.
Buckwheat Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 04-15-2004
Posts: 11,669
I think that all politics should start at the local level. I don't think that voting for a third party candidate in a local election is a wasted vote. Until a third party has a base in local government it will never be able to compete with the "dumb and dumber" parties that we currently have.

I always liked the saying; 'It's not who votes that counts but who counts the votes."
dstieger Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,129
DrMaddVibe wrote:
It's not a wasted vote.

You did your duty and voted.


WGAF if people tell you it's a wasted vote...this isn't a popularity contest.



I don't GAF what people say. The only cogent argument against voting third party, if that's your preference, is that it would be better to vote the lesser of the two actually viable evils.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 47,729
The R's and D's have effectively shown ANYONE now that they're both in on the swindle.

They just want power. They're both going to do the same thing with it.

Might as well vote 3rd party...or just adopt a plan where if they're in you vote against them no matter what party they're in. The lunacy that people put in the "party" is obvious. Their eyes appear glazed and rolled back in their heads...they don't act rational, have to carry the water no matter what issue they're morally against...if they have the "right" letter after their name...they can do no wrong...even when they're stone cold busted in the middle of a sex scandal...honey badger don't care...do what you have to do to drain the swamp. One thing is for certain now. We cannot trust them to police themselves or do their damned job.
TheSmokensip Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 03-02-2013
Posts: 1,328
I think i may vote 3rd party myself.
So sick of the Dems and Reps same sh*t over and over.
There has to be something better than this. Right?
victor809 Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 18,372
On could make the argument that any vote, given the options provided, is a wasted vote. You're choosing whether the lube they use while pounding you in the butt is silicon or water based.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 47,729
victor809 wrote:
On could make the argument that any vote, given the options provided, is a wasted vote. You're choosing whether the lube they use while pounding you in the butt is silicon or water based.



Georgetown Voting Outrage!!!!
victor809 Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 18,372
Oh be quiet you sad little man. Go sit in your van down by the river.


...or did you not get that back?
DrMaddVibe Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 47,729
victor809 wrote:
Oh be quiet you sad little man. Go sit in your van down by the river.


...or did you not get that back?



Lighten up Francis.

YOU'RE the one bringing lube to a polling station!
ZRX1200 Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 49,224
I agree with Victor and buckwheat on the same thread........buying a loto ticket tonight.
bloody spaniard Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
Question: What to do about current state of sorry political affairs
Answer: Vote third party & sweep out fossilized, self serving dinosaurs
Problem: Libertarian- minded Republicans more prone to doing so than mainstream Democrats who tend to be somewhat Progressive & stay the line within the party. Reagan(R) being the exception. He actually swayed normally loyal Democrats to vote for him.
Example: Note Cuccinelli (R) vs. McCauliffe (D) race in Virginia- third party Libertarian candidate drawing votes from Republican bloc, thus almost assuring Democrat upset victory due to split vote on 11/5/13. It can be argued that Perot did same to Bush Sr. AND Dole allowing Slick to waltz in both times. Exception being Ralph Nader's Green Party vote in Florida which may have had some deleterious effect on Ozone Gore's Democrat margin by sapping liberal votes & enabling the affable buffoon Bush jr. to prevail.
DadZilla3 Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 01-17-2009
Posts: 4,633
"You know, comrades, that I think in regard to this: I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this - who will count the votes, and how." - Joseph Stalin
victor809 Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 18,372
Diebold.
Diebold counts the votes.
ZRX1200 Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 49,224
Lord Diebold!!!
HockeyDad Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 37,855
victor809 wrote:
Diebold.
Diebold counts the votes.


Supervisors of Elections count the votes in each county.
calavera Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 01-26-2002
Posts: 1,856
I find that my beliefs lie pretty much in line with the Libertarian party. I voted for Libertarian candidates in the last big election, and will vote for them again in the next election. Unless either the Dems or Republicans come up with a candidate that runs on a platform that is even closer to my belief structure. Then I will vote for that candidate.

Voting for Romney just because he was not Obama was too big of a load of Shiite to even think about falling for it. I would vote for the National Socialist candidate before I voted for either of those ass clowns.

All the crap going down now is not my fault. I voted for the other guys. Enjoy what you voted for. If you supported Obama, hopefully your insurance policy just got cancelled and your doctor dropped out of the network. Enjoy, stooges.




J
Gene363 Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 24,065
calavera wrote:
I find that my beliefs lie pretty much in line with the Libertarian party. I voted for Libertarian candidates in the last big election, and will vote for them again in the next election. Unless either the Dems or Republicans come up with a candidate that runs on a platform that is even closer to my belief structure. Then I will vote for that candidate.

Voting for Romney just because he was not Obama was too big of a load of Shiite to even think about falling for it. I would vote for the National Socialist candidate before I voted for either of those ass clowns.

All the crap going down now is not my fault. I voted for the other guys. Enjoy what you voted for. If you supported Obama, hopefully your insurance policy just got cancelled and your doctor dropped out of the network. Enjoy, stooges.




J


+1
wheelrite Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 11-01-2006
Posts: 50,119
HockeyDad wrote:
Supervisors of Elections count the votes in each county.


you mean ACORN,,,
HockeyDad Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 37,855
wheelrite wrote:
you mean ACORN,,,



ACORN is dead and they didn't count the votes.
8trackdisco Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 11-06-2004
Posts: 50,723
dstieger wrote:
For only the second time in over 30 years of voting, I'm seriously considering voting for a candiate that has no chance of even coming in second. I get the argument that it is a 'wasted vote'.....

But, until more voters willing to break, I don't know how we'll ever get fruitful discussion that moves us toward governing that's more independent of the big party machines.


Have only voted for one major party presidential candidate since 1988.

Libertarian and Independent ever since.

You have to put your money where your mouth is.
bloody spaniard Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
The Democrats will always come out on top as long as the Republicans and Libertarians continue to cannibalize one another.
Only way to upend that apple cart is if a black and/or latino party is formed and a black/latino combo with a black latino candidate fugetaboutit. The Democrats would then splinter & reel into anonymity.

Until then, pipe dreams aside, expect Hillary and the Democrats to win in 2016.Beer
DrafterX Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 88,677
I heard Hillary was the anti-Christ... Mellow
bloody spaniard Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
DrafterX wrote:
I heard Hillary was the anti-Christ... Mellow

You voting for her then?Gonz
DrafterX Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 88,677
no way man..... Not talking Not talking

but if God can have a trinity why not the anti-christ..?? Think
bloody spaniard Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
I think the antiChrist will be a charismatic man w/balls pretending to be a savior. Hillary's only part way there IMHO. She's more of a whiny, slimy, slithering poser.
DrafterX Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 88,677
prolly a good the bad and the ugly scenario.... Think
stogiemonger Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 06-25-2009
Posts: 4,183
There are only two scenarios that I would consider voting for a third party candidate, as not to waste my vote.

1.) If the election looked to be a landslide for one candidate, and my vote had no chance of swaying the outcome.

or

2.) If the third party candidate actually had a chance to win.


Given how the electoral college system works, I would not have thrown away my vote for a third party candidate in my state (Louisiana) this last presidential election, had I done so.
dstieger Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,129
Would it change your answer if you knew that the 3rd party candidate has no chance of winning, BUT, if he receives 10% of the vote, his third party would achieve 'major party' status on state ballots for the next several years? I know of no better way to begin the challenge to the two parties we're currently stuck with.
HockeyDad Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 37,855
Republicans and Democrats have strong bipartisan support for the destruction of any 3rd party. There will never be a viable 3rd party until after the financial collapse of the USA.
dstieger Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,129
So glad I frequent this place. I think it was Anita Bryant who said "A day without HD and Charm is like a day without sunshine." Or, was it Debby Boone?
DrafterX Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 88,677
CROS used to say that too.... Sad
ZRX1200 Offline
#39 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 49,224
CROS vote in Somalia?


Or did he run under the "No Legs" party?
DadZilla3 Offline
#40 Posted:
Joined: 01-17-2009
Posts: 4,633
HockeyDad wrote:
Republicans and Democrats have strong bipartisan support for the destruction of any 3rd party. There will never be a viable 3rd party until after the financial collapse of the USA.

Possibly. But consider this...when (not if) the financial collapse happens, the cooperation between the Democrats and Republicans will disappear and since liberal apologists have almost complete control of the mainstream media, any blame for the collapse will be spun beyond recognition in the general direction of the Republicans. That being accomplished, the Democrats will then position themselves as the party who will 'save' the nation from the greedy rich Republicans and the third party political movements.
DrafterX Offline
#41 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 88,677
ZRX1200 wrote:
CROS vote in Somalia?


Or did he run under the "No Legs" party?



you wouldn't say that if CROS had legs... Shame on you
HockeyDad Offline
#42 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 37,855
DadZilla3 wrote:
Possibly. But consider this...when (not if) the financial collapse happens, the cooperation between the Democrats and Republicans will disappear and since liberal apologists have almost complete control of the mainstream media, any blame for the collapse will be spun beyond recognition in the general direction of the Republicans. That being accomplished, the Democrats will then position themselves as the party who will 'save' the nation from the greedy rich Republicans and the third party political movements.



The first step will be to crush corporations, the rich and upper class. Then it will spill over into the middle class. The Democrats are the only party that can lead that effort.

The problem is they can't cut spending for entitlements, can't squeeze the rich and upper class enough to cover the gaps, and corporations just eliminate jobs and close down. At that point the Democrats fail and give rise to a new 3rd party. History tends to point towards that party being totalitarian in nature.
stogiemonger Offline
#43 Posted:
Joined: 06-25-2009
Posts: 4,183
dstieger wrote:
Would it change your answer if you knew that the 3rd party candidate has no chance of winning, BUT, if he receives 10% of the vote, his third party would achieve 'major party' status on state ballots for the next several years? I know of no better way to begin the challenge to the two parties we're currently stuck with.


In a close election, this alone would not change my vote, but, I would likely struggle with the decision a bit more.

bloody spaniard Offline
#44 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
As I stated above, you want to defeat your political enemy? You divide and conquer.
Not simply vote third party. I feel that just weakens your side.

A stronger version of the Green party (or similar) will weaken the Democrats and make them more vulnerable.
Same thing with the Libertarian and Republican side. Otherwise just wash, condition, rinse & F yourselves voting 3rd party repeatedly for best results.

We are stuck with the Big Business Whigs vs the Eco Race Baiters. Accept it or start a third party option for the opposing side. Then you can weaken and defeat them & then replace with your version of argyle socks.
teedubbya Offline
#45 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 85,243
The best part of voting third party is you can ALWAYS bitch about the person that actually won.
teedubbya Offline
#46 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 85,243
The best part of voting third party is you can ALWAYS bitch about the person that actually won.
teedubbya Offline
#47 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 85,243
You can say that again. Can I get an AMEN?
DrafterX Offline
#48 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 88,677
Pray
bloody spaniard Offline
#49 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
LMAO! Well looks like you got Drafter's amen! Here's mine- Dancing . (I attend Ebeneezer's Ebonic Church of Ecstasy)
DadZilla3 Offline
#50 Posted:
Joined: 01-17-2009
Posts: 4,633
HockeyDad wrote:
The first step will be to crush corporations, the rich and upper class. Then it will spill over into the middle class. The Democrats are the only party that can lead that effort.

The problem is they can't cut spending for entitlements, can't squeeze the rich and upper class enough to cover the gaps, and corporations just eliminate jobs and close down. At that point the Democrats fail and give rise to a new 3rd party. History tends to point towards that party being totalitarian in nature.

My take is, the Democrats will be able to spin themselves out of any economic predicament. Hell, they pretty much do that already. When the economic crash happens (or more accurately, when it continues to spiral irreversibly downward to the unavoidable crash), the Republicans will be convincingly blamed no matter how transparently false the 'facts' are, and end up politically marginalized. Or in FEMA camps. At that point the Democrats will have survived by morphing into the totalitarian party in charge.

We agree that the end game could conceivably be a police state run by the surviving totalitarian political machine. We just differ in the details of who all will be running the reeducation camps, and who all will be digging the latrines.
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