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Voter fraud
victor809 Offline
#51 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Mattie... What's wrong with my post? Seems kinda on par with most of this board?
DrafterX Offline
#52 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,506
I think we could offer them free IDs, transportation to go get it, an Obama-phone and free Obama-nets and someone would argue that we're infringing on their right to vote... they don't want an error free voting booth.. even tho it's not a problem... Mellow
victor809 Offline
#53 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Tail.... None of it is that easy.

Heck, I just moved. I'm employed, have more money than time. Even after a few weeks, I still haven't had the time to figure out what I need to do to get my polling place changed to my new address. Heck, I've got to go to the DMV to get my vehicle registration changed to the new address so I can park on the street without being ticketed and I simply haven't been able to find the time. And I'm supposed to be in the class of people who have flexible schedules and arent negatively impacted by these things. I imagine someone who can't afford to take a few hours from work, or who's work won't allow them to do that might have trouble.

Life is hard all around, I know. And I don't really care about any of the people you want to make life harder for. I just don't see the point in enacting more regulations to fix something that isn't broken. Unless there are other reasons for doing this....
teedubbya Offline
#54 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Not everyone flys. You'd be suprised how many never have. People with resources fly.

Not everyone buys booze and it is possible to buy without an id. I show my teets.

A passport IS a government ID suitable for voting purposes. I just got my first one recently. Never had the need.

Not everyone has kids and if those not all use day care and all of the day cares require ID.

Shrug. There are folks without IDs. I know some. Whether they should or not is another issue. But they don't. They just don't.
teedubbya Offline
#55 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I don't feel strongly about it and don't really care if the poor, elderly or students can vote easily or not. I'm just not much for new laws or requirements just because it feels good. If a problem is presented and it's worthy of a solution I'm in.

I've not seen a problem proven. Just a solution.
teedubbya Offline
#56 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
By the way neither of my grandmothers had a valid ID for the last 20 or more years of their lives.
DrafterX Offline
#57 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,506
Had it been required to vote would you have assisted them in getting one..?? Huh
dstieger Offline
#58 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
https://www.co.sauk.wi.us/adrcpage/driver-license-and-voter-id-locations

Driver License and Voter Id Locations
Sauk County DMV Locations
Sauk City Service Center - Driver License/ID Renewal Office
Community Center
730 Monroe St
Sauk City, WI 53583

Hours: 8:00 am - 4:15 pm - Fifth Wednesday of any month
teedubbya Offline
#59 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Drafter I'm sure someone would have. I wouldn't have. Not enough time with them unfortunately and the time spent was usually weekends or off hours.

I'm ok with id requirements, I'm just not all that fired up about it given how small the issue is. I'm thinking the leaders that whoop this up may have agenda. Wonder what it is?
tailgater Offline
#60 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
Tail.... None of it is that easy.

Heck, I just moved. I'm employed, have more money than time. Even after a few weeks, I still haven't had the time to figure out what I need to do to get my polling place changed to my new address. Heck, I've got to go to the DMV to get my vehicle registration changed to the new address so I can park on the street without being ticketed and I simply haven't been able to find the time. And I'm supposed to be in the class of people who have flexible schedules and arent negatively impacted by these things. I imagine someone who can't afford to take a few hours from work, or who's work won't allow them to do that might have trouble.

Life is hard all around, I know. And I don't really care about any of the people you want to make life harder for. I just don't see the point in enacting more regulations to fix something that isn't broken. Unless there are other reasons for doing this....


How much would it have cost you if you DIDN'T move?



Thought so.




victor809 Offline
#61 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Tail, my point was it isn't just cost, it's time. As a childless professional I should have plenty of time to do this. If I'm having trouble finding the time to do something like this, then I'm sure there are people in much worse circumstances than me who simply will deprioritize it... So voter ID laws would probably keep them from voting.

I don't care about those people. They are poor, probably have children who are sticky, and probably smell. But I do question why people are so eager to make things more difficult for them to vote when I don't see the lack of regulation actually impacting anything.
DrafterX Offline
#62 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,506
Presidential elections are every 4 years... If a person can't make it happen in 4 years then sorry... Not talking
tailgater Offline
#63 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
Tail, my point was it isn't just cost, it's time. As a childless professional I should have plenty of time to do this. If I'm having trouble finding the time to do something like this, then I'm sure there are people in much worse circumstances than me who simply will deprioritize it... So voter ID laws would probably keep them from voting.

I don't care about those people. They are poor, probably have children who are sticky, and probably smell. But I do question why people are so eager to make things more difficult for them to vote when I don't see the lack of regulation actually impacting anything.


I understand and share in your apathy towards this subject. You won't see me calling my congressman nor chaining myself to a voting booth. But a simple policy requiring an ID is no more restrictive than making the voter go to the poll. Perhaps even less so.
In my town, you're checked off from an address list. What if someone didn't have an address?
There will always be the "woe is me" sob story about the ID-less mother of 12.
Let's face it: the only time those people vote is when somebody else is doing it for them.
Speyside Offline
#64 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
I think this subject is news worthy only because the right and the left report on it. I have never heard of a state being won due to voting fraud.
jjanecka Offline
#65 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
I still believe that if you're not a tax payer then you ought not have a say federally.
DrafterX Offline
#66 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,506
let's restrict it to land owners if we're gonna change it up... just sayin... Mellow
dstieger Offline
#67 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
jjanecka wrote:
I still believe that if you're not a tax payer then you ought not have a say federally.

My adult son at college won't pay taxes this year....but I firmly believe that he can and should vote..federally and locally
jjanecka Offline
#68 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
Well yeah I agree, he should vote if he's got the right. I'm just opposed not non-taxpayers having the right to vote. Really any group that is being subsidized by the government should not be allowed to vote.

The same goes for medicinal marijuana smokers.
DrafterX Offline
#69 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,506
what about the regular illegal ones..?? Huh
jjanecka Offline
#70 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
Can only stop the ones we know about...
dstieger Offline
#71 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
jjanecka wrote:
Well yeah I agree, he should vote if he's got the right. I'm just opposed not non-taxpayers having the right to vote. Really any group that is being subsidized by the government should not be allowed to vote.

The same goes for medicinal marijuana smokers.



More of my family there...not the MJ part...the leech part....my sister lives in subsidized housing - disabled enough that she can't get or keep a job...not for not trying, though; she gets food stamps and is fighting to get disability related social security support --- she's a bit mental...and something of a drain on society...but I do think she should be able to vote...not that she'd bother paying for a ride to the DMV for the luxury of paying $28 she doesn't have for a photo ID to vote in an election that she doesn't care about...but I'll support her right to do so if she wants to
banderl Offline
#72 Posted:
Joined: 09-09-2008
Posts: 10,153
Abrignac wrote:
Let's see if you're able to shake the hook from the corner of your mouth. The second amandmemt guarantees the right to bear a firearm. Good luck trying to "legally" buy one without an ID.

Thanks for making my point for me.



So you are saying that the second amendment is mundane?
Do you know what mundane means?
opelmanta1900 Offline
#73 Posted:
Joined: 01-10-2012
Posts: 13,954
jjanecka wrote:
Well yeah I agree, he should vote if he's got the right. I'm just opposed not non-taxpayers having the right to vote. Really any group that is being subsidized by the government should not be allowed to vote.

The same goes for medicinal marijuana smokers.

How about we just make it illegal for everyone who doesn't think and act exactly like you to vote...


DrafterX Offline
#74 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,506
Laugh
tailgater Offline
#75 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Speyside wrote:
I think this subject is news worthy only because the right and the left report on it. I have never heard of a state being won due to voting fraud.


Richard M. Nixon would disagree.
Google Daley 1960.
Covfireman Offline
#76 Posted:
Joined: 09-03-2015
Posts: 809
tailgater wrote:
How much would it have cost you if you DIDN'T move?



$72 in Virginia i mine hadn't expired add 20 for a birth certificate, they won't accept alternate photo ID , I had a valid twic card , I was out of the country when it expired.


tailgater wrote:

Thought so.


I lol at you thinking , I know it's hard for you . Lol Sarcasm

I'm for less government the same thing most of the GOP say they want until it's some bullpoop were they want to screw the less fortunate.

My great uncle quit driving due to his age he didn't need I'd for anything else his SS checks , pension and dividend checks were automatically deposited to his accounts , he wote checks for bills or had them on autopay groceries were cash no I'd needed. Voter ID passed he had to get a new ID to vote . He had significant trouble proving he was born lol . I think they finally took his discharge papers . His cost was only 52 virginia real ID and 20 Virginia department of vital records ( for a letter stating he had no certified birth certificate on record) . It took him and my stepfather hours of time to collect the records required of him . He was lucky we lived in an area that has a DMV .






Buckwheat Offline
#77 Posted:
Joined: 04-15-2004
Posts: 12,251
DrafterX wrote:
I don't get why it's such a big deal to present an ID... If you're not smart enough to find a way to get one then maybe you shouldn't be voting... Mellow


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbxZXmF6qtQ

Sarcasm
Speyside Offline
#78 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
Interesting, before my time. I stand corrected.
jjanecka Offline
#79 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
opelmanta1900 wrote:
How about we just make it illegal for everyone who doesn't think and act exactly like you to vote...



That's the spirit! Now you understand what it is to be either a democrat or republican.

What if I told you that only citizens shoulf have the right to own land?
opelmanta1900 Offline
#80 Posted:
Joined: 01-10-2012
Posts: 13,954
I would say only rights should have the land to own citizens...
Buckwheat Offline
#81 Posted:
Joined: 04-15-2004
Posts: 12,251
teedubbya wrote:
By the way neither of my grandmothers had a valid ID for the last 20 or more years of their lives.


I knew a person in West Virginia that was 100% off the grid. No birth certificate, no driver's license, no SSN, no driver's license. Never paid taxes or one dime to the government. No form of ID besides his name. When I meet him he just went by Barry. He was born at home about 75 years ago in the deep woods of West Virginia and lived in a small "cabin" with no running water or electricity. He came to Louisville, KY about 40 years ago and got nervous because of all the people and just split. I don't believe he gave two chits about voting. I've not heard if he is even still alive. So people are out there that will never have any form of ID. I think it's getting a lot rarer these days. fog
Covfireman Offline
#82 Posted:
Joined: 09-03-2015
Posts: 809
jjanecka wrote:
What if I told you that only citizens shoulf have the right to own land?



Mexico has that for any territory within 50 miles of the coast . Non citizens get by it by doing a long term lease 100 years used to be the norm .
dstieger Offline
#83 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
jjanecka wrote:
That's the spirit! Now you understand what it is to be either a democrat or republican.

What if I told you that only citizens shoulf have the right to own land?



That was the case in the Philippines, also....fortunately....it gave me some leverage to talk my ex wife out of what would have been a lousy investment in a fish farm


Let's say we let those without photo ID vote, but just count their votes as 3/5 of a single ID-vote.
Speyside Offline
#84 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
I would prefer 6/10.
opelmanta1900 Offline
#85 Posted:
Joined: 01-10-2012
Posts: 13,954
Buckwheat wrote:
I knew a person in West Virginia that was 100% off the grid. No birth certificate, no driver's license, no SSN, no driver's license. Never paid taxes or one dime to the government. No form of ID besides his name. When I meet him he just went by Barry. He was born at home about 75 years ago in the deep woods of West Virginia and lived in a small "cabin" with no running water or electricity. He came to Louisville, KY about 40 years ago and got nervous because of all the people and just split. I don't believe he gave two chits about voting. I've not heard if he is even still alive. So people are out there that will never have any form of ID. I think it's getting a lot rarer these days. fog

You could probably find him on Facebook...
Brewha Offline
#86 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,143
Mattie B wrote:
Brewha.

There is absolutely no cost for the individual to attain a valid ID. Zip. Zilch. Nada. Nothing.

Not even the price of fuel. It's a free ride.


Nice try at an argument though.

What else ya got?


I guess in the Sip, time is not money.

I will say this though - you guys down there sure like to give away free stuff.
An here I though it was a red state....
Covfireman Offline
#87 Posted:
Joined: 09-03-2015
Posts: 809
dstieger wrote:
That was the case in the Philippines, also....fortunately....it gave me some leverage to talk my ex wife out of what would have been a lousy investment in a fish farm


Let's say we let those without photo ID vote, but just count their votes as 3/5 of a single ID-vote.



Or better yet let's restrictions t it by race and religion .
opelmanta1900 Offline
#88 Posted:
Joined: 01-10-2012
Posts: 13,954
Covfireman wrote:
Or better yet let's restrictions t it by race and religion .


Don't put restrictions on t its...
Mattie B Offline
#89 Posted:
Joined: 12-12-2005
Posts: 6,350
Brewha

For most, time is money. (Wish I got paid for my time here)

However, if you don't have an ID, vehicle or money....I'm thinking you have lots of free time.

I hardly think of a free ID as an entitlement.
jjanecka Offline
#90 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
Yeah no tit restrictions even if they're lopsided...
Mattie B Offline
#91 Posted:
Joined: 12-12-2005
Posts: 6,350
Victor.

I always thought of you as above par. Maybe I should lower my expectations, but I'm not.

Be a better you buddy. It's not hard. Remember, I've been praying for you specifically. You have help
jjanecka Offline
#92 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
Mattie B wrote:
Brewha

For most, time is money. (Wish I got paid for my time here)

However, if you don't have an ID, vehicle or money....I'm thinking you have lots of free time.

I hardly think of a free ID as an entitlement.



What a great idea. Tie up people's time at work so they have no ability to vote shoulda thought that one up sooner!
Brewha Offline
#93 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,143
Mattie B wrote:
Brewha

For most, time is money. (Wish I got paid for my time here)

However, if you don't have an ID, vehicle or money....I'm thinking you have lots of free time.

I hardly think of a free ID as an entitlement.

The thought of an 80 year old having to spend the day on busses and at the DMV purely "protect" us from the fallacy of voter fraud is heinous. And at full cost to the taxpayer.

These law are designed to discourage voting by the poor, disenfranchised and elderly. And when people sell it as benefit they to it because they know how many people will turn a blind eye to the facts.....

This is a bad and unamerican thing.
- even in the Sip.
Mattie B Offline
#94 Posted:
Joined: 12-12-2005
Posts: 6,350
I'm going to cut some slack since you know not of what you speak.

This is from the Sec of States page

HOW CAN I GET A MISSISSIPPI VOTER ID CARD?

It is EASY and FREE! All Mississippi Circuit Clerks are authorized to issue Mississippi Voter Identification Cards to all Mississippi registered voters who do not have any of the other acceptable forms of photo ID.
See the list of clerk's offices.
You must first be a registered voter in Mississippi. Download a voter registration form.
Go to any Circuit Clerk's Office during regular business hours. (Monday through Friday from 8:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m.) If you need a ride, call 1-844-MSVOTER (1-844-678-6837).
Present ONE form of acceptable identification. Check the list of acceptable documents.
If you do not have any of the identification documents listed, the clerk may verify birth information free of charge if you provide your date of birth, the state where you were born, and your mother's maiden name.
Complete and sign a Voter ID Application. Assistance will be provided, if requested.
View a sample application form.
Have your picture taken at the Circuit Clerk's Office.
Your Voter ID card will be mailed to you.
If the next election is within 45 days, you will receive a receipt for your Mississippi Voter Identification Card from the Circuit Clerk. The receipt may be used as your photo ID when voting at the polls.






I've been to the circuit clerks office many times. I've never waited in line longer than I've waited to vote.
banderl Offline
#95 Posted:
Joined: 09-09-2008
Posts: 10,153
tailgater wrote:
Richard M. Nixon would disagree.
Google Daley 1960.



Never proven.
Brewha Offline
#96 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,143
Mattie B wrote:
I'm going to cut some slack since you know not of what you speak.

This is from the Sec of States page

HOW CAN I GET A MISSISSIPPI VOTER ID CARD?

It is EASY and FREE! All Mississippi Circuit Clerks are authorized to issue Mississippi Voter Identification Cards to all Mississippi registered voters who do not have any of the other acceptable forms of photo ID.
See the list of clerk's offices.
You must first be a registered voter in Mississippi. Download a voter registration form.
Go to any Circuit Clerk's Office during regular business hours. (Monday through Friday from 8:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m.) If you need a ride, call 1-844-MSVOTER (1-844-678-6837).
Present ONE form of acceptable identification. Check the list of acceptable documents.
If you do not have any of the identification documents listed, the clerk may verify birth information free of charge if you provide your date of birth, the state where you were born, and your mother's maiden name.
Complete and sign a Voter ID Application. Assistance will be provided, if requested.
View a sample application form.
Have your picture taken at the Circuit Clerk's Office.
Your Voter ID card will be mailed to you.
If the next election is within 45 days, you will receive a receipt for your Mississippi Voter Identification Card from the Circuit Clerk. The receipt may be used as your photo ID when voting at the polls.






I've been to the circuit clerks office many times. I've never waited in line longer than I've waited to vote.


Oh, I went to the sates web site - and saw that text exactly before I responded, so save your slack.

But you go right on pretending this is the right thing. And when your 80 - you spend the day on the free bus and at the DMV so you can vote.
opelmanta1900 Offline
#97 Posted:
Joined: 01-10-2012
Posts: 13,954
there are probably less ID-less 80 year olds who want to vote but don't have the time, money, or ability to obtain an ID than there are instances of alleged voter fraud each election cycle... just my guess...
frankj1 Offline
#98 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,211
opelmanta1900 wrote:
there are probably less ID-less 80 year olds who want to vote but don't have the time, money, or ability to obtain an ID than there are instances of alleged voter fraud each election cycle... just my guess...

if you are right, the split is something like 38 to 46.

non issue. easy to get id's or not, it's a non issue.

let's get officials who want to solve the budget instead.
tailgater Offline
#99 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Brewha wrote:
The thought of an 80 year old having to spend the day on busses and at the DMV purely "protect" us from the fallacy of voter fraud is heinous. And at full cost to the taxpayer.

These law are designed to discourage voting by the poor, disenfranchised and elderly. And when people sell it as benefit they to it because they know how many people will turn a blind eye to the facts.....

.


Alarmist freak.

Just sayin'
tailgater Offline
#100 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
And the fact that Daley rigged the Chicago polls to propel Kennedy to the white house proves that voter fraud is a non-issue.


Wait.



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