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Last post 6 years ago by DrafterX. 84 replies replies.
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Cuba
teedubbya Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Come on man....wtf. I was planning a trip. Bassard.
frankj1 Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
I am greatly disappointed. I really was hoping to get there soon after the accommodations were modernized.
Short flight, beaches must be sweet, food, rum, cigars, music...I blame Trump. For Real!
teedubbya Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I was planning 2 trips. Europe in October, Cuba in the spring.
teedubbya Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Wtf. To quote Drafter thanks a lot Trump.
frankj1 Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
Russian money influence?
deadeyedick Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 03-13-2003
Posts: 17,089
Prices have skyrocketed for most everything in Cuba.

Thanks Obama.
frankj1 Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
but when prices were low, I couldn't go...
maybe wouldn't go is more accurate.
MACS Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,776
Our embargo hasn't hurt Cuba... just the people.

Just scrap it already. Probably the only thing Obama did that I agreed with was attempt to get us back to normal relations with them.
bgz Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
Ya, I agree with DED, thanks Obama.
frankj1 Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
I agree wif MACS
tailgater Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Just so I understand:

Now Trump is a big meany because he doesn't want to support a corrupt communist dictator?

This all gets so confusing.


DrafterX Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
I thought cruise ships were still allowed... I'll have to look into it... Was hoping to go in December... Mellow
tailgater Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
I read that commercial flights were not affected with Trump's new stance, so cruise ships are probably OK.

DrafterX Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
Think
So, how else would you get there..?? Huh
jjanecka Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
I really could care less, wasn't planning on going anyway and if I did I would still have the ability to go unhindered without issues. We can still get our full amount of cigars from places outside the US and that's really all that matters.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,431
MACS wrote:
Our embargo hasn't hurt Cuba... just the people.

Just scrap it already. Probably the only thing Obama did that I agreed with was attempt to get us back to normal relations with them.


+2
teedubbya Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Tail actually I'm confused. He's been supporting corrupt self described murderous dictators and now he is appalled by one that isn't in Duarte's league? You see timeline wise it's in reverse.

But you are right. Once again you should ignore his words (those are just to stroke the trump lovers). His actions as usual do not line up with his words. I'll learn to completely ignore his words at some point. It's the new black!
DrafterX Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
Think
Can you still go in on a hot air balloon..
?? Huh
opelmanta1900 Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 01-10-2012
Posts: 13,954
MACS wrote:
Our embargo hasn't hurt Cuba... just the people.

Just scrap it already. Probably the only thing Obama did that I agreed with was attempt to get us back to normal relations with them.

I used to think lifting the embargo was a great thing... then I heard a lot of Cuban Americans describe why they are very against it... i don't really have an opinion on it one way or another, other than to say that lifting the embargo probably didn't really help the people either, just cuba... and that's kind of the problem with the whole island... nothing is allowed to benefit the people until it greatly benefits the government first...

At least with the embargo in place the US has some leverage against the regime...
frankj1 Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
60 years and it didn't push them toward a freer society.
But a taste of our lifestyle might open some eyes and motivate the population to do more than just have their super talented escape to the US for huge contracts.
frankj1 Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
tailgater wrote:
Just so I understand:

Now Trump is a big meany because he doesn't want to support a corrupt communist dictator?

This all gets so confusing.



I thought he did support Putin...
or was it Fat Boy N Korea he admired?

Now we're both confused.
delta1 Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,788
Trump's decision is motivated by his own business interests. He explored (illegally) building a resort in Cuba a few years ago and was rebuffed, so this is payback...

...all the dictators he's praised and cozied up to as President are running countries he's doing business in. When all the entanglements are finally revealed at the conclusion of the Russian thing, we'll know that the reason Trump has been so dismissive and obstructive is that he has a spreadsheet full of financial entanglements with the Russian govt/KGB banks...the GOP House and Trump's supporters won't care and won't impeach...

...what was Nixon's most famous line?
teedubbya Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
And Duarte. I think the only one is the new old Castro.

The embargo hasn't worked in terms of leverage. Let's just get rid of it.

And for the record I don't care if Trump luffas pol pott's stretch marks. It's just humorous to watch him pick and choose and to watch his supporters luffa his stretch marks.
teedubbya Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
23 for 21
frankj1 Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
Delta-

yup, financial entanglements, not election tampering...everyone in his circle.
teedubbya Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
He has no financial dealings with Russia. He said so. And according to folks in here if you don't already have the results of the investigation at the beginning there is no reason for an investigation

And stuff
DrafterX Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
That's what Hillary said.. a nothing-burger she called it I think... Mellow
teedubbya Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
And it's amazing how many people didn't believe that then but do now Mellow
DrafterX Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
Many still believe it was a nothing-burger.. then and now... Mellow
frankj1 Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
KOOOBAH
xibbumbero Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2002
Posts: 12,535
Just trump undoing everything Obama and sucking up to Miami Cuban's. X Frying pan
Gene363 Online
#32 Posted:
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,815
Meh, I don't think we should give a crap about Cuba one way or another. The more attention we pay to despots like the Castro clan or the bowl cut bass-turd on the other side of the world, the more important they become... to themselves.
teedubbya Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Embargo is paying attention to them.
frankj1 Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
what would Putin prefer?
DrafterX Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
Embargo ON..!! Mad
rfenst Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,323
frankj1 wrote:
what would Putin prefer?


An open military base on Cuba, or something like that.
DrafterX Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
I heard Obama tried to sell him one... Mellow
frankj1 Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
I heard Hillary tried to give him one
DrafterX Offline
#39 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
I heard she gives a mean one... Mellow
tailgater Offline
#40 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
We can make jokes about Putin and whoever.
But Cuba is controlled by a dictator.
From what I've read, the vast majority (i.e. virtually ALL of them) are in favor of Trumps moves.
If anyone here knows more about Cuba than the Cuban Americans, please step forward.


In the meantime, I'm not saying Trump's decision is the right one.
I've long thought that the embargo should be lifted and I would welcome an opportunity to visit there regardless of who their leader is. I approved of Obama's slow efforts towards that end.
But I find the Hate-Trump-no-matter-what mentality to be getting old already.

Face it: politics aside, everybody on this site is quite biased when it comes to relationships with an island south of Miami.


Edit: The vast majority of Cuban Americans. I somehow omitted that.
teedubbya Offline
#41 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
And no one knows more about what we should do with Germany that German Americans, Ireland, UK, Italy, etc..... don't even get me started on afrika.
teedubbya Offline
#42 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
And I have to be honest, I've not spoken to a large number of Cubans. But if the press says they all favor trump then in this case I believe the press.

Just pokin ya tail. I do believe they are pro embargo (as long as they are exempted to an extent)

I honestly don't feel strongly on this one. It makes sense to lift it but I admittedly don't know all that much on the issue.
frankj1 Offline
#43 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
far from an expert, but over the last 10 years or so I've read that the aging Cubans in FL, the ones with the most political clout, agree with the embargo...and that is certainly understandable.

But they are demographically a minority now among Cuban Americans.

Another thing getting old is reading more about objections to the Hate Trump mentality than actually reading Hate Trump stuff!

Love ya buddy.
teedubbya Offline
#44 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Frank that's a pretty good point. The Cuban embargo has been a pretty non partisan thing in here to the point that some gave credit to Obama even though they still thought he wasn't born here. To equate not supporting reinstating bans/embargo to trump hate rings hollow, almost as if you must support everything he does or you are a hater. Sounds like a patriots fan. Lol.
teedubbya Offline
#45 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Again just jacking around. It's Father's Day. Carp die yum etc.
DrafterX Offline
#46 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
In this country, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women.... Mellow
rfenst Offline
#47 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,323
DrafterX wrote:
In this country, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women.... Mellow



Do you get to fluck them all?
SmokeMonkey Offline
#48 Posted:
Joined: 04-05-2015
Posts: 5,688
My International Relations major is coming out - Our policy for Cuba is the last vestige of the containment strategy used to "defeat" communism during the Cold War. I'll be the first to admit I don't have a strong opinion either way. I've bought CCs, even recently, but choose to purchase more NC's due to personal taste preference. While Cuban Americans are certainly more knowledgeable on the subject, they are also the group that will react more emotionally as the victims of nationalization of industry and property and the brutality of the regime in Havana. I'm not sure they should be the deciding factor regarding our policy. But they should absolutely have a seat at the table.

My gut tells me that lifting the embargo would affect change more rapidly in Cuba, but it may not be, in the short term, a positive economic move for the Cuban people. It certainly would be a boon to American business, however. Maybe slower change would be better for the long term stability. Not every nation reacts well to sudden freedom, both politically and economically.

As with all things, it's a complex issue. And shouldn't be particularly partisan. I was on with Obama's liberalization of the travel and economic restrictions. Im equally ok with Trump rolling some back.

That's a lot words to basically say "meh, whatever."
delta1 Offline
#49 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,788
rfenst wrote:
Do you get to fluck them all?


dunno... but Trump says you can at least grab their puzzies...



tailgater wrote:

But I find the Hate-Trump-no-matter-what mentality to be getting old already.



...but you were OK with the hate Obama-no-matter-what mentality for 9 plus years...the Trump hating has only been going on for two years...buckle your seat belt...
rfenst Offline
#50 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,323
SmokeMonkey wrote:
But they should absolutely have a seat at the table.

My gut tells me that lifting the embargo would affect change more rapidly in Cuba, but it may not be, in the short term, a positive economic move for the Cuban people. It certainly would be a boon to American business, however.


Ending the Embargo will be great for American business interests.
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