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Last post 4 years ago by brett1920. 48 replies replies.
Noob looking for Help!
brett1920 Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
Hello everyone! I'm new to the cigar game and am hoping you guys can give me some advice. I dipped Copenhagen for 15 years, but gave it up about a year ago. On my last deployment (USMC) we got a huge box of cigars shipped to us and I got hooked. I have a friend who's given me some good advice, but his tastes are quite expensive. I've tried the Opus X (loved it), Wise Man (didn't care for it), Tabernacle (my current favorite), Liga Privada No.9 (fantastic), the Diesel Whiskey Row (pretty good), just to name a few. I'm tired of going into the cigar shop and not knowing what I'm looking at or how to ask what for what I'm wanting. I don't know anything about origin, binders, fillers, etc. When I go to the shop, I tell the guy that I like bourbon, medium to full cigars, the cigars I've tried and liked/disliked...but they keep pushing me to their own in-house hand rolled selection, which I do not like. Lastly, my wife bought me a humidor, seasoned it with a Boveda Xikar pack, but the damn thing sits at about 80%. Any advice you guys could give me on cigars and the humidor would be greatly appreciated!
delta1 Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,754
welcome to the madhouse, brett...here's a suggestion...look up the cigars you like, to discover what tobacco leaves are used to construct them, and where they were made...use that info to find similarly made cigars...for example, the LP9 is made in Nicaragua, wrapped in a Connecticut Broadleaf maduro leaf, with Brazillian binder leaf, and Honduran and Nicaraguan fillers...since the wrapper is the most important leaf for the flavor of the cigar, start your search there...
brett1920 Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
delta1 wrote:
welcome to the madhouse, brett...here's a suggestion...look up the cigars you like, to discover what tobacco leaves are used to construct them, and where they were made...use that info to find similarly made cigars...for example, the LP9 is made in Nicaragua, wrapped in a Connecticut Broadleaf maduro leaf, with Brazillian binder leaf, and Honduran and Nicaraguan fillers...since the wrapper is the most important leaf for the flavor of the cigar, start your search there...


Makes perfect sense, kind of embarrassed I didn't put two and two together there. Thanks!
dstieger Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
As delta said, that's a 'start'. Wish it was easier from that point, but it really isn't. There's a couple few huge variables and you're likely going to have to try more than a bunch, even if it looks like they have similar recipes

Ring gauge - thinner cigars generally get more flavor from the wrapper -- its geometry....just don't ask me to explain it

Type of leave and fermentation - two wrapper leaves from the exact same plant can be very different based on whether they are from top of the plant, middle or bottom...and even then, they can vary based on how long they are allowed to ferment

Cigar manufacturers are notoriously coy about what kinds of leaves are in their cigars and where they were sourced

Non-Cuban cigar packaging is almost never dated -- so you generally have zero clue how much age a cigar has before you smoke it

delta is correct that similar wrapper and origin is a great place to start -- but don't get disillusioned right out the gate...it may take a while

Last year I found a cigar with identical description to a couple of my favorites...same wrapper, filler, factory...I was thrilled because it was somewhat unknown and cbid auction prices were half what I pay for the ones I love......and it absolutely sucked
dstieger Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
as to the humi, what sort of hygrometer are you using? If it isn't digital, it means nothing. If it is digital and you haven't calibrated it....well, it still might not mean much
what's the humidity in the room that your humi is in?
what are you using for humidification now?
is the seasoning boveda still in there?
how full is it? how big is it?
are you confident that it is sealing well? try sliding a dollar bill through the door?
glass top?
Pudding Mittens Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 08-15-2016
Posts: 1,291
dstieger wrote:
as to the humi, what sort of hygrometer are you using? If it isn't digital, it means nothing. If it is digital and you haven't calibrated it....well, it still might not mean much


Caliber IV, properly calibrated using a Boveda pack (using the average of multiple readings, etc.).

Don't bother with anything else.
.

brett1920 Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
dstieger wrote:
As delta said, that's a 'start'. Wish it was easier from that point, but it really isn't. There's a couple few huge variables and you're likely going to have to try more than a bunch, even if it looks like they have similar recipes

Ring gauge - thinner cigars generally get more flavor from the wrapper -- its geometry....just don't ask me to explain it

Type of leave and fermentation - two wrapper leaves from the exact same plant can be very different based on whether they are from top of the plant, middle or bottom...and even then, they can vary based on how long they are allowed to ferment

Cigar manufacturers are notoriously coy about what kinds of leaves are in their cigars and where they were sourced

Non-Cuban cigar packaging is almost never dated -- so you generally have zero clue how much age a cigar has before you smoke it

delta is correct that similar wrapper and origin is a great place to start -- but don't get disillusioned right out the gate...it may take a while

Last year I found a cigar with identical description to a couple of my favorites...same wrapper, filler, factory...I was thrilled because it was somewhat unknown and cbid auction prices were half what I pay for the ones I love......and it absolutely sucked



SOunds like a whole lot of science goes into this lol. I'm going to have to do a lot more research, thanks for giving me some things to look into!
brett1920 Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
dstieger wrote:
as to the humi, what sort of hygrometer are you using? If it isn't digital, it means nothing. If it is digital and you haven't calibrated it....well, it still might not mean much
what's the humidity in the room that your humi is in?
what are you using for humidification now?
is the seasoning boveda still in there?
how full is it? how big is it?
are you confident that it is sealing well? try sliding a dollar bill through the door?
glass top?



I have not picked up a digital hygrometer yet, but that is on my to-do list. I live in the South, so there's always about 150% humidity in the atmosphere. The Boveda pack is still in it, guy at the shop told me it all I'd need to leave in it...is that flase info? It's a solid wooden 100 count box, and it does seal nicely.
dstieger Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
What number is on the boveda? Their seasoning packs run, I think around 84....if so, get it out of there

If it is a number between, say 62 and 70, you can leave it in

I'm not sure there is such a thing as an analog hygro that is worth anything, even if calibrated....however, it can maybe tell you a little bit, at least as far as trends, if you do calibrate it...google salt test....won't be dead on balls accurate, like PM suggests, but it will do until you get a digital
USNGunner Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 05-17-2019
Posts: 4,402
[quote=dstieger
I'm not sure there is such a thing as an analog hygro that is worth anything, even if calibrated....however, it can maybe tell you a little bit, at least as far as trends, if you do calibrate it...google salt test....won't be dead on balls accurate, like PM suggests, but it will do until you get a digital [/quote]

Funny thing is, I have an old analog from a generic house brand Tomsomeones humidor I bought 10 years ago. That thing is dead on at 70% humidity. I use it to confirm the digitals. LOL.
brett1920 Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
dstieger wrote:
What number is on the boveda? Their seasoning packs run, I think around 84....if so, get it out of there

If it is a number between, say 62 and 70, you can leave it in

I'm not sure there is such a thing as an analog hygro that is worth anything, even if calibrated....however, it can maybe tell you a little bit, at least as far as trends, if you do calibrate it...google salt test....won't be dead on balls accurate, like PM suggests, but it will do until you get a digital



It's a 79. I'll pick one up in the range you mentioned, thanks!
tonygraz Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,175
To determine who you are and decide upon your forum worthiness, please answer the following simple questions:

Pancakes or waffles ?
Do you like long walks on the beach ?
Daisy Mae or Ellie Mae ?
Do you like camping by the river ?
Cello on or cello off ?
Ginger or MaryAnn ?
David Lee or Sammy ?
Warner Oland or Sidney Toler ?
Have you been in a Turkish prison ?
Do you like gladiator movies ?
dogs or cats ?
Men or women ?
Wad or fold ?
Sit or squat ?



Oh and 79 humidity is only good for cigar beetles.
Sunoverbeach Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 14,588
Definitely ditch the 79. It's doing exactly what it was made to holding at 80. Like USNG I've got an against the odds accurate analog too, but a few Caliber IVs to be sure

As far as smokes, I highly recommend you try them all. Discovery's a helluva good time. Don't be too quick to buy boxes. You'll be amazed at how your tastes can change along the way
brett1920 Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
tonygraz wrote:
To determine who you are and decide upon your forum worthiness, please answer the following simple questions:

Pancakes or waffles ?
Do you like long walks on the beach ?
Daisy Mae or Ellie Mae ?
Do you like camping by the river ?
Cello on or cello off ?
Ginger or MaryAnn ?
David Lee or Sammy ?
Warner Oland or Sidney Toler ?
Have you been in a Turkish prison ?
Do you like gladiator movies ?
dogs or cats ?
Men or women ?
Wad or fold ?
Sit or squat ?



Oh and 79 humidity is only good for cigar beetles.



Pancakes if I'm sober, waffles if otherwise intoxicated.
Not particularly.
Ellie Mae
I like camping anywhere I can.
Cello on.
Maryann, is there any other answer?!
Hagar
I may be too young for that one...
Not Turkish, but I can tell you Japanese jail ain't fun.
"ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED!?"
Dogs
Women
Fold...who wads?
I guess it depends on the situation?
izonfire Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
Well well well.
Brett born in 1920.
Gettin to be an old fugger, aren't you?

At this point your life, I would try everything.
Including Crack, meth and angel dust.
I mean seriously, whaddya got to lose?
It's time to taste everything that this life can serve ya.
Start with hookers and blow, and see where that crazy train take ya.

Do somethin' crazy.
Get a militia together, and go take over a third world country.
Start a cannibalistic cult and crown yourself King.
Smoke the limbs of your kidnapped hostages.

What are you waiting for???
RMAN4443 Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 09-29-2016
Posts: 7,683
Judges Please....Anxious
Sunoverbeach Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 14,588
I'm all for cutting loose when I'm too old for it to matter but I don't know that cannibalistic cult is on the bucket list

Not talking
ZRX1200 Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,477
Only season your humidor with lettuce.

Gurkhas are the Rolls Royce of cigars.

Never lose a bid, it’s a sign of weakness.

Never trust analog hygrometers.

Always trust the leader of your CBid camping trip and do as he says, remember safe words are for homos.

Learn how to use the search function.

Any questions private message jaderose.

If you want to talk to the owner of CBid call him, Dave is an awesome BOTL who loves talking to us. (214) 914-3337

The noob trade thread is a great starting point on your journey:

http://www.cigarbid.com/...ge-The-Thonginator.aspx
steve02 Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 954
delta1 wrote:
welcome to the madhouse, brett...here's a suggestion...look up the cigars you like, to discover what tobacco leaves are used to construct them, and where they were made...use that info to find similarly made cigars...for example, the LP9 is made in Nicaragua, wrapped in a Connecticut Broadleaf maduro leaf, with Brazillian binder leaf, and Honduran and Nicaraguan fillers...since the wrapper is the most important leaf for the flavor of the cigar, start your search there...


Not really. The filler is the cigar/smoke flavor. The wrapper is simply what your lips taste. Depending on how the filler is constructed/wrapped is what gives you different tastes throughout the burn.
izonfire Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
steve02 wrote:
Not really. The filler is the cigar/smoke flavor. The wrapper is simply what your lips taste. Depending on how the filler is constructed/wrapped is what gives you different tastes throughout the burn.


OK Steve02, pucker up that sphincter and prepare for some retribution.
Steve01 didn't last too long, and it appears that you're hot on his heels...
izonfire Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
Even the wrapper — the outer leaf in which the cigar is wrapped — affects the flavors of a cigar. There has been some debate over the years in regards to just how much impact a cigar’s wrapper has on its flavor, but the truth is that the wrapper alone cannot make or break the delicately nuanced profile that makes up the taste of a cigar, but it certainly plays a large part. Cigar icon Carlos Fuente even claims that it is credited with creating the major aspects of a cigar’s “personality.”

I'm speaking with Carlos tomorrow. I'll let him know that you say he is wrong.
izonfire Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
A cigar's outermost layer, or wrapper (Spanish: capa), is the most expensive component of a cigar. The wrapper determines much of the cigar's character and flavor, and as such its color is often used to describe the cigar as a whole.

Wrappers are frequently grown underneath huge canopies made of gauze so as to diffuse direct sunlight and are fermented separately from other rougher cigar components, with a view to the production of a thinly-veined, smooth, supple leaf.

Wrapper tobacco produced without the gauze canopies under which "shade grown" leaf is grown, generally more coarse in texture and stronger in flavor, is commonly known as "sun grown."

Maduro is a process for bringing out the sweetness of a tobacco leaf. Maduro is a Spanish word meaning "ripe." Maduro wrappers come from fermenting tobacco in pilones at higher temperatures and with more humidity than other tobacco types.

A number of different countries are used for the production of wrapper tobacco, including Cuba, Ecuador, Indonesia, Honduras, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Brazil, Mexico, Cameroon, and the United States.
_____

Texted directly from the folks at Padron
steve02 Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 954
izonfire wrote:
OK Steve02, pucker up that sphincter and prepare for some retribution.
Steve01 didn't last too long, and it appears that you're hot on his heels...


I've been here for a long time - almost 10 years longer than you - I used 02, because that was my baseball uniform number for a zillion years. I'm sure I'll be okay.
steve02 Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 954
izonfire wrote:
Even the wrapper — the outer leaf in which the cigar is wrapped — affects the flavors of a cigar. There has been some debate over the years in regards to just how much impact a cigar’s wrapper has on its flavor, but the truth is that the wrapper alone cannot make or break the delicately nuanced profile that makes up the taste of a cigar, but it certainly plays a large part. Cigar icon Carlos Fuente even claims that it is credited with creating the major aspects of a cigar’s “personality.”

I'm speaking with Carlos tomorrow. I'll let him know that you say he is wrong.


Not wrong at all, since the lips taste the wrapper, as I said. Ask Carlito about the box of 858s in Candela that he sent to me via my shop - if the wrapper was the only flavor, explain a mild and sweet candela around a medium bodied 858. Likewise, explain a mild Maduro v. a full bodied maduro.

Mild/medium/full is basically a function of filler, not wrapper.
izonfire Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
steve02 wrote:
Not wrong at all, since the lips taste the wrapper, as I said. Ask Carlito about the box of 858s in Candela that he sent to me via my shop - if the wrapper was the only flavor, explain a mild and sweet candela around a medium bodied 858. Likewise, explain a mild Maduro v. a full bodied maduro.

Mild/medium/full is basically a function of filler, not wrapper.


Never said the wrapper was the ONLY flavor.
The wrapper contributes significantly to the flavor of the smoke.
As stated earlier, "The wrapper determines much of the cigar's character and flavor"

If only the lips taste the wrapper, then why wrap the entire cigar in that expensive leaf?
Why not just cap the tip, and have the remainder wrapped with a binder leaf?

I'm not disputing your experience at all.
And I'm not claiming to have loads of experience myself.
Much of what we're doing here is just having fun.

But I would like to hear a serious discussion of this matter with you involved.
Would you be open for that?
Pudding Mittens Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 08-15-2016
Posts: 1,291
.
Wrapper leaf makes a very significant contribution to overall flavor.

I know some guys in the cigar industry, and they got me some cigars that were completely identical in all respects except for the wrapper leaf. Same vitola, binder, filler, even the same rollers making them. Only difference was the wrapper. There were maduro, habano and Sumatra wrapper versions.

Very different smokes in very significant ways. Not subtle, even though it's only one thin leaf on the outside.

So listen to izonfire, he's correct. The filler and binder do play serious roles in the overall flavor mix, but so does the wrapper, absolutely.
.
Pudding Mittens Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 08-15-2016
Posts: 1,291
Sunoverbeach wrote:
I'm all for cutting loose when I'm too old for it to matter but I don't know that cannibalistic cult is on the bucket list

Not talking


Cult? This is a classic comedy bit:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JR3PC8VDoz8

And this is a classic Onion article. The entire thing is great:

https://www.theonion.com/lapsed-cult-member-only-attends-sanctum-on-major-bloodl-1819576134

My favorite quote from that one:

Quote:
"You grow up carving the secret names of the Overseers into living animals hundreds of times, and you just get a little sick of it," he added. "Honestly, it's pretty boring to sit in sanctum week after week and hear some old Existence Guide rehash the same tired stories about Terry transforming himself into radio waves and visiting the destination galaxy. It gets a little old, you know?"

Enjoy!
.
Mandoman Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 12-27-2005
Posts: 4,761
Let me be the first to say thank you for your service.
At your stage of noobiness, I recommend, as others have said, look for cigars with the same components as the ones you like. Get fivers. High price does not mean you will like it, just as low price doesn't mean a bad cigar. Regardless of cost, a good cigar is one you enjoy.
brett1920 Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
Mandoman wrote:
Let me be the first to say thank you for your service.
At your stage of noobiness, I recommend, as others have said, look for cigars with the same components as the ones you like. Get fivers. High price does not mean you will like it, just as low price doesn't mean a bad cigar. Regardless of cost, a good cigar is one you enjoy.



Thanks, Mando, I'm definitely going to try a wide variety and see what hits. Thanks for the advice.
delta1 Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,754
...most written authorities on cigars seem to take Izon's and Pudding Mittens' POV ... just about all descriptions of a cigar lists the origin and type of wrapper leaf ...so I've bought in to the body of "knowledge" without having done any personal studies myself...


I'd be willing to conduct experiments if anybody wants to contribute a variety of different cigars with different wrappers, binders, and fillers from various countries...I'm up for an extensive study, since I've retired and have time to devote to this...
Mandoman Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 12-27-2005
Posts: 4,761
delta1 wrote:
...most written authorities on cigars seem to take Izon's and Pudding Mittens' POV ... just about all descriptions of a cigar lists the origin and type of wrapper leaf ...so I've bought in to the body of "knowledge" without having done any personal studies myself...


I'd be willing to conduct experiments if anybody wants to contribute a variety of different cigars with different wrappers, binders, and fillers from various countries...I'm up for an extensive study, since I've retired and have time to devote to this...

Any good experiment relies on verification. I'm here for you.
delta1 Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,754
hey brett, sunoverbeach and mandoman have given the best advice: try all kinds (within budget), limit purchases to fivers, since it realistically takes at least three tries with a cigar to determine if you want more...

trying different cigars, made with leaves from all over the world, made in different countries, has been one of the primary joys of smoking cigars for me...even today, after having found some faves that I smoke regularly enough to buy them in boxes, I still seek out new/different cigars and am occasionally delighted to find one with a unique and interesting flavor...
steve02 Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 954
izonfire wrote:
Never said the wrapper was the ONLY flavor.
The wrapper contributes significantly to the flavor of the smoke.
As stated earlier, "The wrapper determines much of the cigar's character and flavor"

If only the lips taste the wrapper, then why wrap the entire cigar in that expensive leaf?
Why not just cap the tip, and have the remainder wrapped with a binder leaf?

I'm not disputing your experience at all.
And I'm not claiming to have loads of experience myself.
Much of what we're doing here is just having fun.

But I would like to hear a serious discussion of this matter with you involved.
Would you be open for that?


Of course
steve02 Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 954
Pudding Mittens wrote:
.
Wrapper leaf makes a very significant contribution to overall flavor.

I know some guys in the cigar industry, and they got me some cigars that were completely identical in all respects except for the wrapper leaf. Same vitola, binder, filler, even the same rollers making them. Only difference was the wrapper. There were maduro, habano and Sumatra wrapper versions.

Very different smokes in very significant ways. Not subtle, even though it's only one thin leaf on the outside.

So listen to izonfire, he's correct. The filler and binder do play serious roles in the overall flavor mix, but so does the wrapper, absolutely.
.


Don’t disagree, but here’s the problem I’ve seen in the almost 40 years of smoking cigars - (example) someone will say I won’t smoke Maduro cigars because they’re too strong. Then you give them a Maduro with mild/medium filler and voila, they like it. My key point is/was that don’t only worry about the wrapper - in my experience, the creativity of cigar making (flavors changing, etc) is heavily based on the filler construction.
steve02 Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 05-20-2004
Posts: 954
delta1 wrote:
...most written authorities on cigars seem to take Izon's and Pudding Mittens' POV ... just about all descriptions of a cigar lists the origin and type of wrapper leaf ...so I've bought in to the body of "knowledge" without having done any personal studies myself...


I'd be willing to conduct experiments if anybody wants to contribute a variety of different cigars with different wrappers, binders, and fillers from various countries...I'm up for an extensive study, since I've retired and have time to devote to this...


Send me your address and I’ll send you some sticks with the same wrappers and you decide if they taste the same
Palama Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 02-05-2013
Posts: 23,463
steve02 wrote:
Send me your address and I’ll send you some sticks with the same wrappers and you decide if they taste the same


Not arguing but I did my own “research” a couple of years ago using the AF 8-5-8s for my vertical test.

Smoked all 5 wrappers...Candela, Natural, Maduro, Sun Grown and Rosado..over the course of 5 consecutive nights and found a world of difference between them. For me, each wrapper imparted their own taste and “personality”.

I haven’t done “testing” the way you’re suggesting but may do that sometime in the future.
izonfire Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
steve02 wrote:
Not really. The filler is the cigar/smoke flavor. The wrapper is simply what your lips taste. Depending on how the filler is constructed/wrapped is what gives you different tastes throughout the burn.


In other words, the wrapper does not contribute to the flavor of the smoke

Pudding Mittens wrote:
.
Wrapper leaf makes a very significant contribution to overall flavor.

I know some guys in the cigar industry, and they got me some cigars that were completely identical in all respects except for the wrapper leaf. Same vitola, binder, filler, even the same rollers making them. Only difference was the wrapper. There were maduro, habano and Sumatra wrapper versions.

Very different smokes in very significant ways. Not subtle, even though it's only one thin leaf on the outside.

So listen to izonfire, he's correct. The filler and binder do play serious roles in the overall flavor mix, but so does the wrapper, absolutely.
.


I have tried a number of blends where the only difference was the wrapper as well.

Assuming copying from the mothership is allowed:
____

Alec Bradley Tempus
4.58 OUT OF 5RATINGS184WRITE A REVIEW
Share:
A 94-rated masterpiece.

Here it is, quite possibly the crowning achievement of Alec Bradley Cigars. Tempus is truly boutique, right down to the tobaccos used. The Habano-seed wrapper hails from a small tobacco field located on the border of Nicaragua and Honduras, capturing the rich, hearty flavors of Honduras. This leaf is dark and leathery, and conceals a complex mixture of Cuban-seed long-fillers grown in both Nicaragua and Honduras. The cigar explodes with rich, but smooth flavors noting toasted wood and nuts. The finish is long and peppery with an enjoyable sweetnes​s.

The Magistri is a special size produced in limited quantities. Only 1,000 boxes were produced total, and each of these perfectos utilize a higher priming wrapper that is darker in color.

Thanks to numerous well-deserved '94' ratings, the Alec Bradley Tempus was named the #5 Cigar of 2017. The reviews noted, "Dark and attractive with an effortless draw, this cigar produces a rich, semisweet smoke, leaving balanced impressions of wood and nuts. Big, delicious flavor."
____

Alec Bradley Tempus Maduro

4.42 OUT OF 5RATINGS105WRITE A REVIEW
STAFF REVIEW1
Share:
A darker, richer Tempus cigar.

Take the 94-rated Tempus, add a maduro wrapper into the equation, and come out on top with another winning blend. If only everything were that easy. But for Alan Rubin of Alec Bradley, the wind is always at his back.

Tempus Maduro cigars combine the same rich filler bl​end as the original Tempus, now paired with a San Andres maduro wrapper. This wrapper leaf is dark and luscious, specially fermented using an old Cuban technique. The result is a rich, full-flavored blend that's smooth and balanced throughout. Notes of coffee, cocoa, pepper, cedar, and a slightly sweet finish characterize this complex new addition to the Alec Bradley line up.

Alec Bradley Tempus Maduro received a well-deserved 90-rating noting: "A dark cigar with some pronounced veins and a roughly applied cap. It's notes of licorice and nuts take on a firey, chili pepper spiciness. The finish is a touch chalky."
____

So Steve, you're saying that the taste on the lips, and not the smoke, accounts entirely for the difference in taste between these two cigars?
Is that correct?
izonfire Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
steve02 wrote:
Don’t disagree, but here’s the problem I’ve seen in the almost 40 years of smoking cigars - (example) someone will say I won’t smoke Maduro cigars because they’re too strong. Then you give them a Maduro with mild/medium filler and voila, they like it. My key point is/was that don’t only worry about the wrapper - in my experience, the creativity of cigar making (flavors changing, etc) is heavily based on the filler construction.


Absolutely agree.

But your original assertion was that the wrapper does not contribute to the flavor of the smoke, only the flavor on your lips.
frankj1 Offline
#39 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,211
my lips are sealed
RMAN4443 Offline
#40 Posted:
Joined: 09-29-2016
Posts: 7,683
I'll take "Who are the "Go-Go's" for $1000, Alex....Anxious
delta1 Offline
#41 Posted:
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,754
steve02 wrote:
Send me your address and I’ll send you some sticks with the same wrappers and you decide if they taste the same


I don't disagree with that point, steve...I like cigars covered with Ecuadoran Habano wrappers, and they are not all the same...I'm sure that the blend of binders and fillers contribute to that, along with the place where the leaf was grown and the aging and fermentation the wrapper went through...
izonfire Offline
#42 Posted:
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,642
frankj1 wrote:
my lips are sealed


Mine are moist
tonygraz Offline
#43 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,175
izonfire wrote:
Well well well.
Brett born in 1920.
Gettin to be an old fugger, aren't you?
....


According to the questions asked and answered, 1920 is way off.

Alex, I'll take how old is Brett for $ 1,000.

Who put the superglue on Frank's lip balm ?
frankj1 Offline
#44 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,211
mmm hmm mmhmm!
brett1920 Offline
#45 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
Thanks everyone for the great advice and good reading material!
dstieger Offline
#46 Posted:
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
I had every intention of steering clear of the wrapper debate above....but couldn't do it....

Here's my .02:
1. As to overall contribution to flavor....it depends.
- It depends on the ring gauge to a very large degree --- smaller rg means more wrapper -- fairly simple geometry - more wrapper in relation to filler and binder, means more impact on overall flavor.
- It depends on where on the tobacco plant the wrapper is cut from and it depends on the level of fermentation, e.g., milder wrapper with a bunch of ligero filler may not have as much 'influence'

2. Focus on wrapper as factor to thin the herd and narrow search to cigars I like is a no-brainer. Makers are mostly up-front about their wrappers - where they are grown and what seed is used....not always, but somewhat. That is NOT the case when it comes to binder and filler -- I believe makers get off on the 'mystery' around what's in their cigars....not all, of course, but many.

3. Maybe mostly for the reasons above, I can pretty unequivocally 'know' whether a cigar will fall into the OK, I'll try that again....or, no fn way I'm gonna like that -- based upon the wrapper. I've almost enjoyed exactly one cigar with a San Andres maduro wrapper....and I've correctly identified and discarded numerous others without prior knowledge. Then again, a maker can roll up some Nicaraguan hay inside a properly fermented Ecuadoran Habano wrapper and there's a good chance that I'll enjoy it


So, with respect to the debaters above, I find it is easiest to suggest a noob put some of their attention on wrappers early on as they find their way
USNGunner Offline
#47 Posted:
Joined: 05-17-2019
Posts: 4,402
dstieger wrote:
I had every intention of steering clear of the wrapper debate above....but couldn't do it....
So, with respect to the debaters above, I find it is easiest to suggest a noob put some of their attention on wrappers early on as they find their way



The Cello? :-"
brett1920 Offline
#48 Posted:
Joined: 06-11-2019
Posts: 9
tonygraz wrote:
According to the questions asked and answered, 1920 is way off.

Alex, I'll take how old is Brett for $ 1,000.

Who put the superglue on Frank's lip balm ?



Ha! 1920 is a just smidge off. I just turned 36, but I do have an "old soul", to be cliche. Mama raised a proper Southern gentleman.
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