America's #1 Online Cigar Auction
first, best, biggest!

Last post 3 years ago by bgz. 35 replies replies.
Should We Start Over Our COVID 19 Response?
Jump to Bottom | Previous Topic | Next Topic
delta1 Offline
#1 Posted: Fri, Jul 24 2020, 8:24 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,784
The US has seen much more suffering and deaths due to the corona virus pandemic than most other nations of the world. Similar nations in Europe have shown that the virus can be contained by effective shut down of all non-essential activities, widespread testing, contact tracing and isolation.

The US Public Interest Research Group has published a letter authored by more than 150 medical professionals advocating that we should "shut it down -- start over -- do it right"


https://uspirg.org/resources/usp/shut-it-down-start-over-do-it-right

is this doable in the US?
rfenst Offline
#2 Posted: Fri, Jul 24 2020, 8:51 PM EST
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,302
delta1 wrote:
... is this doable in the US?

Not any more.
We stopped way to early and are too stupid to make it doable again.
ZRX1200 Offline
#3 Posted: Fri, Jul 24 2020, 8:55 PM EST
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,599
LMAO yeah we should just murder old people like Cuomo.
frankj1 Offline
#4 Posted: Fri, Jul 24 2020, 10:01 PM EST
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
do what you want...stay out of Massachusetts.
DrafterX Offline
#5 Posted: Fri, Jul 24 2020, 10:09 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,548
Monday morning quarterbacks.. Mellow
KingoftheCove Offline
#6 Posted: Fri, Jul 24 2020, 11:17 PM EST
Joined: 10-08-2011
Posts: 7,632
If we don’t do it right.........and real soon..........we are gonna be totally fuqed.
Doing it “right” iis going to be really painful as well.
Just depends on where one wants to place priorities I suppose...
tonygraz Offline
#7 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 7:32 AM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,247
We are all going to die.
Gene363 Offline
#8 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 7:40 AM EST
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,814
Information credibility has been squandered by those with political motives. This includes politicians, the news media, medical personnel and the anti vaccination movement.
tailgater Offline
#9 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 8:59 AM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
frankj1 wrote:
do what you want...stay out of Massachusetts.


Yeah.
Because we know how to do it right...

Covid Death rate almost 6X Florida.
Highest unemployment in the nation.

We know our stuff.
bgz Offline
#10 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 9:35 AM EST
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
Being somewhat a germophobe... corona virus has been great. Give all the double dippers of the world a taste of their own medicine.

I'm all for all them nasty mother f*ckers staying the hell away from me.

Also, it's let me exist peacefully in my natural hermit like state. Got a built in excuse for everything!!! Hey b, u wanna go... no no, corona virus.
HockeyDad Offline
#11 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 1:14 PM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,130
The “more than 150 medical professionals” should lose their jobs immediately. They need to have skin in the game.
BuckyB93 Offline
#12 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 1:46 PM EST
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 14,188
Let's take a look at some of the "more than 150 Medical Professionals" that are on the list in the article shall we?

Randomly picking three from the list.

Katherine S. Villers, Board President
Founder, Community Catalyst
Kate Villers is founder of Community Catalyst, a national non-profit organization that builds state-level advocacy networks and consumer leadership to improve health and health care. Prior to founding Community Catalyst, Villers in 1982 co-founded the Villers Foundation and, in 1989, its successor organization, Families USA. She played significant board and operating roles for these organizations that included day-to-day direction of their Massachusetts programs. 

A community activist. Medical? Ahhhh, not really. Professional? I guess, she gets paid for her job so technically a professional. Guess she's totally qualified to chime in on this - Yeah, NO!

Dr. Wade Berrettini is the Karl E. Rickels Professor of Psychiatry, at the Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania.
Areas of Investigation
Addictions
Behavioral Genetics
Bipolar Disorder
Depression
Eating Disorders
Epilepsy
Gene Mapping
Molecular Genetics
Pharmacogenetics
Psychiatric Genetics

A psychiatrist. Medical professional? Yes. Qualified to contribute to this as an expert? I'd say not.

Jonathan D. Moreno is the David and Lyn Silfen University Professor at the University of Pennsylvania where he is a Penn Integrates Knowledge (PIK) professor. At Penn he is also Professor of Medical Ethics and Health Policy, of History and Sociology of Science, and of Philosophy.
 
His next book, Everybody Wants to Go to Heaven but Nobody Wants to Die: Bioethics and the Transformation of Healthcare in America, co-authored with Penn president Amy Gutmann, will be published by Liveright/Norton in 2019.  In 2020 Columbia University Press will publish The Brain in Context: A Pragmatic Guide to Neuroscience with the neuroscientist Jay Schulkin.

Among Moreno’s previous books are Impromptu Man: J.L. Moreno and the Origins of Psychodrama, Encounter Culture, and the Social Network (2014), which Amazon called a “#1 hot new release”; The Body Politic, which was named a Best Book of 2011 by Kirkus Reviews; Mind Wars (2012), which was referenced by the screenwriter of The Bourne Legacy; Undue Risk (2000). and Deciding Together (1995).  He has published hundreds of papers, articles, reviews and op-eds. Moreno’s writings have been translated into Chinese, German, Japanese and Portuguese.       

An author. WTF is he doing on the list? Needed something to add to the resume?

Getting pretty liberal with the use of "Medical Professionals" aren't we? If one were to go through the whole list, I wonder if they would run into a dentist, a veterinarian, and podiatrist in that group too.

Can we please stop tossing around the "all these medical experts say... we better listen to the experts" BS?
delta1 Offline
#13 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 2:16 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,784
so you think the suggestion to start over is not to be considered because some of the people making a case for it don't meet your criteria for medical experts? okay...

which experts do you think are responding best to the pandemic?
Plowboy221 Offline
#14 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 2:23 PM EST
Joined: 03-03-2013
Posts: 5,144
I still question this whole thing, I’ve literally changed nothing how info about things, know no one that has had it. Hell the ex and here family just spent two weeks in Florida going out doing stuff then the ex is out in NC. We’ll see what happens I suppose, I still believe the numbers are way over blown....
victor809 Offline
#15 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 2:57 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
There's a certain irony when the same people claiming these medical experts aren't experty enough are the same who have pushed climate change denier nonsense from people without any expertise in climate modeling.

But I agree. I don't care what a psychiatrist thinks about an epidemic...
I have no idea who else is on the list... I suppose if there's 147 epidemiologists and the 3 Bucky ifen
victor809 Offline
#16 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 2:58 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
...(continue)... Identified, then maybe it'd be ok.

Not sure where we should put the line.... If there's 100 epidemiologists and 50 psychiatrists is it still a legitimate statement?

Does it just take a couple epidemiologists?

I dunno.
victor809 Offline
#17 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 3:08 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
The smart answer would be that each community should make a shut down decision based on their own level of infection and other considerations

Of course, that also means that we should shut down travel between communities, and put procedures in place to make transportation of good safe.

If we leave travel open across the US, we force ourselves to have a "one strategy fits all" solution to the pandemic, which will ultimately only make sense to a small percentage of communities (regardless of the decision).
DrafterX Offline
#18 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 3:22 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,548
I heard Kanye was one of the epidemiologists.... Mellow
MACS Offline
#19 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 3:26 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,773
Short answer: F--k no.
BuckyB93 Offline
#20 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 4:48 PM EST
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 14,188
delta1 wrote:
so you think the suggestion to start over is not to be considered because some of the people making a case for it don't meet your criteria for medical experts? okay...

which experts do you think are responding best to the pandemic?


Meet my criteria? These clowns meet your criteria? You sure have some loose standards for medical professionals.

Which experts do I think are best? Oh gee... I don't know but it's surely not f'n folks with credentials like those that I pointed out above. I have no desire to look at each one of them but if you want to try so you can back up your position then go crazy.

Just by picking out a couple and seeing their "credentials" pretty much tells me that this "news" rag sets the bar pretty low. Doing so makes the whole piece a bunch of garbage on par with the tabloids you see in line at the grocery store. If they (and you since you posted it) expect to be taken seriously, than use some respectable sources.

Sorry to take up some of your time. Hope you don't miss Dr. Oz's latest episode. You know, Dr. Oz... a medical expert, an accomplished cardiac surgeon with degrees from two Ivy League universities. That guy. The medical expert from the The Oprah Winfrey Show. He has his own show now. I think it comes on TV right after The View. He's got some ground breaking stuff that you shouldn't miss like "Surprisingly Common Ways to Die From Everyday Accidents."

Straight from the mouth of a medical expert so don't miss it.
https://www.doctoroz.com/episode/surprisingly-common-accidental-ways-you-can-die
bgz Offline
#21 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 9:58 PM EST
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
Here's a surprisingly easy way to accidentally die... corona virus!
frankj1 Offline
#22 Posted: Sat, Jul 25 2020, 10:13 PM EST
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
I'm banking on Rudy and Navarro...not the original Navarro at the beginning of the year, the new Navarro.
an attorney and a trade advisor, who needs more?
BuckyB93 Offline
#23 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 6:01 AM EST
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 14,188
Rona is an easy way to die? Not really, 98-99% that are infected don't die from it.
Brewha Offline
#24 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 10:28 AM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,172
True, it is not very effective. That’s prolly why people are calling it the Trump Virus....
bgz Offline
#25 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 11:12 AM EST
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
BuckyB93 wrote:
Rona is an easy way to die? Not really, 98-99% that are infected don't die from it.


Easy way to ACCIDENTALLY die. 1 to 2 percent is actually quite high for a death that is deamed accidental. Is it an accident though if you're actively going to covid parties and trymp ralleys without wearing a mask?
frankj1 Offline
#26 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 12:50 PM EST
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
bgz wrote:
Easy way to ACCIDENTALLY die. 1 to 2 percent is actually quite high for a death that is deamed accidental. Is it an accident though if you're actively going to covid parties and trymp ralleys without wearing a mask?

hmm, so if someone goes to a covid party (yeah, that's a thing) and gets the virus, recovers but infects others and one of them dies, should it be like a drunk driving case when the victim dies from "accidental" injuries?
delta1 Offline
#27 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 1:29 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,784
BuckyB93 wrote:
Meet my criteria? These clowns meet your criteria? You sure have some loose standards for medical professionals.

Which experts do I think are best? Oh gee... I don't know but it's surely not f'n folks with credentials like those that I pointed out above. I have no desire to look at each one of them but if you want to try so you can back up your position then go crazy.

Just by picking out a couple and seeing their "credentials" pretty much tells me that this "news" rag sets the bar pretty low. Doing so makes the whole piece a bunch of garbage on par with the tabloids you see in line at the grocery store. If they (and you since you posted it) expect to be taken seriously, than use some respectable sources.

Sorry to take up some of your time. Hope you don't miss Dr. Oz's latest episode. You know, Dr. Oz... a medical expert, an accomplished cardiac surgeon with degrees from two Ivy League universities. That guy. The medical expert from the The Oprah Winfrey Show. He has his own show now. I think it comes on TV right after The View. He's got some ground breaking stuff that you shouldn't miss like "Surprisingly Common Ways to Die From Everyday Accidents."

Straight from the mouth of a medical expert so don't miss it.
https://www.doctoroz.com/episode/surprisingly-common-accidental-ways-you-can-die



Dr. Oz? you mean this guy?

https://www.businessinsider.com/dr-oz-false-misleading-baseless-medical-claims-coronavirus-2020-4

https://www.forbes.com/sites/rachelsandler/2020/04/17/heres-why-dr-phil-dr-oz-and-dr-drew-were-slammed-for-coronavirus-remarks/#6242bab25c73

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-eyes-accused-quack-dr-oz-for-coronavirus-and-hydroxychloroquine-advice
DrafterX Offline
#28 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 1:30 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,548
they prolly woulda caught it anyways... Mellow
rfenst Offline
#29 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 1:31 PM EST
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,302
LMAO @ 27
bgz Offline
#30 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 2:53 PM EST
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
frankj1 wrote:
hmm, so if someone goes to a covid party (yeah, that's a thing) and gets the virus, recovers but infects others and one of them dies, should it be like a drunk driving case when the victim dies from "accidental" injuries?


Makes sense to me.
frankj1 Offline
#31 Posted: Sun, Jul 26 2020, 8:08 PM EST
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
bgz wrote:
Makes sense to me.

I thinks so. Maybe not exactly as I described but your post before it clarified some thoughts I'd been having.

Maybe it's manslaughter?

BTW, nice to see ya.
bgz Offline
#32 Posted: Mon, Jul 27 2020, 10:56 AM EST
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
frankj1 wrote:
I thinks so. Maybe not exactly as I described but your post before it clarified some thoughts I'd been having.

Maybe it's manslaughter?

BTW, nice to see ya.


I don't think it would ever get to criminal levels unless you can prove malicious intent.

I don't think stupidity would fly.

Anyway, good to see you too!
frankj1 Offline
#33 Posted: Mon, Jul 27 2020, 7:34 PM EST
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
bgz wrote:
I don't think it would ever get to criminal levels unless you can prove malicious intent.

I don't think stupidity would fly.

Anyway, good to see you too!

I know you're right.
delta1 Offline
#34 Posted: Mon, Jul 27 2020, 8:19 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,784
if you go to a COVID party, get infected, and then forcefully cough on someone who questions why you're not wearing a mask at Target...that may be criminal...
bgz Offline
#35 Posted: Tue, Jul 28 2020, 7:12 PM EST
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
True, that would be hard to prove though.

I guess you could go for assault with a deadly weapon.
Users browsing this topic
Guest
Back to Top