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Last post 2 years ago by Sunoverbeach. 65 replies replies.
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Poverty
frankj1 Offline
#51 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,219
Speyside2 wrote:
Frank, a home is a terrible way to gain wealth. A home on average appreciates. 3.5% to 3.8% annually. The average appreciation of the DOW average is what, about 14 %. Every dime of equity you have in the house above 20% should be borrowed against and invested. Then you make 10% on your money not 4 %. It is not quite that simple, but that is a close enough example for this discussion. Rich people do this all the time. They borrow against their assets and, invest and live off of the borrowed money. It is entirely legal, though not ethical in my mind. They only pay taxes on the money they pay on the loans each year. Otherwise I agree with the rest of your post.

being excluded from home ownership affects succeeding generations through lack of inheritance and the opportunities free property has afforded generations of the participating middle class.

I'm not talking about investment property(ies). I'm talking about residences, be they ever so humble!

On a side not, I believe your payback numbers are waaaaay off in many parts of the country, but that wasn't what I was getting at.
Speyside2 Offline
#52 Posted:
Joined: 11-11-2021
Posts: 2,360
So you are not talking about a home as an investment, but rather wealth generation for numerous groups of people? The numbers I listed are the national average range, I do not know over how many years.
Speyside2 Offline
#53 Posted:
Joined: 11-11-2021
Posts: 2,360
Also, what do you mean by free property?
frankj1 Offline
#54 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,219
Speyside2 wrote:
So you are not talking about a home as an investment, but rather wealth generation for numerous groups of people? The numbers I listed are the national average range, I do not know over how many years.

I'm trying to stay with the initial question of causes of poverty but I was also looking more at perpetuating poverty.
There are many things contributing to that that have been obstacles to even many highly motivated hard working people.
I used a few examples of some that likely are not widely known and even more likely not a shared experience to 98.2% of us here.

like the GI Bill as one example. Simply was not available to every returning war vet.
Why?
frankj1 Offline
#55 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,219
Speyside2 wrote:
Also, what do you mean by free property?

Let's say a WWII vet returned home, took advantage of benefits and purchased a modest home, say a slab ranch, in one of the zillions of post war developments that energized and massively multiplied the middle class in America under Truman and well more under Eisenhower...let's say a 30 year old in 1950.
Maybe it cost between 12 and 15 thousand?

Upon the vet's death, the likely paid off house is inherited by the kid(s). Free property upon which anywhere from modest to maybe significant growth can result. Kids living better than parents happened a lot from generation to generation in many American families. Not much of that financial gain happens for generations stuck in tenements.

This extremely common scenario in America is just an example of a way for some families to avoid or stay out of poverty, or at least for those eligible. Not all were eligible.

I haven't mentioned restrictions of business loans, venture capital opportunities.

Despite what appears to be a limited to race position I am expounding, I am not limited to that belief.
I think we have a "poor class" in this country that is made up of more than a race or two. But I was trying to offer up how part of that class has been created and not blame the victims at the same time.
Speyside2 Offline
#56 Posted:
Joined: 11-11-2021
Posts: 2,360
I only disagreed on the one point because I did not properly follow your meaning.

There are other very specific circumstances you could mention of hatred.

The Tuskegee airmen.
The deaths in Tulsa.
The effect of the KKK and other white supremacists
At one time votes counting as only 3/5 of a person.
The bondage of welfare
The inequity in prison sentences
The inequity in business loans
Et al
frankj1 Offline
#57 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,219
yeah, but I was heading down a narrower cause of poverty perpetuation
HockeyDad Offline
#58 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,120
frankj1 wrote:
yeah, but I was heading down a narrower cause of poverty perpetuation


Democrats
CelticBomber Offline
#59 Posted:
Joined: 05-03-2012
Posts: 6,786
Gene363 wrote:
What causes prosperity?


Crushing your enemies. Seeing them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.
MACS Offline
#60 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,751
CelticBomber wrote:
Crushing your enemies. Seeing them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.


Alright, Conan... the Boob-arian
HockeyDad Offline
#61 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,120
CelticBomber wrote:
Crushing your enemies. Seeing them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their women.


YES!
Sunoverbeach Offline
#62 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 14,656
Oh, when I was a kid in show business I was poor. I used to go to orgies to eat the grapes.
- RD
bgz Offline
#63 Posted:
Joined: 07-29-2014
Posts: 13,023
Sunoverbeach wrote:
Oh, when I was a kid in show business I was poor. I used to go to orgies to eat the grapes.
- RD


Sounds like you'll do well hangin out with Celtic and HD.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#64 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,398
HockeyDad wrote:
Democrats


YES!
Sunoverbeach Offline
#65 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 14,656
I tell ya, with my doctor, I don't get no respect. I told him, "I've swallowed a bottle of sleeping pills." He told me to have a few drinks and get some rest
- RD
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