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The Pain You Feel is All Part of the 'Incredible Transition' from Fossil Fuels
RayR Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 5,929
Yep, President Numbnuts said it, I heard it on the news this morning.
It is all part of the incredible progressive plan to make your gas guzzling buggy obsolete and make you poorer.
In other word...suck it up proles, we're Building Back Better!
Was there any doubt?

Biden on Record-High Gas Prices: All Part of the 'Incredible Transition' from Fossil Fuels

President Joe Biden’s embrace of high gasoline prices as a step to a world without fossil fuels has been condemned as tone-deaf at a time when Americans are facing unprecedented pain at the pump.

“[W]hen it comes to the gas prices, we’re going through an incredible transition that is taking place that, God willing, when it’s over, we’ll be stronger and the world will be stronger and less reliant on fossil fuels when this is over,” Biden said Monday during a news conference in Japan.

Joe Biden: “When it comes to the gas prices, we’re going through an INCREDIBLE transition” pic.twitter.com/8TGnc7vFa8

— RNC Research (@RNCResearch) May 23, 2022

https://www.westernjournal.com/biden-record-high-gas-prices-part-incredible-transition-fossil-fuels/
ZRX1200 Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 57,451
What’s a Watermelon?

Green on the outside red in the middle.

Sincerely,
Commies
RayR Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 5,929
You can't Build Back Better without cracking a few heads, the Bolsheviks always say.
Brewha Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
My EV gets delivered in June. 20 cents on the dollar to power vs gas. Charge at the home.

Suck it up old school!
deadeyedick Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 03-13-2003
Posts: 14,606
Brewha wrote:
My EV gets delivered in June. 20 cents on the dollar to power vs gas. Charge at the home.

Suck it up old school!


The old saying: "It rains on the just and the unjust equally" still applies. We will all suffer from the effects of climate change no matter what fuels our future.
Brewha Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
deadeyedick wrote:
The old saying: "It rains on the just and the unjust equally" still applies. We will all suffer from the effects of climate change no matter what fuels our future.

True.

Yet there are many here who will never believe that industrial pollution is causing a shift in the climate. They think it is a liberal lie, like seatbelts saving lives or Covid shots being a good thing. And they will fight every reasonable change in energy pollution.

The American pride in stupidly is epic.
ZRX1200 Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 57,451
Enjoy Joe’s rolling blackouts.
RayR Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 5,929
Ya, I heard EV's don't charge so good with those rolling blackouts.
Hope he's got a backup generator that runs on...you know like that fossil fuel stuff called natural gas.
CelticBomber Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 05-03-2012
Posts: 6,697
If you pay just the slightest bit of attention you'll realize that the only thing oil prices have to do with American politics or Russia/Ukraine or Covid is that oil companies are using those things as excuses to jack up prices and are posting record profits. Like Guinness Book of World Records profits.
Whistlebritches Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 04-23-2006
Posts: 21,713
Brewha wrote:
True.

Yet there are many here who will never believe that industrial pollution is causing a shift in the climate. They think it is a liberal lie, like seatbelts saving lives or Covid shots being a good thing. And they will fight every reasonable change in energy pollution.

The American pride in stupidly is epic.


P.T. Barnum said it best................"There’s a sucker born every minute". Brew intellectual idiots fall into this category, relish in it
Whistlebritches Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 04-23-2006
Posts: 21,713
CelticBomber wrote:
If you pay just the slightest bit of attention you'll realize that the only thing oil prices have to do with American politics or Russia/Ukraine or Covid is that oil companies are using those things as excuses to jack up prices and are posting record profits. Like Guinness Book of World Records profits.



Umm CB.........you might want to do a little more research on that position.Biden shutting down all drilling on federal lands and offshore has nothing to do with it.Maybe you should be the one paying the" slightest bit of attention "
Sunoverbeach Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 11,826
How do you raise a child?
Pick them up.
Mike3316 Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 02-05-2022
Posts: 289
Brewha wrote:
My EV gets delivered in June. 20 cents on the dollar to power vs gas. Charge at the home.

Suck it up old school!

If you bought an EV because it costs less to "fill" than a gas vehicle - so be it. If you bought it because you THINK you're saving the envrionment then you're delusional. EVs are an ecological DISASTER in the making! It could be you're just virtue signaling for green social cred. My first questions to EV cheerleaders - where do you think the electric come from that you're charging your car with? Where is the electric going to come from if 150 million Americans buy EVs next year? And how - pray tell - do you expect our already strained electric grid to handle that kind of load increase?
CelticBomber Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 05-03-2012
Posts: 6,697
Whistlebritches wrote:
Umm CB.........you might want to do a little more research on that position.Bidenshutting down all drilling on federal lands and offshore has nothing to do with it.Maybe you should be the one paying the" slightest bit of attention "


Congratulations! You just regurgitated the Republican talking points! Have a great day and don't forget to Make Us Great Again!

Try reading economic reports and the industries own reporting. Oil and natural gas output and inventories in the U.S. and around the global are back to pre-pandemic levels. Both Oil and Natural gas production is the U.S. are rising, not falling. Oil and gas companies that posted losses during the pandemic have recovered those losses x2 and for some companies x4. Record profits. That includes pre-pandemic numbers.

It wasn't Biden who put a halt to new leases while they decide climate policy. A Republican Federal judge (A Trump appointee) did when he granted an injunction against the way they were calculating the real world cost of pollution, the "Social Cost of Carbon". Trump essentially did away with using the SCC number and disbanded the agency responsible for calculating it because they were using a number based on world wide emissions. The Trump admin wanted to use a number based only on U.S. emissions, which they then ignored and basically set the number to zero after a different judge blocked the Trump admin's own plans to dismantle emissions regulations. The Biden admin is trying to restore that number to how it was calculated before the Trump admin. This affects everything from methane emissions for drilling to carbon emission from coal plants to how automakers calculate MPG.

That ruling had a ripple affect across multiple agencies who now have to sit down and reevaluate multiple policies. This means, by law, they have to redo studies, create new models, etc. etc, ad nauseam bureaucracy before new leases can be granted. It's not costing the oil and gas industry a dime. It's all going to come out of our pocket. But..... !

WHO CARES! It's Biden's fault! Dumb Liberals! Probably some snowflakes involved too! <---- The noised used to distract everyone while the energy industries go about their day.

Tuesday's are for golf. Thursday's it's baby seal clubbing. Fridays are guess the endangered animal mystery meat potluck. It's a rough life for an oil industry exec. They take Saturday through Monday off. Wednesdays are for... well, we don't talk about Wednesdays. Shhh
CelticBomber Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 05-03-2012
Posts: 6,697
Mike3316 wrote:
If you bought an EV because it costs less to "fill" than a gas vehicle - so be it. If you bought it because you THINK you're saving the envrionment then you're delusional. EVs are an ecological DISASTER in the making! It could be you're just virtue signaling for green social cred. My first questions to EV cheerleaders - where do you think the electric come from that you're charging your car with? Where is the electric going to come from if 150 million Americans buy EVs next year? And how - pray tell - do you expect our already strained electric grid to handle that kind of load increase?



EV's are worse than that. But, that's a different bull for a different time. I need to get my 8 seconds on the one I'm riding now. whip
BuckyB93 Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 12,420
RayR wrote:
Ya, I heard EV's don't charge so good with those rolling blackouts.
Hope he's got a backup generator that runs on...you know like that fossil fuel stuff called natural gas.


Not a big fan of quoting RayR but this fact can't be overlooked.

All "green energy" requires mother nature to cooperate. Solar needs sunlight, wind power needs wind. You can only store so much saved up energy in a battery system. Like Honey Badger, Mother nature don't give a $hit. Renewable energy sources produce inconsistent amounts of power that vary by the season and weather,

If mother nature doesn't comply, then you get no energy from these technologies - technologies that so far have been held up via and buoyed government grants, tax credits, subsides, etc...

Humans want and need energy on demand. Green energy "solutions" so far cannot supply that.

There is no one simple cure to the human and current society's energy demand. Wind, solar, geothermal all have a place in the puzzle but fossil fuels are still the king and will be in our life time.

Try to heat a house in northern latitudes using solar - it ain't happening.

Brewha had mentioned in another post that Tesla's Powerwall is an answer for the average consumer.

Facts:
Tesla Powerwall system can store up to 13.5 kWh of backup electricity.
https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/pdfs/powerwall/Powerwall%202_AC_Datasheet_en_northamerica.pdf

An average household consumes about 30 kWh per day.
https://us.sunpower.com/how-many-solar-panels-do-you-need-panel-size-and-output-factors[/b]

So one of the leaders' solution for using solar power technology for residential use can only store just under half of a day's worth of electricity that is needed to run an average household. Let's not forget, this is on the high end when the weather cooperates an your solar panels are running at peak efficiency (the most efficient solar panels peak out at about 23% efficient).
https://www.cleanenergyreviews.info/blog/most-efficient-solar-panels


Doesn't sound like a viable solution to an energy crisis to me.
Speyside2 Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 11-11-2021
Posts: 2,049
Some of mother earth is consistent but no one tries to work with that or only works a little with that. Waves, ocean currents, ground temperature below a certain number of feet, geothermal, perhaps a couple of others I am not thinking of. Want to be less oil dependant? Utilize nuclear and natural gas right now. Bonus points way less pollution. Want to be less OPEC dependant? Drill more, open government land for drilling, allow fraking, finish the pipeline, build additional refineries, and such. This is a long term step by step process that the government has FUBARED for generations. This isn't progress, this is the precursor to a depression. I never thought I would say this. Go Brandon! Though I can say that for all government for say the last 50 years.
RayR Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 5,929
Congratulations Spey...you've moved away from the dark-side, at least for today. Go Brandon!

Bucky, you can't help but quote me, no matter how you resist. As the old saying goes, 'All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.'

Some more truths to be considered about EV's by Eric Peters, the car guy:

How EVs Don’t Save You Money

By eric -May 19, 2022

Quote:
The headline probably has you thinking about the high cost of the EV – so high that whatever you “save” by not buying gas ends up costing you a great deal. But that is only one of the ways EVs don’t save you money.

More...

https://www.ericpetersautos.com/2022/05/19/how-evs-dont-save-you-money/
Sunoverbeach Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 11,826
CelticBomber wrote:
EV's are worse than that. But, that's a different bull for a different time. I need to get my 8 seconds on the one I'm riding now. whip

^^ This

A few general points:
Both cobalt and lithium mining create pollution in existing water sources in the area of excavation.

The excavation of both adds to air pollution, greenhouse gasses and such.

The excavation process of Li in salt flats are a huge water demand and depletes the local water table, damaging the local ecosystem and farming industry.

Common Li mining byproducts are sulfuric acid and uranium.

Documented human rights issues in particular with Co mining, i.e. child labor and forced labor

Large energy demand for mining efforts, i.e. heavy equipment using fossil fuels

Large energy demand in battery production, the majority of which takes place in countries with lessened env controls compared to US/Europe

Significant health effects to workers extracting these minerals, respiratory, heart, etc.

I'm not much of a link poster, but there are numerous articles out there. Get to Googling

I think overall, the carbon footprint reduction idea is beneficial. However, I think the current push to enact these measures is not taking a holistic view of possible side effects to the environment. What good is reducing fossil fuels if whole ecosystems are destroyed to do so? My belief is that there will need to be a significant breakthrough in battery technology to make EVs as well as renewable energy sources feasible from a sustainability and reliability standpoint.
ZRX1200 Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 57,451
We only care about the solutions that fit our donations and goals.

Sincerely,
Politicians

*ZRX1200 translator app*
Brewha Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
Mike3316 wrote:
If you bought an EV because it costs less to "fill" than a gas vehicle - so be it. If you bought it because you THINK you're saving the envrionment then you're delusional. EVs are an ecological DISASTER in the making! It could be you're just virtue signaling for green social cred. My first questions to EV cheerleaders - where do you think the electric come from that you're charging your car with? Where is the electric going to come from if 150 million Americans buy EVs next year? And how - pray tell - do you expect our already strained electric grid to handle that kind of load increase?


I bought an EV because it does 0-60 in 4.2 seconds, handles better than 3 series, and drives itself.
Bonus material includes never going to a gas station, have oil changes or needing a tune up.

Electricity comes from many sources. And we are trying to move to more wind, solar, etc. sources - but a lot of knuckle draggers and oil money are slowing us down.

Oh, the car changes at night in my garage - off peak. So no strain on the grid, and a full charge each morning.


Mike, have you thought this through at all?
Brewha Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
BuckyB93 wrote:
Not a big fan of quoting RayR but this fact can't be overlooked.

All "green energy" requires mother nature to cooperate. Solar needs sunlight, wind power needs wind. You can only store so much saved up energy in a battery system. Like Honey Badger, Mother nature don't give a $hit. Renewable energy sources produce inconsistent amounts of power that vary by the season and weather,

If mother nature doesn't comply, then you get no energy from these technologies - technologies that so far have been held up via and buoyed government grants, tax credits, subsides, etc...

Humans want and need energy on demand. Green energy "solutions" so far cannot supply that.

There is no one simple cure to the human and current society's energy demand. Wind, solar, geothermal all have a place in the puzzle but fossil fuels are still the king and will be in our life time.

Try to heat a house in northern latitudes using solar - it ain't happening.

Brewha had mentioned in another post that Tesla's Powerwall is an answer for the average consumer.

Facts:
Tesla Powerwall system can store up to 13.5 kWh of backup electricity.
https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/pdfs/powerwall/Powerwall%202_AC_Datasheet_en_northamerica.pdf

An average household consumes about 30 kWh per day.
https://us.sunpower.com/how-many-solar-panels-do-you-need-panel-size-and-output-factors[/b]

So one of the leaders' solution for using solar power technology for residential use can only store just under half of a day's worth of electricity that is needed to run an average household. Let's not forget, this is on the high end when the weather cooperates an your solar panels are running at peak efficiency (the most efficient solar panels peak out at about 23% efficient).
https://www.cleanenergyreviews.info/blog/most-efficient-solar-panels


Doesn't sound like a viable solution to an energy crisis to me.


The question is "how many power walls does your home need for your use". One wall (battery) is not the limit.

The idea here is transitioning to power self generation and green solutions. And no, not everything works everywhere. But if I put a solar roof on my house in Texas and 2 power walls in the garage I would be selling power back to the grid and only rarely need to draw off of it.

If we cut our national electricity usage by half because of solar and wind, would it be a good thing?
BuckyB93 Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 12,420
Cut it by 50%? Do you have a reliable source with real life data that can support your pie in the sky claim?
RayR Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 5,929
If we cut our national electricity usage by half, wouldn't we be in 3rd world territory? Foolishly trying to forcefully switch to solar and wind would certainly achieve that.
Sunoverbeach Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 11,826
Brewha, I'm not sure I understand. The source of power generation wouldn't affect electrical usage. Rather fully embracing electric versions of traditional fuel powered equipment would increase electric demand would it not?
Brewha Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
BuckyB93 wrote:
Cut it by 50%? Do you have a reliable source with real life data that can support your pie in the sky claim?

Read a little slower Bucky. I did not make a claim, I asked you if it would be good.
Would it not be?

I ask that you remember what America did in the Second World War. We mobilized and changed over to production of what we needed. This country can do anything.

If we decided to go green, it could take decades. But in 20-30 years 50% Green energy production is not far fetched.
And yes, I’m an engineer and I know of such things. In fact, we could do much better, but for the stupidity and unwillingness to change fueled by those that profit from a lack of change - read big oil.

It’s like touching the moon. All we need to do is decide to go there.

Brewha Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
Sunoverbeach wrote:
Brewha, I'm not sure I understand. The source of power generation wouldn't affect electrical usage. Rather fully embracing electric versions of traditional fuel powered equipment would increase electric demand would it not?


Yes, but electrical is cleaner and more efficient.
It also can be produced locally at the home level. Not to mention site industrial production, like making warehouses and Walmarts put solar panels on their roofs.

And more efficient vehicle use less energy.

Gas cars use about 20% of the energy they burn. Electrics use about 80% of their power. Do the math.
If you are looking at energy usage, that is a 4:1 ratio.




Think I’m blowing smoke? Nissan has been working on ultra high efficiency onboard motors that burn gas to do nothing but run a generator for their electric cars.

In the end, Hydrogen cars and the answer. Toyota knows this. But infrastructure is too big of a problem.
Maybe in 50 years…..
Brewha Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
Whistlebritches wrote:
P.T. Barnum said it best................"There’s a sucker born every minute". Brew intellectual idiots fall into this category, relish in it

So…..what do you spend on gas a month?
MACS Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 75,480
Seems to me the ones profiting are the companies propped up ONLY by our tax dollars. Wind... and Solar... without the subsidies they'd have died on the vine.

Lets pile more onto those trillions in debt. Was bad when a repub did it... but dems are now wanting to spend more to go green?

I'm shocked! Shocked, I tell you.
Brewha Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
MACS wrote:
Seems to me the ones profiting are the companies propped up ONLY by our tax dollars. Wind... and Solar... without the subsidies they'd have died on the vine.

Lets pile more onto those trillions in debt. Was bad when a repub did it... but dems are now wanting to spend more to go green?

I'm shocked! Shocked, I tell you.

That you are shocked is predictable.

You thought Covid vaccine was a waste of taxpayer dollars, right?

Macs, buddy - as a liberal, you sux.
Sunoverbeach Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 11,826
He's not a liberal. Just a Democrat

I don't disagree in hydrogen, eventually, maybe. Infrastructure's not the only problem. Hydrogen vehicles currently don't have the same oomph as electric nor even internal combustion. We wanna go fast. No we don't need to, but we want to, and the market won't buy in until they do.

As for EVs, again eventually, and probably. Current production methods have their own inherent issues as listed above. Seriously bad mojo going on with Li ion battery production right now.
Brewha Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
Sunoverbeach wrote:
He's not a liberal. Just a Democrat

I don't disagree in hydrogen, eventually, maybe. Infrastructure's not the only problem. Hydrogen vehicles currently don't have the same oomph as electric nor even internal combustion. We wanna go fast. No we don't need to, but we want to, and the market won't buy in until they do.

As for EVs, again eventually, and probably. Current production methods have their own inherent issues as listed above. Seriously bad mojo going on with Li ion battery production right now.

Ok “closet liberal”.


A fuel cell tied to a capacitive battery - or just a small NCA battery- would provide all the oomph of a BEV. You need not have a redox reaction at full gain all the time, just like you don’t need maximum power all the time. The best BEV today sells with a 2 second 0-60 time - kinda crazy - wish I had $130k to spend….

They have begun to switch from NCA to LFP batteries on non performance models. These are MUCH better and longer lasting batteries. They just don’t have the storage or capacity per pound of NCA.



For those playing our home game;
BEV - Battery Electric Vehicle
NCA - Nickel Cobalt Aluminum oxide
LFP - Lithium Iron Phosphate
Fuel Cell - Mixes hydrogen gas with air oxygen to make water and electricity
frankj1 Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 41,993
waste disposal companies balked at recycling.
Guess who realized they were the natural industry to expand into it.

Guess what current industries will probably realize the opportunity being created to produce energy.

They'll figure it out.
MACS Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 75,480
Brewha wrote:
That you are shocked is predictable.

You thought Covid vaccine was a waste of taxpayer dollars, right?

Macs, buddy - as a liberal, you sux.


100% - it doesn't work. You take a shot, another shot and how many boosters... and you STILL get covid?

That you think it was a good idea is also predictable. You ain't real bright.

You Dems hate companies that profiteer, right? WTF do you think the pharmaceutical companies did, there?? Sold you snake oil, dumbass.
Whistlebritches Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 04-23-2006
Posts: 21,713
CelticBomber wrote:
Congratulations! You just regurgitated the Republican talking points! Have a great day and don't forget to Make Us Great Again!

Try reading economic reports and the industries own reporting. Oil and natural gas output and inventories in the U.S. and around the global are back to pre-pandemic levels. Both Oil and Natural gas production is the U.S. are rising, not falling. Oil and gas companies that posted losses during the pandemic have recovered those losses x2 and for some companies x4. Record profits. That includes pre-pandemic numbers.

It wasn't Biden who put a halt to new leases while they decide climate policy. A Republican Federal judge (A Trump appointee) did when he granted an injunction against the way they were calculating the real world cost of pollution, the "Social Cost of Carbon". Trump essentially did away with using the SCC number and disbanded the agency responsible for calculating it because they were using a number based on world wide emissions. The Trump admin wanted to use a number based only on U.S. emissions, which they then ignored and basically set the number to zero after a different judge blocked the Trump admin's own plans to dismantle emissions regulations. The Biden admin is trying to restore that number to how it was calculated before the Trump admin. This affects everything from methane emissions for drilling to carbon emission from coal plants to how automakers calculate MPG.

That ruling had a ripple affect across multiple agencies who now have to sit down and reevaluate multiple policies. This means, by law, they have to redo studies, create new models, etc. etc, ad nauseam bureaucracy before new leases can be granted. It's not costing the oil and gas industry a dime. It's all going to come out of our pocket. But..... !

WHO CARES! It's Biden's fault! Dumb Liberals! Probably some snowflakes involved too! <---- The noised used to distract everyone while the energy industries go about their day.

Tuesday's are for golf. Thursday's it's baby seal clubbing. Fridays are guess the endangered animal mystery meat potluck. It's a rough life for an oil industry exec. They take Saturday through Monday off. Wednesdays are for... well, we don't talk about Wednesdays. Shhh



Sweet Jesus...........this isn't regurgitated talking points,bout 98.2% of your diatribe is fantasy bullschit fed to you by the democrat party.Keep throwing schit against the wall hoping it'll eventually stick.Nice try CB
Sunoverbeach Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 11,826
There are two kinds of people in the world …
Dead and alive.
BuckyB93 Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 12,420
frankj1 wrote:
waste disposal companies balked at recycling.
Guess who realized they were the natural industry to expand into it.

Guess what current industries will probably realize the opportunity being created to produce energy.

They'll figure it out.


More misinformation that you've been fed. The only materials that are worth any time or energy to recycle are paper, glass and metal. "Standard" glass can (ideally) be recycled indefinitely. These are standard bottles, jars, and stuff. This doesn't include glass cookware, auto glass, light bulbs, etc... But the bottles and jars need to be clean of labels, food stuff and other contaminates. Additionally, glass at typical recycling processing plants add another headache. Crushed glass is abrasive and wears out processing machinery.

Recycled paper and metal also have diminishing returns on how many times they can be recycled. Recycled paper, glass and metal are only used as part of a mix with virgin materials.

I'm not saying it's not a good idea to recycle. I encourage recycling, repurposing and composting organic matter. I'm just saying recycling as it stands now and how it's portrayed as "saving the planet" is not as green and shiny clean as many think it is.

Plastics? Fuggedaboutit.

Most of the plastic that you put in your recycle bin gets shipped off to some foreign country for them to handle. Most of that never even gets recycled into other products. Contamination is the main reason. The food and other stuff that your plastic containers were used for are contaminates so unless you wash and rinse them, they are still garbage. Even "clean" plastics degrade each time through the "recycling" process. When you see a plastic package that says "made from recycled plastic" they are mostly talking about pre-consumer plastic. These are the bits and pieces that get cut off of the molded product which is ground up and mixed with virgin plastic. All of your plastic bags, straws, cups, wrappers... recycling companies HATE these things. They have zero use in a recycling stream. All they do is gum up their machinery and are a safety hazard for the workers.
BuckyB93 Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 12,420
Brewha wrote:
Read a little slower Bucky. I did not make a claim, I asked you if it would be good.
Would it not be?

I ask that you remember what America did in the Second World War. We mobilized and changed over to production of what we needed. This country can do anything.

If we decided to go green, it could take decades. But in 20-30 years 50% Green energy production is not far fetched.
And yes, I’m an engineer and I know of such things. In fact, we could do much better, but for the stupidity and unwillingness to change fueled by those that profit from a lack of change - read big oil.

It’s like touching the moon. All we need to do is decide to go there.



Would it be good to cut our electricity use by 50%? I guess so but at what cost? Convenience and quality of life.

(you deleted your post or edited it from when you said that we should cut down our electrical consumption by 50% by using green energy solutions or something to that effect)

I challenge you to cut your electric footprint by 50% - set an example for all of us to follow.

Turn off your AC, unplug your refrigerator, unscrew all of your light bulbs, don't turn on your TV or computer or radio, don't charge your cell phone, don't charge your EV, don't run the dishwasher or wash and dry clothes, hope you don't have a pump in a well for fresh water because you'll need to turn that off too. Not having flowing water is no biggie. You can collect rain water and $hit and piss in an outhouse.

No cooking of food if you have an electric stove/oven. I guess you could cook if you have natural gas but then you're burning fossil fuels which is a no-no in your world. Want a hot shower or warm water? You can only do that on Monday, Wed, and Friday ... go completely dark for 3 out of the 7 days a week.

3 out of 7 is actually less than 50% but I'll give you a half day so you can turn everything back on. Or you could just trip the main circuit breaker to the house and live "off the grid" for 3 out of 7 days.

Report back on how it's working out for you. But make sure your post is only on one of the 4 days that you are allowed to use electricity.
BuckyB93 Offline
#39 Posted:
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 12,420
Tirty NINE!
Sunoverbeach Offline
#40 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 11,826
His post is is still up there Bucky, and I took it as a declaration due to generation source too. He's clarified it as more of a hypothetical statement
Brewha Offline
#41 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
BuckyB93 wrote:
Would it be good to cut our electricity use by 50%? I guess so but at what cost? Convenience and quality of life.

(you deleted your post or edited it from when you said that we should cut down our electrical consumption by 50% by using green energy solutions or something to that effect)

I challenge you to cut your electric footprint by 50% - set an example for all of us to follow.

Turn off your AC, unplug your refrigerator, unscrew all of your light bulbs, don't turn on your TV or computer or radio, don't charge your cell phone, don't charge your EV, don't run the dishwasher or wash and dry clothes, hope you don't have a pump in a well for fresh water because you'll need to turn that off too. Not having flowing water is no biggie. You can collect rain water and $hit and piss in an outhouse.

No cooking of food if you have an electric stove/oven. I guess you could cook if you have natural gas but then you're burning fossil fuels which is a no-no in your world. Want a hot shower or warm water? You can only do that on Monday, Wed, and Friday ... go completely dark for 3 out of the 7 days a week.

3 out of 7 is actually less than 50% but I'll give you a half day so you can turn everything back on. Or you could just trip the main circuit breaker to the house and live "off the grid" for 3 out of 7 days.

Report back on how it's working out for you. But make sure your post is only on one of the 4 days that you are allowed to use electricity.


My bad for being unclear. I was talking about substituting our energy production with green, renewable sources. So that 50% of our energy comes from a combination of hydropower, solar, wind, geothermal, wave, tidal and modern biofuels - as opposed to fossil fuels. I did not mean that we would just use half as much.

wadda ya think - good goal?
Brewha Offline
#42 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
MACS wrote:
100% - it doesn't work. You take a shot, another shot and how many boosters... and you STILL get covid?

That you think it was a good idea is also predictable. You ain't real bright.

You Dems hate companies that profiteer, right? WTF do you think the pharmaceutical companies did, there?? Sold you snake oil, dumbass.

MACS you are as constant and the North Star.
(constantly in the dark that is)

You just keep on calling out us dumbasses - you serve as a fine example to us all.
BuckyB93 Offline
#43 Posted:
Joined: 07-16-2004
Posts: 12,420
Brewha wrote:
My bad for being unclear. I was talking about substituting our energy production with green, renewable sources. So that 50% of our energy comes from a combination of hydropower, solar, wind, geothermal, wave, tidal and modern biofuels - as opposed to fossil fuels. I did not mean that we would just use half as much.

wadda ya think - good goal?


In short, yes, I agree that this would be a good goal.

Brewha wrote:
Yes, but electrical is cleaner and more efficient.
It also can be produced locally at the home level. Not to mention site industrial production, like making warehouses and Walmarts put solar panels on their roofs.


The roof of my local circus, errr... Walmart, is filled with solar panels.

Google earth snapshot:
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?msa=0&mid=1df8ZfPOa4SbFZm7otNjYL7RdHEU&ll=42.55144048008943%2C-71.99403120392782&z=19

The next closest one to me also has them too but not as many.
https://www.google.com/maps/contrib/109909117216251984677/reviews/@42.5885541,-72.2841665,206m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m3!8m2!3m1!1e1

Not sure how prevalent they are at all Walmart's but I don't think my area is anything special or an exception.

There are solar plots dotted around the area on plots of land not deemed worthy for commercial, industrial or residential building. One in town is on and old junk yard where the soil is probably pretty sucky from scrap cars and $hit sitting there when the junk yard was in operation way back in the day

The local hospital put in covered parking areas in their parking lot, the roofs of these carport thingies are all solar panels
Google earth snapshot:
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?msa=0&mid=1df8ZfPOa4SbFZm7otNjYL7RdHEU&ll=42.58863930615288%2C-71.98700075092994&z=18

We have 4 or 5 wind turbines in our town and the neighboring towns and they seem to be spinning most days. The two turbines at the local community college can be seen in the Google earth snapshot (above) across the street from the hospital. The college also has solar panels that cover a good portion of the roof on the main building.

So yes, I think it's a good idea to install solar panels on available spaces such as these which wouldn't be used otherwise.
HockeyDad Offline
#44 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 43,503
I have solar panels on the roof of my house because I care a little more for the environment than you people.
Brewha Offline
#45 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
This is all I'm getting at. We can transition to more and more clearer energy production - a good thing.

And we have started the transition to more efficient use of power. Moving to LED bulbs in stead of incandescent is better than a 6:1 power savings.

Sort of like getting the lead out of gas (a really, really good thing) we just need to do it.
Brewha Offline
#46 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
HockeyDad wrote:
I have solar panels on the roof of my house because I care a little more for the environment than you people.

You're a credit to your race....
CelticBomber Offline
#47 Posted:
Joined: 05-03-2012
Posts: 6,697
Whistlebritches wrote:
Sweet Jesus...........this isn't regurgitated talking points,bout 98.2% of your diatribe is fantasy bullschit fed to you by the democrat party.Keep throwing schit against the wall hoping it'll eventually stick.Nice try CB


"Well raccoons tried to get in our back porch, Momma just chase 'em off with a broom!" - Forrest Gump

I wonder if it works with trolls?

Having met or seen a lot of you I'm thinking I'll need a bigger broom...

"You go in the cage, cage goes in the water, you go in the water. Troll's in the water, our troll. Farewell and Adieu to you fair Spanish ladies, Farewell and Adieu you ladies of Spain, for we've received orders to sail back to Boston, and so never more shall we see you again."

Sigh. I'm going to be quoting that movie all day now.
HockeyDad Offline
#48 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 43,503
Brewha wrote:
You're a credit to your race....


You should look into installing a solar energy system on your house.

It signals that you care.
Brewha Offline
#49 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 10,780
HockeyDad wrote:
You should look into installing a solar energy system on your house.

It signals that you care.

That would be a false flag.....
HockeyDad Offline
#50 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 43,503
Brewha wrote:
That would be a false flag.....


You should look into it. It is an incredible transformation that I assume you want to be a part of going forward.
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