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Last post 2 weeks ago by RayR. 27 replies replies.
Why are or aren't election results credible to you?
rfenst Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 37,174
Thoughts on WHY?
Cheno Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 06-06-2019
Posts: 1,665
Elections are rigged so one of the main parties win. We need to stop with the two party system. Yes obviously we have independents and Greens and so on. But that's how the media and things really are let's be honest. You have too many uniformed voters that just vote for "their" party because that's what the media tells them too and what they see or hear around the house. Nobody thinks for themselves. If we go away from the two main party system that we use and candidates can ONLY say what their opinions on topics are people will be surprised who they vote. I can't believe how many countless people have admitted they voted for a certain party and asked questions about said party/politicians views they totally disagree with them and said they wouldn't vote for that person. Trick was they didn't know who that person was who had the view. When they found out that it who they voted for they were shocked. This happens way too much. We need to change this so we have actual informed voters.
MACS Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 76,478
There are too many ways to cheat the system. See Arizona. Governor candidate is in charge of the election. Predominantly republican districts have issues with machines. Not democrat areas... republican. Nothing to see here, right?

You worked the polls in Fl, right? Did you see any shenanigans?

The majority of states do not have the same voting laws as FL and they should.
rfenst Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 37,174
Cheno wrote:
Elections are rigged so one of the main parties win. We need to stop with the two party system. Yes obviously we have independents and Greens and so on. But that's how the media and things really are let's be honest. You have too many uniformed voters that just vote for "their" party because that's what the media tells them too and what they see or hear around the house. Nobody thinks for themselves. If we go away from the two main party system that we use and candidates can ONLY say what their opinions on topics are people will be surprised who they vote. I can't believe how many countless people have admitted they voted for a certain party and asked questions about said party/politicians views they totally disagree with them and said they wouldn't vote for that person. Trick was they didn't know who that person was who had the view. When they found out that it who they voted for they were shocked. This happens way too much. We need to change this so we have actual informed voters.

Eliminate the uneducated or provide more education to voters? I don't care why or who someone votes for, as long as they vote.
rfenst Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 37,174
MACS wrote:
There are too many ways to cheat the system. See Arizona. Governor candidate is in charge of the election. Predominantly republican districts have issues with machines. Not democrat areas... republican. Nothing to see here, right?

You worked the polls in Fl, right? Did you see any shenanigans?

The majority of states do not have the same voting laws as FL and they should.

Zero shenanigans in my county and I am confident the vote count is accurate, given all the built-in security.

I discussed the issue of his re-election with our county Supervisor of Elections. He is allowed to preside over his re-election campaign, but can't sit on the canvassing board (which determines the legitimacy of voter signatures in question and improperly voted ballots that come through) or have any thing to do with handling ballots or scanners until he or his opponent concedes. Given how much effort, labor and brain-power it takes to run a proper election, who else should be in charge of everything else, given this?
rfenst Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 37,174
MACS wrote:

The majority of states do not have the same voting laws as FL and they should.

I think for now it is a States' Rights issue.

But, Florida did get it right uber early b/c we started counting mail-in and drop-box ballots, without reporting results, during Early Voting (which lasts approx. 15 days before election day).
MACS Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 76,478
rfenst wrote:
I think for now it is a States' Rights issue.

But, Florida did get it right uber early b/c we started counting mail-in and drop-box ballots, without reporting results, during Early Voting (which lasts approx. 15 days before election day).


Not a fan of the weeks long voting, either. It was called "election day" and there are far fewer chances to game the system if you do it all in ONE damn day. Start at 0500... end at 2000. That's 15 hours to get your dumb ass to the polls.

No reason that can't be done and the results tabulated by the close of bidness next day.
8trackdisco Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 11-06-2004
Posts: 57,594
Cheno wrote:
Elections are rigged so one of the main parties win. We need to stop with the two party system. Yes obviously we have independents and Greens and so on. But that's how the media and things really are let's be honest. You have too many uniformed voters that just vote for "their" party because that's what the media tells them too and what they see or hear around the house. Nobody thinks for themselves. If we go away from the two main party system that we use and candidates can ONLY say what their opinions on topics are people will be surprised who they vote. I can't believe how many countless people have admitted they voted for a certain party and asked questions about said party/politicians views they totally disagree with them and said they wouldn't vote for that person. Trick was they didn't know who that person was who had the view. When they found out that it who they voted for they were shocked. This happens way too much. We need to change this so we have actual informed voters.


Eloquent. Agree.

Do I have faith in our voting system? Wish I had more faith, but I have more faith the voting system is more legit than many of the Dems & Reps who when challenged about irregularities, only shout and point at their opponents and their alleged, dastardly deeds.

Once people decide to solve problems instead of bichting about the impacts of the problems, we'll get somewhere.
8trackdisco Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 11-06-2004
Posts: 57,594
MACS wrote:
Not a fan of the weeks long voting, either. It was called "election day" and there are far fewer chances to game the system if you do it all in ONE damn day. Start at 0500... end at 2000. That's 15 hours to get your dumb ass to the polls.

No reason that can't be done and the results tabulated by the close of bidness next day.


Used to think that, now knowing some First Responders, Cops, Firemen, etc. have issues getting in on one day.
Vacations, funerals, full time single parents with daycare issues, illness. I can see expanding beyond Election Day, but how far before, when to count them and when to announce.

A reasonable standard set down from the federal level would solve a lot of issues. It would also create problems we don't have currently.

The nature of the beast.

Shawn,
Did you vote on Election Day?
Gene363 Online
#10 Posted:
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 28,772
rfenst wrote:
Thoughts on WHY?


rfenst wrote:
Thoughts on WHY?


Because the democrats insist some voters are denied a vote and republicans insist other voters voted illegally. As long as that continues, there will be no confidence in our elections. IMO, we need a decision from Solomon, perhaps chop off the heads of both parties.

We need a nonpolitical reformation of voting practices with nothing but 100% sunshine on the process from start to finish to restore confidence in the voting system. *


* Unfortunately, idiots can still vote and politicians are still for sale so we're still screwed. Frying pan
Sunoverbeach Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 13,221
If the earth was actually flat, we could just push garbage off the edge
frankj1 Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 42,718
lot's of people working two and three jobs and taking care of children or parents or both...we don't hear from them here cuz they are too busy.

whatever we can do to get more people to take part in Democracy strengthens Democracy, no matter who wins an election.

Hung up on an Election Day only thing? Get over it. The world has changed.

Worried that more voters means your side might lose?
Run more attractive candidates instead of trying to have less votes count.

Yup. I think the results have been credible, Robert.
HockeyDad Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 44,242
Sunoverbeach wrote:
If the earth was actually flat, we could just push garbage off the edge


That is true but what also is true is if you were stationed at Camp LeJeune between 1955 and 1972 you could be eligible for additional government benefits. Call the law offices of Torch, Pitchfork & and Culpepper. Operators are standing by.
RayR Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 6,460
frankj1 wrote:
whatever we can do to get more people to take part in Democracy strengthens Democracy, no matter who wins an election.


Frank, yer still kind of sappy about that sacred duhmacracy thing, ain't ya?

I don't believe in any mystical power attached to the act of voting.
I don't see where the more people taking part in duhmacracy or putting more things up to a vote whether it's through people directly voting or through their representatives improves anything other than putting more DUH! in democracy.

If John Adams was right about anything it was the keen historical observance held by many of the founding generation that “Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide.”
So when you use LEFTY talk like "Democracy strengthens Democracy", you are unwittingly advancing the suicide of America and it's culture.



Huzza3045 Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 11-07-2022
Posts: 31
Honestly, I feel like both sides cheat pretty bad. I just hope that each side cheats equally enough that elections become fair. 😂
DrMaddVibe Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 52,896
rfenst wrote:
Thoughts on WHY?


The counting of the ballots is the issue I have with the results. There really should be no machines involved with this. Paper ballots and should be held for 10 years. The tabulation should be done the night of the election. No excuses. At all. Have an issue with a recount...you pay for dragging them all out and the qualified people needed to do it with YOUR money. That would shut a lot of complainers down right there.

Both sides have claimed cheating. There is a problem. After what Florida went through with the "Dangling chad" debacle where tabulators were manhandling the ballots to get either a desired read or void one we fixed it. Seeing grown people with magnifying glasses holding up ballots with a twit look on their face isn't something I ever want to see on the evening news again.

I do like the Election Day becoming a national holiday. That's a great start. Want to do early voting like we in Florida do, I don't really like it but 100's of thousands do. Just as long as they get counted. Personally, I'd end mailing out ballots to everyone. Exceptions to the that would be military stationed overseas, handicapped and like previously noted Emergency (police, fire and paramedics) personnel. In a lot of cases the voting booths are in fire stations. If it was a national holiday, there wouldn't be an excuse to not vote. If you didn't make it to the polling station...you're lazy and didn't want to.

I'd like to see REAL debates. Not the garbage we have now. Questions would be submitted by voters ahead of time and there wouldn't be time constraints to answering them. Point, counterpoint and rebuttal...all parties on the stage. Real Lincoln-Douglas style debating. I feel like both parties hide behind their messaging and a lot gets buried that would be exposed with that format. No, interrupting either. You don't need to, because you'd have all the time to readdress later without some smug talking head in a suit picking sides and what they've determined to be important. You would see the brain matter being worked in front of your face, but in the case of Pennsylvania that's not important to them.
deadeyedick Online
#17 Posted:
Joined: 03-13-2003
Posts: 15,033
rfenst wrote:
I think for now it is a States' Rights issue.

But, Florida did get it right uber early b/c we started counting mail-in and drop-box ballots, without reporting results, during Early Voting (which lasts approx. 15 days before election day).


Why is that not just as ripe for fraud or an unauthorized leak of results that would taint the election? Just wandering.
J&K11 Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 08-20-2021
Posts: 37
Five things I trust more than election results post 2020

1.) Gas station sushi

2.) A strang lump in my neck

3.) A fart with a bad case of diarrhea

4.) A cold drink from Bill Cosby

5.) A walk down a dark alley after agreeing to testify
against a Clinton

RayR Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 6,460
+1 on #18

The problem with duhmacracy is that there are politicians and voters.

Duhmocracy is inherently a corrupt political system and direct duhmocracy is the worst of it. LEFTY pols like that which is why they are always saying that word DUHMACRACY ad nauseum, saying RIGHTIES are a threat to DUHMACRACY, DUHMACRACY is under ATACK!, stuff like that.. They tell you that if you do not accept what they tell you duhmacracy is, then you are a deplorable rotten extremist prole.

Most people don't make voting decisions based on examination of facts like, is the candidate and their toadies lying' cheating scoundrels? Is the candidate playing me for a fool? Is the candidate basically a political criminal proposing policies that are immoral, unconstitutional and threaten to tear apart the very fabric of civilization? Nope, no such questions come to mind, Instead they make decisions on the basis of their social identity, who is pandering to them the most sweetly, promising to give them the most free stuff, and party affiliation.
frankj1 Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 42,718
lots of mind readers here, and only people here are able to assess things properly to be able to vote correctly...

Brewha Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 11,050
I think the whole thing is a well contrived working to limit voter participation - for certain peoples...
RayR Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 6,460
frankj1 wrote:
lots of mind readers here, and only people here are able to assess things properly to be able to vote correctly...



Mind reading unnecessary, if you've seen the movie over and over before and didn't fall asleep getting drunk on the messianic moonshine of duhmacracy.

Brewha drank it deep, he's got the LEFTY spiel down pat, if you want stuff like proof of eligibility to vote or are have serious suspicions about mass mail-in voting and ballot harvesting that means you are just a bad person that wants to "limit voter participation" and are probably a racist.

Sunoverbeach Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2017
Posts: 13,221
You've likely never been the first or last person to step anywhere
Abrignac Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 16,291
RayR wrote:
Frank, yer still kind of sappy about that sacred duhmacracy thing, ain't ya?

I don't believe in any mystical power attached to the act of voting.
I don't see where the more people taking part in duhmacracy or putting more things up to a vote whether it's through people directly voting or through their representatives improves anything other than putting more DUH! in democracy.

If John Adams was right about anything it was the keen historical observance held by many of the founding generation that “Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide.”
So when you use LEFTY talk like "Democracy strengthens Democracy", you are unwittingly advancing the suicide of America and it's culture.





So you would rather be governed by a system with decision makers that you don’t have a hand in picking?
frankj1 Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 42,718
Abrignac wrote:
So you would rather be governed by a system with decision makers that you don’t have a hand in picking?

(Hockey) Dad said we can't play wif ray no mo'.
ZRX1200 Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 57,997
https://www.ksbw.com/amp/article/ballots-found-in-santa-cruz-mountains-now-in-hands-of-federal-investigators/41961998
RayR Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 07-20-2020
Posts: 6,460
ZRX1200 wrote:
https://www.ksbw.com/amp/article/ballots-found-in-santa-cruz-mountains-now-in-hands-of-federal-investigators/41961998


Those Witkins people aren't real smart are they? Even though their ballots were found at the bottom of the ravine with all the others, they still believe in the integrity and the professionalism of election system. Even though they lost their sacred votes, their hand at choosing their decision makers in Casino Duhmacracy, they are excited that postal officials in Washington, D.C. are looking into it.
It's part of what's called "Battered Citizen Syndrome: the more debacles, the more voters cling to faith in their rulers."

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