America's #1 Online Cigar Auction
first, best, biggest!

Last post 4 years ago by tailgater. 72 replies replies.
2 Pages<12
Crisis.
Jump to Bottom | Previous Topic | Next Topic
victor809 Offline
#51 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 11:00 AM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
tailgater wrote:
So let's be clear.

According to victor since a subject has been brought up previously and opinions have been stated, one should not ask a specific person to answer a question in regards to a statement they make.

Do you even hear yourself?
The person who has given new meaning to the term ad nauseam is telling other people when they can or can't ask a question.

Holy f'king sh*t you're stupid.



Mhmmm. This isn't "a subject" This has been 98.2% of all news coverage the past 2 weeks.

You aren't actually looking for an answer. Nothing anyone says to answer your question would be accepted. Don't get all butthurt because I'm pointing that out.

You want to pretend you haven't been exposed to any number of news articles identifying things twitler did wrong in his response to the pandemic. And now you are pretending you don't understand the concept of "do the opposite of that." or "do the thing they criticized him for not doing".

It's tiring under the best conditions. This little play acting you're doing now strains credibility to the breaking point.
Brewha Offline
#52 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 12:02 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,161
tailgater wrote:
I'm curious how you define "fail" in this case.

What would a different leader have done that wouldn't be considered failure?

In fairness, the crisis is still at hand and on going. Lots of time to succeed or fail.

So far, the decision to act early, give consistent information and be aligned with scientific experts has been consummate failures on his part. Called it a hoax, did.

A better leader would have acted early, been aligned with experts and not shot his mouth off like an idiot.
HockeyDad Offline
#53 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 1:07 PM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,112
When Trump shut down all flights from China, was that a leader acting early or xenophobic?

I can’t recall.
victor809 Offline
#54 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 1:13 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
HockeyDad wrote:
When Trump shut down all flights from China, was that a leader acting early or xenophobic?

I can’t recall.


Neither, since that wasn't what he did.

He shut down travel from china for non US citizens.

US citizens were still able to fly to and from china, including Wuhan. There was no quarantine time following return for US citizens.

Hell, I flew to and from China in mid January, just the week before the entire country went into lockdown. I traveled through multiple airports in China, two different cities, shared family style meals with a ton of people and when I returned there was no issues re-entering the country.

hell, one of the early COVID cases in the midwest was from a traveler through ORD the same day I went through.

Given that a virus does not understand the concept of nationality, only closing a border to citizens of a specific country, not all travelers from that country, is basically useless.
HockeyDad Offline
#55 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 1:35 PM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,112
You were safe flying there in January because that was impeachment month and that kept the virus contained.


January 31st

The Trump administration on Friday dramatically escalated its response to the fast-spreading coronavirus epidemic by announcing quarantines and major travel restrictions that officials said were meant to limit contagion.

The measures, which could affect thousands of people around the world, represented a marked expansion of the federal government’s response after initially downplaying potential risks.

The White House declared a “public health emergency” and — beginning on Sunday at 5 p.m. — will bar non-U.S. citizens who recently visited China from entering the United States, subject to a few exemptions. Shortly after the White House announced the new restrictions and said there were six confirmed U.S. cases, a seventh case was confirmed in Santa Clara County, Calif.

Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar also said the Trump administration would quarantine any Americans who had visited China’s Hubei province, where the disease originated, within the past 14 days. The government will also require screening and self-quarantines for all other Americans who recently visited any other parts of China. Officials said the self-quarantine rules would require individuals to stay in their homes for a certain length of time, monitor themselves for certain symptoms such as coughing, and check their temperatures and report them to local health officials.
tailgater Offline
#56 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 1:45 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
Mhmmm. This isn't "a subject" This has been 98.2% of all news coverage the past 2 weeks.

You aren't actually looking for an answer. Nothing anyone says to answer your question would be accepted. Don't get all butthurt because I'm pointing that out.

You want to pretend you haven't been exposed to any number of news articles identifying things twitler did wrong in his response to the pandemic. And now you are pretending you don't understand the concept of "do the opposite of that." or "do the thing they criticized him for not doing".

It's tiring under the best conditions. This little play acting you're doing now strains credibility to the breaking point.


I'm not asking Karen from the internet.
I was asking the same person who introduced an opinion about Trump failing.
The fact that you refuse to admit this shows your burning desire to be nothing better than a troll.
tailgater Offline
#57 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 1:51 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Brewha wrote:
In fairness, the crisis is still at hand and on going. Lots of time to succeed or fail.

So far, the decision to act early, give consistent information and be aligned with scientific experts has been consummate failures on his part. Called it a hoax, did.

A better leader would have acted early, been aligned with experts and not shot his mouth off like an idiot.


An honest answer, thank you.
But I'm truly not asking for a consensus here.
I was asking Speyside.
victor809 Offline
#58 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 3:32 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
HockeyDad wrote:
You were safe flying there in January because that was impeachment month and that kept the virus contained.


January 31st

The Trump administration on Friday dramatically escalated its response to the fast-spreading coronavirus epidemic by announcing quarantines and major travel restrictions that officials said were meant to limit contagion.

The measures, which could affect thousands of people around the world, represented a marked expansion of the federal government’s response after initially downplaying potential risks.

The White House declared a “public health emergency” and — beginning on Sunday at 5 p.m. — will bar non-U.S. citizens who recently visited China from entering the United States, subject to a few exemptions. Shortly after the White House announced the new restrictions and said there were six confirmed U.S. cases, a seventh case was confirmed in Santa Clara County, Calif.

Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar also said the Trump administration would quarantine any Americans who had visited China’s Hubei province, where the disease originated, within the past 14 days. The government will also require screening and self-quarantines for all other Americans who recently visited any other parts of China. Officials said the self-quarantine rules would require individuals to stay in their homes for a certain length of time, monitor themselves for certain symptoms such as coughing, and check their temperatures and report them to local health officials.




Mhmm... notice the travel restrictions. "non-us citizens".
US citizens required to "self-quarantine".

Honestly, I don't expect much more, given that our country is based on personal freedoms, but that's not a very effective travel restriction. Means Le Hockey Dad can fly to Wuhan, get the 'rona, come back to the Bay Area and be told to stay in his home for "a certain length of time". He'll ignore it, because rules are for the poors, and go to grab a beer somewhere and taa-daa, virus!

Self quarantines are BS. We already saw people breaking those.

I honestly don't expect more, which is why I never criticized him for his travel restrictions. But he doesn't deserve a gold star for them either. Travel restrictions are only effective if they are for people of all nationalities, or involve government enforced quarantines. Anything less is just pretending to do something.
victor809 Offline
#59 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 3:37 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
tailgater wrote:
I'm not asking Karen from the internet.
I was asking the same person who introduced an opinion about Trump failing.
The fact that you refuse to admit this shows your burning desire to be nothing better than a troll.


And I was just preemptively pointing out you had zero interest in an actual answer.
The actual answer is available daily on every news source (except maybe OANN).
The actual answer changes daily, as twitler does something new and dangerous to our population on a daily basis (maybe every 48hrs if he gets distracted by a shiny object).
If you're going to pretend that of all the information out there, you have somehow not come across any information that indicates to you twitler has done a substandard job until you just happened across a thread on a discount cigar forum and you're shocked to hear that twitler is not succeeding at getting us through this issue, then why should we take you seriously?
HockeyDad Offline
#60 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 4:00 PM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,112
It seems pretty drastic to order all that with just 6 cases in the US. Maybe it could even be considered that he did act early and was aligned with the experts. Maybe.

The opposition narrative was he was xenophobic. Plenty of evidence of that on this forum. ....and from that moment the novel coronavirus was weaponized.

As for self quarantines, shelter in place, putting NY on pause, safer at home, etc you’re just hoping the American people listen. Otherwise we have to get out the bayonets to enforce it. (Pitchforks and torches suck against bayonets)

While typing this I just got an emergency alert broadcast that my county and the San Francisco Bay Area has extended the shelter in place order until May 3.
izonfire Offline
#61 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 4:15 PM EST
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,644
HockeyDad wrote:
While typing this I just got an emergency alert broadcast that my county and the San Francisco Bay Area has extended the shelter in place order until May 3.

How many rolls of toilet paper is that?
HockeyDad Offline
#62 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 4:26 PM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,112
For another month I think that’s like 4900 rolls or something.

I’ll just venture out and buy some more. The whole “shelter in place” thing is more for the peasants anyway.
victor809 Offline
#63 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 4:34 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
HockeyDad wrote:
It seems pretty drastic to order all that with just 6 cases in the US. Maybe it could even be considered that he did act early and was aligned with the experts. Maybe.

The opposition narrative was he was xenophobic. Plenty of evidence of that on this forum. ....and from that moment the novel coronavirus was weaponized.

As for self quarantines, shelter in place, putting NY on pause, safer at home, etc you’re just hoping the American people listen. Otherwise we have to get out the bayonets to enforce it. (Pitchforks and torches suck against bayonets)

While typing this I just got an emergency alert broadcast that my county and the San Francisco Bay Area has extended the shelter in place order until May 3.





I don't disagree with you.
As a country we aren't really well suited to the necessary actions which would have had a real impact on this (actual quarantine.... actual restriction of people's movements rather than suggestions)....

It's looking more likely we had way more cases at that time. Remember, we didn't have any tests....

I think twitler's a xenophobic idiot, as are most of his supporters. However, I don't think that his travel restrictions in Jan were based on xenophobia. I just think they were toothless. That's why I've never criticized him for them, but also think it's hilarious he credits himself as saving thousands of lives by putting them in place.
Brewha Offline
#64 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 5:16 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,161
HockeyDad wrote:
When Trump shut down all flights from China, was that a leader acting early or xenophobic?

I can’t recall.

The CDC issued it’s first warning on January 8th.

Trump reacted by having nine different rallies - cuz he needs him some love.

No acting early here - none.







Wanna buy a KAG hat?
delta1 Offline
#65 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 5:38 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,772
here's a news story about Trump's travel restrictions to/from China:

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/trumps-ban-on-china-travel-his-claims-vs-reality-2020-03-27


marketwatch is considered a right leaning media source...
HockeyDad Offline
#66 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 5:45 PM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,112
Here is that warning On January 8 which included a level 1 travel advisory which is “use normal precautions”.

You wanted him to shut down travel to China over this? I don’t think so.

On January 15 Nancy Pelosi delivered the impeachment articles. Nobody was even worried about where Wuhan was. We were all too busy being constitutional law experts.



Summary
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) is closely monitoring a reported cluster of pneumonia of unknown etiology (PUE) with possible epidemiologic links to a large wholesale fish and live animal market in Wuhan City, Hubei Province, China. An outbreak investigation by local officials is ongoing in China; the World Health Organization (WHO) is the lead international public health agency. Currently, there are no known U.S. cases nor have cases been reported in countries other than China. CDC has established an Incident Management Structure to optimize domestic and international coordination if additional public health actions are required.

This HAN Advisory informs state and local health departments and health care providers about this outbreak and requests that health care providers ask patients with severe respiratory disease about travel history to Wuhan City. Wuhan City is a major transportation hub about 700 miles south of Beijing with a population of more than 11 million people.

Background
According to a report from the Wuhan Municipal Health Commission, as of January 5, 2020, the national authorities in China have reported 59 patients with PUE to WHO. The patients had symptom onset dates from December 12 through December 29, 2019. Patients involved in the cluster reportedly have had fever, dyspnea, and bilateral lung infiltrates on chest radiograph. Of the 59 cases, seven are critically ill, and the remaining patients are in stable condition. No deaths have been reported and no health care providers have been reported to be ill. The Wuhan Municipal Health Commission has not reported human-to-human transmission.
delta1 Offline
#67 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 5:47 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,772
Trump is saying his travel ban saved thousands of lives...
HockeyDad Offline
#68 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 5:58 PM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,112
Of course Trump is saying his travel ban saved thousands of lives. To the pro-Trump camp it probably saved 98.2 million lives. To the anti-Trump camp it was too porous and ineffective and maybe saved like three people, tops. Neither number can ever be proven so everybody just entrenches further weaponizes the virus.

MACS Offline
#69 Posted: Tue, Mar 31 2020, 6:15 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,724
Where's that Morgan Freeman meme...

"He's right, ya know..."^^^
jjanecka Offline
#70 Posted: Wed, Apr 1 2020, 4:45 AM EST
Joined: 12-08-2015
Posts: 4,334
Saw the subject and immediately thought Spey was having a psychological meltdown. I was not left dissapointed.
tailgater Offline
#71 Posted: Wed, Apr 1 2020, 8:18 AM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
And I was just preemptively pointing out you had zero interest in an actual answer.
The actual answer is available daily on every news source (except maybe OANN).
The actual answer changes daily, as twitler does something new and dangerous to our population on a daily basis (maybe every 48hrs if he gets distracted by a shiny object).
If you're going to pretend that of all the information out there, you have somehow not come across any information that indicates to you twitler has done a substandard job until you just happened across a thread on a discount cigar forum and you're shocked to hear that twitler is not succeeding at getting us through this issue, then why should we take you seriously?


OK Chumly.
You run with that.
tailgater Offline
#72 Posted: Wed, Apr 1 2020, 8:20 AM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
HockeyDad wrote:
Of course Trump is saying his travel ban saved thousands of lives. To the pro-Trump camp it probably saved 98.2 million lives. To the anti-Trump camp it was too porous and ineffective and maybe saved like three people, tops. Neither number can ever be proven so everybody just entrenches further weaponizes the virus.




Applause
Users browsing this topic
Guest
2 Pages<12
Back to Top