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I would have put a line through " Non-Hispanic " and penciled in " European-American " and checked the block, but hey what do I know. JonR

I take it you've already heard about the Banana sale at Palphs? LOL

Buff: I believe any race-based preference is, by definition, racist. People should be judged soley on their performance and accomplishments. I have no problem with groups like the NAACP, race-based clubs on campus, gentlemen's clubs, ladie's nights, etc. but 'equal' opportunity and all related programs are cleaerly exclusionary and need to be kept out of education and especially out of the workplace.

LLT...that's funny!

That one tickled me...I'm still chuckling about that one!

Until morale improves the beatings will continue.

If you want to have an exclusive "club" that only caters to one particular sect...that's discrimination.

http://www.livejournal.com/users/eatingpixistix/76062.html?mode=reply

I'm wondering John, because you like to be so fair, how many KKK meetings you've been to? You say they beat or kill, but have you been to one? I wanted to attend a Nation of Islam meeting when I lived in Detroit and was turned away. Why? Because I'm white I was told. I've read about them and know that they spread hate, but I wanted to hear Louis with my own ears.

Instead of supporting organizations that have exclusionary tactics behind them and promote their own, I surprised you don't have the ACLU ripping on them. It's your life and you're entitled to live in the way that you see fit, but don't make it seem like you don't see the reverse discrimination! You've got to see it in the classrooms.

BET
United Negro College Fund
Ebony
Miss Black America
NAACP

Are all racist to the core. If it's not then it's ok to have:
White Entertainment Network
White Anglo-Saxon College Fund
White
Miss White America
NAAWP

You know you'd be the first person to scream foul if ANY of those were to come to fruitation, and don't tiptoe around the fact that you would! We don't have Jim Crow laws anymore, Dr. MLK did his job and did it well. Racism is wrong and anyone that practices it lives in a small world, but to make people pay for slavery or injustices to a race of people with free loans, easier application tests and just show up because we'll be able to pick you out of a crowd and we need more of you to secure more government grants policies is doing a disservice to America. That's not my America.

When does it even out? What's the price? I heard a topic like this on talk radio, and I can't remember the gentleman's name that was speaking, but he was a black man, I think he teaches at Cornell, and he stated that he didn't want any payment from the USA for what happened to his great-great-great grandfather. That debt was paid off when he was born in the US and allowed to be what he wanted to be. He had visited Africa and knew firsthand the squalor that most people live in there. I only wish there were more people that thought like that instead of "what can I get for free" and "I'm owed this" mentality.

If you want to think that I'm some bigot for holding this point of view then I'm fine with it. I'll let you call me a bigot, if the above statement is being a bigot. America is a fair nation, and I can be anything I want. I only hope that my kids will be able to get more than a Pell Grant when it comes time for them to go to college because their dad is a successful white guy and can shell out the cash for an education.

DMV, chill, man. The question was 'why is the NAACP not considered racist?,' and I answered simply and clearly. You've brought a million things up and wondered why I haven't addressed them. Give me a break. I still cannot understand why you flip out everytime I post, what I could possibly have done to you to provoke such vitriolic words everytime I post. Perhaps you are just trying to drive me off the bbs?

The KKK speaks through its actions and history. Please give me the NAACP's equivalent of cross-burning and lynching, not to mention the general theory of racial superiority.

Would never compare NAACP to the KKK, not even same ball game, but they are supposed to be non partisan, ha ha! LMFAO.

Charlie

Thats the thing.. the NAACP isnt concidered socially by most to be a racist group. I dont think they are necessarly a bad group. (Hell I dont know anything about them), but I have no reason to hate them..

Although there is no doubt they are a racist group by definition.....

It doesnt bother me that there is an African American group.. I just use it as an example of racism...

I just hate it when someone is turned down for a job because of color. Employment apps shouldnt even be allowed to have Race on the form...

Ezell

Well, congratulations Steve on teaching freshmen English. I will always remember my freshmen English professors as idiots... So did their bosses.. hence they were freshmen teachers..

It is not my directive on this board to produce a Pulitzer. Maybe, we should all yield and give praise to the power you behold.. but not many people on a BB would give two sh*ts if I take my time to develop a full sentence..

One thing that you missed in your English profession is the purpose of a Language. What it is all about... When it comes down to it, Language is developed for the ability to communicate. If someone is able to convey a topic, then they have succeeded the English language. No matter if they use the style of Hemmingway or Kerouac.

The world of English is not a structured box anymore. Someone discovered that the lack of discipline led to a more creative ability...

As far as my GPA... I was required to take English every semester. But most of those classes were adv Chem, hnrs Bio, adv Physics, Cal I, II, III, Diff Eq, Matrix, blah...

And .. to COMPLETELY discredit everything you said... I was accepted to every school that I applied too, except for UT. Which was due to lost paperwork. I was notified of this. All I had to do was send them the lost paperwork, and I would have been accepted. Except that I really didn't want to go there after taking the tour.. so I let the acceptance fall. Not that UT acceptance is that hard, since the state requires a high percentage of the students to be from Texas.

The reason I didn't go to schools like GT after being accepted, is because of the financial stress it would have caused on my family. Out of state tuition is crazy. That is why I applied for scholarships... Which is were this discussion begins. I was turned down for scholarships because I am white.

You have got to be one of the most Stupid people I have seen on here. Your logic is unfounded, your thoughts only half developed. You back up your thoughts with air.. nothing is established.. You attacked my ability to write english on a BB, however you seem to have understood part of what I said.. so it must have been English. You must have not completely read what I said in my first post.. you say "it's no suprise why you didn't get accepted".. WTF, I did get accepted... I didn't get scholarships...

I see stupid people.. their everywhere...

Ezell

Racist:
1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

By definition, the NAACP would only loosely (if at all) meet one of these criteria.
But affirmative action is 100% a racist policy.

Not only is it a racist policy, but it is a entirely legal.
And not only legal, but also mandated in certain areas.

Mandadeted racism is the liberal solution to past indescretions.

This board is getting more and more frightening.

...mysterious appeals to 'the Book' and how the Jews killed Jesus, unaware (or aware?) of what this accusation has meant historically.

...applauding 'Watch Lists'

...the NAACP is racist, a group dedicated to non-violence and ending racism

...all of these sympathetic allusions to a 'white interest group or groups'

What the hell is going on here? Is Cbid on some sort of extreme right-wing list of bbs' to use? Is there some sort of hallucinogen in the Cbid cigars?

I agree with SteveR, by the way: your writing needs a lot of work. There is your answer, most likely, concerning why you weren't admitted where you wanted. GPA and test scores are never the sole reason for admission. It could be that your black friend is a better writer, did a better job at self-presentation, and so on. You shouldn't speculate that it was only race. Truth be told, you really don't know why they decided why and how they did. Maybe one of your recommendation letters was weak or maybe didn't make it to the application file or who knows what. Everyone here is an 'expert,' though no one knows **** about how the decision (or any decision) was made.

Thank you everyone for sharing your thoughts, here are mine:

The reason that "affirmative action" is still used is because of the lopsidedness of power in the US. That is, most people in positions of power ie/government, business executives etc., are still 1)white and 2)men. Why is this? Because of the historical advantage white men have over not only other races, but over the other sex. Maybe it is only me, but when I look around, I can see the pull for white men to hire other white men.

I am a graduate student, and when I go to research meetings, and meet professionals in my field, I can FEEL the advantage I have because I am a white man, all of the other old white dudes cozy up to me. I know in part this is because of my research etc., but I can't deny that this is in part becuase many of the people around me are a different color.

Why is it that workplaces sholdn't strive to have a diverse group of employees, or that government and big business shouldn't be filled with diversity? I am in complete agreeance that "the best man or woman for the job" should get hired, or accepted into college or whatever, but, as many people will fight to the death to deny, there is still an advantage to being white, which in trying to even out this advantage sometimes leads to disadvantages.

On the whole, reading many of the posts on topic, it sounds like people are flat out scared that their advantage is being stripped of them, and now they will have to be just as good (and in some situations, for the time, better) than the black person standing beside them.
As a side thought, I don't know one white person who has never been admitted to a college or university. All of my friends, even those with poor GPA's and average SAT's got into a college or university.

Call me a f@#$ing democrat liberal whatever you want, I'm speaking from my experiences, not necissarily from theory. I see it all around me, and to be honest, there is a comforting feeling that when I move on to get a job that I will have an easier time. On the flip side, If I don't get a job and a black man or woman does, so be it....who is to know if they are more deserving, or if it is because a hiring policy? It is an easy excuse to blame it on a hiring policy instead of admitting that that person is better than me, which is probably the case.

As for affirmative action, I personally do not feel that it is racist to consider one's life (and other) experience when considering that person for admission into a college or on a job interview. In fact, experience is usually a bonus when applying for a job, and why shouldn't it be when applying to a university.

Those are my thoughts

spence28 speaks wise and thoughtful words. Very well-said. I agree with you wholeheartedly.

Johann...you probably heard a man by the name of Ken Hamblin...Definitely has much more common sense than most people!

Unfortunately they fucus on the white black thing and forget that there are people of other color.

many liberal groups in the continent are considerd racist by Alaskan, Hawaiian, and Indian descent.

I looked up Hamblin...I don't think this was him. I know that the guy I'm talking about teaches or taught at Cornell...BUT...I found this...

By Ken Hamblin
Special to the Denver Post

Sunday, January 26, 2003 - Just as I predicted, white Democrats have unleashed their black fellows to launch a bloodthirsty attack against President George W. Bush because of his opposition to the University of Michigan's race-based quota system. The Michigan system gives preference to potential black students by giving them an automatic 20 points on their entrance evaluation simply because they are black.

That means when a black and a white student apply, the white student is automatically down 20 points in a 150-point system of measurement that also includes geography, alumnus connections, writing skills, personal achievement, leadership and service.

He or she loses in a category labeled "miscellaneous," where 20 points are applied simply for being among the "underrepresented racial-ethnic minority identification or education."

If that isn't racial discrimination, I don't know what is.

Of course we all know the policy was designed by the university to fulfill its desire to integrate the campus with black students to create a diversified student body.

Unfortunately, based on the preferential 20-point system, the black students they get could be among the students who the U.S. public education system failed to prep for anything approaching higher education.

Nonetheless, the liberal academics' solution to campus diversification has been to create a social backhoe designed to scoop up even academically crippled black students from flawed schools in urban American ghettos and deliver them as poster students to the increasingly flawed altar of affirmative action.

It worked for quite a while, too. That is, until Barbara Grutter, a white applicant to the University of Michigan Law School, cried foul and decried the policy for what it is: racial discrimination, plain and simple.

She publicly exposed it as a strain of academic bigotry, one that exists at many other institutions of higher learning.

It is a brand of U.S.-sanctioned prejudice in the best tradition of the former all-white South African government. What else can you call decisions being made based only on, of all things, the color of a student's skin?

After much hand-wringing, President Bush stood pat and last week announced that the administration would file a friend-of-the-court brief in opposition to the university's discriminatory policies with the U.S. Supreme Court.

Roger Wareham, a leading attorney in the African-American demand for slave reparations, was quick to scathe President Bush for opposing the university's race- based admissions policies in arguments before the U.S. Supreme Court.

The inability of some among the black intelligentsia to see the University of Michigan's policy for what it is smacks of a deadly strain of political and racial myopia. It's stupidity for stupidity's sake, because they think it will benefit black students who would otherwise be discriminated against.

One of the producers of my syndicated talk-radio show spent a day trying to uncover an affirmative-action advocate who was willing to defend a system that so obviously gives preference to someone based solely on the color of his or her skin while claiming that system is not a form of racial discrimination.

She failed to find a single person among the NAACP, The Black Congressional Caucus and several other African-American organizations because the scoundrels are fully aware that it is wrong, and thus have gone to ground.

They've run for cover for two reasons: First, because their position isn't defendable. And second, because they believe that no matter how twisted their logic or outlandish their position may be, if they cry loudly enough, eventually guilt-ridden white America will concede and roll over to their demands.

Thank You DrMadd.. great post...

jdrabinski.. you are a hypocrite. You say "no one knows sh*t" here.. but you claim to "Know" that I have no ability to know why I was turned down for my scholarship.

I have a GREAT ABILITY to know why I was turned down.. Its called a telephone call. I called one of the Advisors for the scholarship. I met him in Georgia during my tour of the campus. He told me directly that they were looking for more diversity. Nothing else to it....

Why do you both get off topic.. The discussion isnt "OTHER REASONS BUFFALLO DIDNT GET HIS SCHOLARSHIP HE WANTED".. it is about discrimination.

Now.. Spence brought up a few points... thank you..
One being that white people are advantaged in the business world.

I am not experienced (old) enought to see the advantage that white people have in business.. I have see people discriminate against language barriers.. but that is economics and not racism..
What I have seen are the "diverse" people that know they are hired on for Affirmative Action sitting on their butts doing nothing. The bad part is that they know they can get away with it. The best thing they do is take long lunch breaks so they have less time to bother other people..

What my point gets down to... and this is what I want to hear someone argue.. is that I would like to see equality. You want a job to be a shoe salesman, then the man with the best ability to sell shoes, and worst ability to smell... gets the job...


Ezell

LMFAO Hog.. Your awesome..

Ezell

dz.. that sucks amigo.. What are you doing now??

Chris

Funny thing, this "discrimination".

When are we going to stop blaming white America for the poor lot in life many groups of people have?

Why is the human tendency to gravitate towards "your own type" considered evil?

Black Americans have every opportunity to succeed in today's society.
Look at the Asian population in America. Here's a group who not only look different than the "whites", but oftentimes have a language barrier and/or heavy accent that infuriate some and simply frustrate others. Yet, they not only do well in America, they actually are doing BETTER than white Americans as a group.

Did we raise them to some lofty status because they are Asian? Or did they succeed by their own merit?

I'm not twisting facts and I'm certainly not pulling any punches.
If there is any segment of white America that is truly doing a disservice to the citizens of color, it is the Liberal Left.
How often can the poor hear from the left that they are "owed" something? That we have "kept them down" and they can't rise up without the governments funds?

Jesse Jackson has possibly destroyed more dreams than the Great MLK created.

Anti-Discrimiation laws are needed in this country.
Pro-discrimination practices (Affirmative Action) are not.

Privilege? Oh you mean when I go to buy a car I get treated better because I'm white?

Oh you must mean when I go to the grocery store and I ask for a lb of lunch meat and they give me a lb and a 1/2 because I'm white?

Then again, there's the realtors. Those mean lots don't like tire kickers, if'n ya know what I mean, but when they see a white man coming they just fling open the doors and lower the price?

What am I privvy to? Certinly not an education at U of M! Certinly not a backing voice from the NAACP! If you want to live in a world of stereotypes go right ahead, but at least be open to see that the world isn't staying stagnant with your musings of privilege. Spence, I've said it before and I'll say it again...if somebody in this day and age is practicing any type of discrimination, they're living in a small world, made smaller by their own devices. I've given reasons and examples of what I believe are blatent discriminations today, want to end them...get rid of them. Watch and see how bridges get built or are mended. We don't need more divisive policies or exclusionary clubs, we need to recognize that were Americans and not Afro-Americans,Euro-Americans,Asian-Americans,Native-Americans or any other hyphenated BS politicians can dream up to make everyone feel better about their personal heritage.

DMV,
Just an after thought, what do you think about exclusive clubs for men and/or women? Men shouldn't be able to have men only clubs and vice versa? No mens golf clubs, no women only gyms (which seem to be pretty popular these days) etc.

Some good points spence.
And I'm not suggesting that there is zero bigotry in the US. I just think that OVER compensating today for the indiscretions of yesterday is not the way to go.

What percentage of black Americans are the actual direct decendants of slaves? Those would be the only group who fit into your scenario of "nothing but the shirt on their back".
America is the land of Opportunity. It should not be the land of Entitlement.

Besides, I keep reading on these boards that White America discriminates against the hiring of people of color. That was the purpose of my Asian analogy.
White America does NOT discriminate when people are qualified.
You need look no further than professional sports to realize that.

Then we agree. We just chose different roads to get to the same conclusion.

DMV and Tail,
As much fun as I am having, I have to do some work today!!! So I'll check back later in the afternoon.