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Kerry on Defense
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RDC Offline
#1 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 4:42 AM EST
Joined: 01-21-2000
Posts: 5,874
I just checked to see if this is true. You can check for yourself on the
following site (scroll down to February 27): http://aceobserver.bravejournal.com/

Don't forget: John Kerry is strong on defense

He voted to kill the Bradley Fighting Vehicle
He voted to kill the M-1 Abrams Tank
He voted to kill every Aircraft carrier laid down from 1988
He voted to kill the Ages anti aircraft system
He voted to Kill the F-15 strike eagle
He voted to Kill the Block 60 F-16
He voted to Kill the P-3 Orion upgrade
He voted to Kill the B-1
He voted to Kill the B-2
He voted to Kill the Patriot anti Missile system
He voted to Kill the FA-18
He voted to Kill the B-2
He voted to Kill the F117

In short, he voted to kill every military appropriation for the development
and deployment of every weapons systems since 1988 to include the Battle armor
for our troops. With Kerry as president our Army will be made up of naked men
running around with sticks and clubs. He also voted to kill all anti terrorism
activities of every agency of the U.S. Government and to cut the funding of the FBI by 60%, to cut the funding for the CIA by 80%, and cut
the funding for the NSA by 80%. But then he voted to increase OUR funding for
U.N operations by 800%!!!

Is THIS a President YOU want? I HOPE Not!
DrMaddVibe Offline
#2 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 4:47 AM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,498
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/3/14/230107.shtml
HockeyDad Offline
#3 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 4:56 AM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,160
I think this is an unfair characterization of Senator Kerry's voting record. Had the situation been right, I think he also would have voted in favor of all these military systems.
MACS Offline
#4 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 5:54 AM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,817
Aegis, people... Aegis. I am on an Aegis Guided Missile Cruiser and I, for one, am VERY glad that we developed this technology. Makes me feel a lot safer when we are in the Persian Gulf.

Poor bad guys... he he he... dem don't know who dem dealin' wif, do dem?
DrMaddVibe Offline
#5 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 7:18 AM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,498
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=37578

Which side is it? I feel like I'm at a tennis match!
dbguru Offline
#6 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 9:26 AM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
Newsmax and WorldNetDaily have the biggest reputation as conservative propaganda machines that go out of their way to distort the truth in support of a most obvious political agenda. Please read follow these links at your own risk. These are extremely biased sources of information. Although taken seriously by extreme neo-conservatives and more radical traditional conservatives who prefer to digest only information that supports their views and exclude most mainstream news sources, those with moderate views trying to obtain balanced perspectives on news events should be looking elsewhere or at the very minimum reviewing these sites with a high degree of skepticism. By comparison to these two websites, NewsMax and WorldNetDaily, Fox News is truly fair and balanced.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#7 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 9:28 AM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,498
DB...sorry to say it...but you're a apathetic source for entertainment or information than CBS!
HockeyDad Offline
#8 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 9:34 AM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,160
Dbguru,

Are you saying Senator Kerry actually voted in favor of all these military systems?

I knew he would, my faith is restored!
Charlie Offline
#9 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 9:56 AM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
If you think Kerry voted for any of these programs, you believe in the tooth fairy!


Charlie
MACS Offline
#10 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:05 AM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,817
Fox News... they report, I decide. Unlike CNN the Clinton News Network and any other friggin' source of media, be it newspaper or television.

I was born and raised in Rhode Island. I left when I was 17 and never went back. My dad tells me we were surrounded by liberals and that's why we left. He went to Georgia and I joined the Navy.
Charlie Offline
#11 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:15 AM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
The Aegis is one of the most advanced systems in the world and I damn glad we have it operational! So, if the illustrious Senator only voted against 70% of those systems above he is a bigger fool than I think he is and he should be held accountable for his lackluster Senatorial career of soaking US dollars for his silk lined pockets!

Charlie
dbguru Offline
#12 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:17 AM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
Did I make a comment on your assertions.... No, just your sources.....

I reserve judgement on your assertions and consider the context upon which these decisions were made by John Kerry (which none of you right wing neo-cons ever ever do!!!). You don't have the right to draw my conclusions, Thats my privelege, buddy!! If you wish to drink the Kool-aid and believe the most slanted propganda I've ever seen from NewsMax and WorldNetDaily, go ahead and fill your head with their slime and slander... I can't stop you I can only warn you...
MACS Offline
#13 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:21 AM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,817
The DB must mean democratic buttnugget.

Sorry db... couldn't resist. I respect your right to have an opinion different than mine. Even though it's wrong. hehehe

*They're just jokes people, they can't hurt you*
dbguru Offline
#14 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:34 AM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
MACs...

Heres the deal... To be informed, I believe you need to be open to a wide a variety of news sources as you can possibly absorb...

If you listen to Fox and not CNN, then your opinion is Fox's opinion. (and thus I'd rather get that from Fox) If you listen to both then I would tend to respect your opinion more as your own...

That's the major concern I have with those of you only reading and getting news and opinion from only right wing sources. You are being programmed!! You've lost your own opinions!! You simply post links to these propaganda machines. I don't need you to spout these opinions. You not as good as Rush, Billy O., Sean, and the rest of the genre I know those already. And I do listen to those guys to understand what their perpectives are.

My opinion is a DBGuru exclusive.. You may like it, you may not. But there it is and it's based on the broadest set of news sources I have time to consume.
Hey I watch Fox everyday, Along with CNN, MSNBC, NBC, NPR and BBC. Occasionally the NY Times, LA Times, my own local Seattle Times, the Washington Post and the Wall Street Journal. So there is the value... Not just a rewrite of a right wing propganda machine but a perspective that tries to cut through the half truths and distortions...

That's what fair and balanced is really all about.....

DB
MACS Offline
#15 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:43 AM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,817
I can agree with that db. It is not ALL the time that I agree with what I hear on Fox. Some days I love Bill O'reilly and other days I think he is a pompous A$$. Some days, though they are few and far between, I may agree with what I hear on the Clinton News Network. I am not stupid and I am certainly not one who can be "led" to believe anything. I have my own mind. It just so happens that most of the time I agree with the republican view on issues. Notice I said MOST.
HockeyDad Offline
#16 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:45 AM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,160
This post is threadjacked.

Did Senator Kerry vote FOR or AGAINST the originally mentioned weapons systems?

Charlie Offline
#17 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 11:53 AM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
Senator John Kerry voted against the weapons systems noted above and other less important military matters, but now, he will feign some reason or another to side step the vote record!

dbguru, I watch the same sources you watch and I am not a right wing kool aid drinker or whatever you referred to; however, I believe that most liberals are a little bit blind when it comes to facts! You believe that Kerry is the big savior of business, manufacturing and healthcare but where are his positions on those issues, just a lot of talk! He talks the talk a lot, but doesn't seem to walk the walk!

Charlie
dbguru Offline
#18 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 1:04 PM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
Charlie .. I respect your opinion on that.
None of us can predict how Kerry will be for business growth and jobs. I'm feeling some of his ideas make a lot of sense. You may think differently.

But I've seen 4 years of GW and I know that the economic theory GW follows is pretty close to the same one his dad followed and on two occassions it lead to a screwed up economy. And I'm not buying into 4 more years of this crap.
CWFoster Offline
#19 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 7:05 PM EST
Joined: 12-12-2003
Posts: 5,414
DB- You don't have the right to draw my conclusions, Thats my privelege, buddy!!

ALRIGHT BUD! Whats good for the goose is good for the gander! FIRST! Whats with the neocon name calling? I understand what it means and implys. I want to know why you have the unmitigated GALL to question my conservative values because I support Bush? I DON'T think he's the best there ever was, but I don't see anyone better out there certainly not Hanoi John! SECOND, I'm sick and tired of any sources cited by a conservative as being "RIGT-WING PROPAGANDA" ALL the major broadcast outlets were soft on Clintons scandals, yet those are to be viewed as "OBJECTIVE" can we at least agree that anyone who goes to the trouble and expense of building an organization for the collection and disseminization of information probably has their own agenda, and instead of you calling our sources propaganda, and us calling your sources propaganda, we look at the content, and judge for ourselves? Kerrys voting record is a matter of public record, just the non-"Right wing propagandists" won't bother to compile and release this info because they are to busy puffing Kerry!
usahog Offline
#20 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 7:20 PM EST
Joined: 12-06-1999
Posts: 22,691
DB this only means one thing!!!!!








































































My Vote..... Cancels your Vote Out!!!! ;0)~~~~

Hog
pabloescabar Offline
#21 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 9:39 PM EST
Joined: 02-25-2005
Posts: 30,183
Just cuz Karry prances around in ice skates,thats the only thing Hockey Dad likes that does not mean hes not a commie. weak America Vote kerry.
dbguru Offline
#22 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:00 PM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
Hog, I totally appreciate your attitude !!
So we're even.... Now let's get ready for the NCAA tournament.
dbguru Offline
#23 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:11 PM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
Alright CW.... take it easy
The challenge is show me some link on Newsmax or WorldNewsNet that says anything substantially complimentary about the actions of any Democrat. At least on Fox news I see it happening sometime.. not often, but enough to at least take their news seriously.

But really guy.... some of you guys were drawing conclusions on my behalf and I have every right to object to that. And the right wing has done a lot to try and make "liberal" a dirty word so the term neo-conservative or neo-con is just an expected reaction. Like you said what's good for the goose......

dbguru Offline
#24 Posted: Mon, Mar 15 2004, 10:12 PM EST
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
Oh and you might check out my posts on Kerry vs Kerry for flip flops over the last few years... Again whats good for the goose......
HockeyDad Offline
#25 Posted: Tue, Mar 16 2004, 2:29 AM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,160
I haven't seen a denial yet regarding the accusation that Senator Kerry voted against all the weapons systems mentioned. Actually, It kinda looks like he's voted against every defense appropriations bill which would mean he's voted to $0 fund the entire military, not just kill these systems.

I'm looking hard, I just can't seem to find any substance on this Kerry fella. It seems that there is nothing to him except he's not Bush.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#26 Posted: Tue, Mar 16 2004, 2:38 AM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,498
Perhaps DB's "news sources" will be able to shed more light into his candidate's voting record, bill ownership, and attendance while a senator.
CWFoster Offline
#27 Posted: Tue, Mar 16 2004, 11:51 AM EST
Joined: 12-12-2003
Posts: 5,414
Hockey Dad- I'm looking hard, I just can't seem to find any substance on this Kerry fella. It seems that there is nothing to him except he's not Bush.

Exactly my point Hockey! Bush may not be my ideal of a Commander in Chief, but he's as good as I've seen offered since Reagan! And if he's beholden to oil companies (which hasn't been proven, but is a possibility given who his "good old boy" network doubtless includes) Who get's elected without owing some favors? Hanoi John sold out the MIAs when he refused to even investigate possible EYEWITNESS SIGHTINGS of POWs in post-war Viet Nam, so he could get his cousin (on the Forbes side of the family) a $9 BILLION contract to upgrade port facilities in Viet Nam! Would you rather a Chief Executive beholden to American oil companies, or the Forbes Corporations, or maybe it was for North Viet Nam!

DB- I too watch and read mutiple sources for news. I too make my own conclusions. I have NOT however resorted to name calling anybody on these boards. I have and DO refer to Kerry as Hanoi John, in much the same way as Rick refers to Bush as little w. The only time I try to be demeaning is when the only thing they can say about Kerry is "he's not Bush". OK, use YOUR head, YOU apply logic. Bush has some claim to conservatism, he may be a bit dissapointing in some areas, but he DOES have SOME appearances to keep up. What appearances does Kerry have to keep up? A voting record to the LEFT of TED KENNEDY (I'm not going to quote anybody, look it up!) As I said before, CNN, ABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC, The Washington Post, The New York Times, The Washington Times, The Los Angeles Times, whoever the hell else you want to read, read them ALL, and you tell me who else is putting this information out! YOU look up the voting record, and then YOU ASK YOURSELF WHY THEY AREN'T PUTTING THIS INFORMATION OUT! Perhaps your enlightenment is not as profound as you think.
Sylance Offline
#28 Posted: Tue, Mar 16 2004, 2:00 PM EST
Joined: 06-19-2003
Posts: 592
Here's a good quote from Kerry:

"We are here to ask, and we are here to ask vehemently, where are the leaders of our country? Where is the leadership? We're here to ask where are McNamara, Rostow, Bundy, Gilpatrick, and so many others? Where are they now that we, the men they sent off to war, have returned? These are the commanders who have deserted their troops. And there is no more serious crime in the laws of war. The Army says they never leave their wounded. The marines say they never even leave their dead. These men have left all the casualties and retreated behind a pious shield of public rectitude. They've left the real stuff of their reputations bleaching behind them in the sun in this country.... "

My favorite is this considering his POW stance: "And there is no more serious crime in the laws of war."

This is an interesting read; it has his entire statement to the Senate Committee of Foreign Relations in April 23, 1971.

http://www.etsu.edu/cas/history/docs/vietvetswar.htm
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