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Many times, cigar makers will have their cigars made in other factories. For example, CAO Vision was made by La Aurora in the Dominican. Casa Magna is made by Nestor Plasencia, outside of the Dominican, for Manuel Quesada. Rocky Patel cigars are made all over the place, in factories owned by other cigar-makers and manufacturers. This happens often. However, it does not make the cigar any less CAO, Rocky Patel, Manuel Quesada, or Graycliff. In addition to making cigars in the Bahamas, they also manufacturer cigars in other factories in order to offer more variety at a lower price to the consumer. When you only have a dozen rollers (literally) it is difficult to make enough cigars to meet demand for certain brands. So they utilize another facility's operations, but help maintain the production, blend, and quality control.

I always thought the 1666 were the only Graycliffs rolled off sight.... Not true?

I've been to the graycliff factory in the Bahamas and always wondered how could that little room make so many
cigars. just 5 or 6 tables.

now their list of aged cubans on site is to die for................

Wait... 1666 Double Espresso? I've had a 1666 (meh), and I've had a Double Espresso (YOWZA), but they were VERY different sticks. That looks like the 1666 band, not the DE?

Well they are listed as 1966 double espresso on CB and CI I was confused the band said Hand made Bahamas but the tag said Honduras further research I found this line is rolled of site but why does the band lead you to believe it was made in the Bahamas. I like this cigar the over all experience was pleasant nice smoke for $4 a stick wouldn't ever pay the retail on these way over priced.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking, too - it's been a couple years, but I remembered the espresso line having black labels, and the DE being a special size in the espresso line. It looks like they're using that as the name for anything in the 4 1/2 X 60 size now, though. Weird. Oh well. I still prefer the espresso line. The 1666 wasn't offensive or anything, but it was pretty dull in every size except the Taco, which I really liked... and which also seems to have disappeared. Well, poo.

I've been to The Graycliff Hotel and seen the rolling Room.It's the size of my living room.I knew they could never make enough cigars there to sell on the internet.Boutique,Schmootique....

Not that Busa or any of you don't know this or care to not know this but... The double espresso is a size. Espresso is a blend.

So suck a fat shorty and say hehe and all that crap you perch turd!

See your supposed to gift sticks that you like.

Yeah, the 1666 DE has a nice smooth tabacco flavor that stays cool in high winds at the beach. I judge my cigars by the flavor in a 25mph wind.

Wheel this is a new stick hommie.

They call it a double espresso 1666

What I was talking about was the OG 1666 not this one. OG is a yard gar at best...this one who knows!

double espresso is a size??

Seems like Texas is decades behind the times on that one.

Mass produced OUTRAGE !!!!

The DE is not only a size but....a little dif blend than the Espresso and not exclusive to any shop.

Just adds to my long-standing OUTRAGE on the smoke and mirrors mystery that this industry seems to take perverse pleasure in. Maybe we need to enlist the help of International Organization for Standardization - they could institute an ISO-CIGAR. It would incorporate at a minimun, my demands for truth in advertising and state that manufacturers, distributors and/or retailers must clearly, in English (and Spanish?) disclose:

-Origin of tobacco in each blend was grown; region would be nice, but I'd settle for country, at least - separately list wrapper, binder and fller
-Where rolled; city/country
-Whose factory were they produced in
-Who grew the tobacco
-MSRP
-Name of orignal blender
-If produced as an 'exclusive' for one or more retailers

This would never happen. First off, a blend is one of a cigar-maker's biggest assets. If they release info such as, region, crop, priming, year, etc....anybody can replicate their blend. Second, does all this stuff REALLY matter? Countless cigar-makers claim to have factories, but don't. They merely utilize production of factories. Countless cigar-makers claim to have fields, but most tobaccos in most cigars are from the same small handful of growers....Plasencias, Olivas, etc. So most cigar-makers are buying tobaccos from the same brokers. However, it's what they do with the tobacco once they have it that matters. Which is why this information is really useless. It really comes down to: do you like the cigar? If yes, great! If no, there's plenty more to choose from. There's no point in taking the romance out of cigars. Cigars are an experience to be enjoyed, not something to stress over and overthink. Just light up, kick back, and enjoy a short break from the daily grind with a stick you can truly appreciate for what it is. That's the beauty behind cigars.

The Double Espresso is the size name. There is an Espresso Series Double Espresso, and a 1666 Double Espresso. Both are a size within each respective line, and they both have their respective Graycliff bands on them. Yes, they are completely different sticks, I agree with you completely, and they are written as such.

Espresso Series is a line. Espresso Series Double Espresso is a size within the line, which features more ligero. It's a stronger size within the line.

1666 is another line from Graycliff. The 1666 Double Espresso is a size within the line.

The two share the same name, yes, but they are different cigars. Nowhere is the copy trying to sell the 1666 Double Espresso as the Espresso Series Double Espresso.

I guess I am just missing something in translation here. The original question had to do with the Honduras tag. If you look on our main site, you will clearly see on the left, under brand specifics, Honduras as the country of origin. The description merely describes Graycliff, since many of our customers are new to cigars or new to us....they're not all grizzled old vets that know the ins and outs of the industry - or think they do, for that matter. Therefore, we give some back history, because they're expensive....regardless of what country they come from. The Graycliff name always comes at a high cost.

I can assure you there are no insults in there. Especially none directed towards you.

Well the worst part is, the customers are also fed bad info at times. For example, they will talk to a local brand rep about an exclusive made for us....and the rep will have no clue what the brand is about. They might say something wrong, or they might just say they have no idea. But the reason they don't know is, because they don't have to. It's not in their portfolio to sell to stores. It's not something they make commission on. We work deals directly with the brand owners and cigar-makers....not the local reps hitting the pavement. So, they're frequently out of the loop, since they do not receive information on the countless number of exclusives made for countless retailers. So they're given this bad information, post about it on a cigar board or blog, and then we pick up the pieces when the calls and questions come in. We're happy to do it, because we want people to know their product, but it happens very often.

We just had bad information passed along about our upcoming CAO price increase. Basically, a blogger - in not so many words - wrote that it wasn't a price increase. It no doubt is a price increase, which all retailers that carry the brands must abide by. The customer doesn't care why or how, they just care what the price is. If the price goes up to the consumer, it's a price increase. Remember, we were the first to lower our prices on CAO, and we've kept them low and will keep them low for as long as possible. When the price increase happens, we will still be at the lowest possible price. It's how we operate. We want to offer the best cigars at the best prices, without hurting the cigar-maker or manufacturer. We receive price increases quite frequently, many of which the customers never see, since we eat the increase. This one, however, we're left with no choice due to MAP.

I wonder if these use pre-embargo espresso.

LIAR. I was talking about Wheel. He isn't valued by anyone.

NO

It's nearly a hunnert degrees here.... give or take 22 degrees.