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Any guess why the U.S. should allow this pipeline to be built from Canada to the Gulf in order to further big oil's desire to be able to export Canadian oil that currently goes to the US to the world market instead? Wonder why we should allow this pipeline to be built when Canada has already declined to build it across their own provinces to their coast for export? I'd venture to say that average joe American wouldn't want this scar on the land constructed and all the land it crosses condemned via eminent domain when all that oil will be refined in Free trade zones on the gulf and exported tax free to international destinations. The jobs involved in building this atrocity across the US are not nearly benefit enough to outweigh the consequences. And yet we have legislators championing this in congress. Guess we know who they represent, not you or me, their owners that have bought and paid for them. If they represented us they'd at least be looking at legal provisions that would require US taxation on every single gallon transported through that pipeline.

Colonialism still exists. Instead of the British, French, US, or other sovereign states acting as the colonial overlords, it's the overarching global corporate raiders that are the new Emporers.

http://thinkprogress.org/green/2011/12/20/393247/fact-check-keystone-xl-would-ship-foreign-oil-to-foreign-lands/

Fact Check: Keystone XL Would Ship Foreign Oil To Foreign Lands
By Guest Blogger on Dec 20, 2011 at 2:24 pm

Our guest blogger is Anthony Swift, policy analyst for the Natural Resources Defense Council.

One of the most important facts that is missing in the national debate surrounding the proposed Keystone XL tar sands pipeline is this — Keystone XL will not bring any more oil into the United State for decades to come. Canada doesn’t have nearly enough oil to fill existing pipelines going to the United States. However, existing Canadian oil pipelines all go to the Midwest, where the only buyer for their crude is the United States. Keystone XL would divert Canadian oil from refineries in the Midwest to the Gulf Coast where it can be refined and exported. Many of these refineries are in free trade zones where oil may be exported to international buyers without paying U.S. taxes. And that is exactly what Valero, one of the largest potential buyers of Keystone XL’s oil, has told its investors it will do. The idea that Keystone XL will improve U.S. oil supply is a documented scam being played on the American people by Big Oil and its friends in Washington DC.

The fact that Canada has excess pipeline capacity is well known. In a Department of Energy report evaluating Keystone XL’s impacts on U.S. energy supply over the next twenty years, the agency found that it will take decades for Canada to produce enough oil to fill existing pipelines. On page 90, the report concludes that the United States will import the same amount of crude from Canada through 2030 whether or not Keystone XL is built.

From Canada’s perspective, the problem with existing pipelines is they all end in the U.S. Midwest and only allow one buyer – the United States. As Canada’s Natural Resources Minister Joe Oliver recently said, “we export 97 percent of our energy to the U.S. and we would like to diversify that.” However, the Canadian government has put the brakes on the two pipeline proposals to export tar sands through its provinces due to the need to take more time to listen to its own public’s concerns about water and safety.

Keystone XL would be Canada’s first step in diversifying its energy market. The pipeline would divert large volumes of Canadian oil from the Midwest to the Gulf Coast, where it would be available for the first time to buyers on the world market. To sweeten the deal, many of the refineries on the Gulf Coast happen to be located in foreign trade zones, where they can export Canadian oil to the world market without paying U.S. taxes. Oil Change International investigated this issue in a report that found the Keystone XL pipeline was part of a larger strategy to sell increasing volumes of Canadian crude on the international diesel market.

When Canadian regulators at the National Energy Board (NEB) considered the Keystone XL proposal in 2008, they asked TransCanada to justify another pipeline when there was already so much spare capacity. TransCanada conceded that Keystone XL would take oil from existing pipelines, increasing shipping costs. However, TransCanada argued that this cost would be more than offset as shifting Canadian oil from the Midwest to the Gulf would increase the price that Americans paid for Canadian oil by $3.9 billion.

In fact, TransCanada refused to support a requirement that oil on Keystone XL be used in the United States in a recent Congressional hearing. Earlier this month, Representative Edward Markey asked TransCanada’s President Alex Pourbaix to support a condition that would require the oil on Keystone XL to be used in the United States. Mr. Pourbaix refused, saying that a requirement to keep oil on Keystone XL in the United States would cause refineries to back out of their contracts. That very well may be the case as Valero, one of the largest prospective purchasers of Keystone XL’s crude, has already told its investors the its future business is in international export.

Simply stated, Keystone XL is a way to get Canadian oil out of the United States, not into it.

600,000 + miles of pipeline already working fine here. If the chicken in chief gets re-elected he will green light this. Just pandering for the ''green'' vote.

There is no 'our' oil. The corporations that handle the supply here are not looking out for the consumers in this country, only their bottom line.

We are the biggest importer of crude oil, and the biggest exporter of fuel in the world. If we wanted oil for this market to keep the costs down, we wouldn't be exporting the fuel after we've refined it.

All the oil, no matter where it's from, ends up on the world market. There is no 'our' oil. Now if you want to nationalize all natural resources to better improve distribution and control prices, then we can say 'our' oil.

You are correct about the export thing, I misheard when I was listening to the news on the radio. But the argument that we need to drill here more or build this pipeline to have our own oil isn't valid.

/\ nicely said

Time for a little "Copy-N-Paste from Some Blogger" outrage.

How much Valero stock do you own?

None.

If you picked up on my hints that the pipeline is going to get blocked because the USA will replace future oil demand with increased ethanol and Canada will build a pipeline to the West Coast and ship the oil to China, you would be buying ArcherDanielsMidland and Monsanto. (Two fine American companies!)

Here's another hint.....wait until Federal mandated ethanol use reaches the point where we need to ship it via pipeline instead of rail car because of the sheer quantity. Ethanol can't go in petroleum product pipelines without major upgrades. The first ethanol rated pipeline in the USA went into service in late 2008 between Tampa and Orlando.

I thought this would blow your mind. Sometimes you just gotta do what the bloggers tell you to do!

Next time you drive past a gas station and see a tanker truck unloading fuel, stop and ask the driver where he picks up that fuel and where it comes from to get there. Make sure to thank him.

Oh and in advance, you're welcome!

If people only new what it takes to get a gallon of fuel to the nozzle
The company I work for is closing three refining facilities in the Philly area, if they can't dump them. They have decided it will be cheaper to bring finished product in by ship and put it in the pipeline rather than refine it themselves.

BTW I never get a thank you.

Now that I've stopped reading newspapers & magazines for some time now, I get news from cable tv, radio, internets, and here.
This has been an eye-opening thread. Thank you.

Problem is, I don't know which side to believe.

There are approximately 85-95K miles of oil pipelines in the USA.
There are approximately 95K miles of refined products pipelines in the USA.
There are approximately 280K miles of natural gas transmission pipelines in the USA.
There are approximately 1.8 million miles of natural gas distribution pipelines in the USA.


Keystone XL is 1700 miles and apparently is the straw the broke the camel's back for pipeline construction. I'm already saying this pipeline is toast. The agenda to kill it is much more broad than just the typical environmental attack. Energy is going to get a lot greener and a lot more expensive in the next 15 years. Restricting access to fossil fuels will quietly force it to be more palatable. MPG requirements for cars will likely break 50 mpg in that time period.

The last thing people need to be doing is buying stock in oil refiners. Buy the green agenda instead.

Drill the Glades..!!

Yeah and Lord KNOWS we don't need those jobs now do we?

Let's not forget the maintenance crews that will be hired to maintain the pipeline and the oh, I don't know the places they might eat and buy things at and who knows...they might even want to buy a house and settle down.

Really petty to just throw an arbitrary number out there without looking at the bigger picture.

The only ethanol free gas here is sold at marinas and a few small distributers carry it. At the distributers you cannot put it in your vehicle, matter of fact you can't get close enough. Purchase and dispense into a fuel can for small engines. Usually around 5 bucks a gallon.

You've already bought into PDXstogieman's blogger theory that the refined products will be shipped out of our warm water ports. To buy into that you must also buy into the theory that as USA oil demand increases, our refiners will not purchase this Canadian oil flowing through this wonderful pipeline and instead will purchase more oil from Saudi Arabia and Nigeria instead. Tankers arriving in Houston with Saudi crude will be passing outbound tankers loaded with Canadian crude. That doesn't add up, does it?

Now if USA demand increases but is met by ethanol (as required by law), that changes the game.




Nobody in their right mind wants to build refineries. Didn't you see the note above about refineries closing down up in your neck of the woods? Canada is looking for markets for additional crude oil. The USA buys pretty much all Canadian oil. The easiest solution is to ship more to the USA but not to the same places in the Midwest. Next easiest......expand the existing pipeline to the west coast and ship crude oil to China and Japan. Plan A.....Plan B. It is pretty simple for Canada.

The union are all heavily in favor of the pipeline.

Environmentalists against.
Green energy against.
Union for.

Obama stuck in the middle of his constituency. Who has the money? Green energy. Pipeline dead.

You would probably question the fact the Obama's stimulus package created 3 million jobs as well.

I believe that is state law here as well. The stickers on the gas pumps also state that the fuel contains no more than 10% ethanol but I'll tell you right now that every drop in the state in blended at exactly 10% ethanol by law!

Let's have some fun....


PDX, why are you against the pipeline?

Your right about the 10%, I work in a loading terminal and deliver to locations when needed, we currently bring ethanol in by rail and truck. We have a local ethanol plant that was built a few years back, state of the art, all CO2 is collected and sold also. The problem is the subsidies run out this year and according to a couple guys that work there it's the only thing keeping the fire going. We are now exploring bringing it in by barge as we have access to a nearby offloading site. With the refining operations either shutting down or changing hands the next year for us will be interesting to say the least.

the Mexicans will be able to afford tortillas again too...

and the price of milk & beef should drop.. prolly won't though..

that's it... I'm voting for who ever promises to remove ethanol from our gas forever...

....and you aren't gonna get no Keystone XL pipeline so you can bring in more fossil stuff instead!

Who asked you?