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7 Most Disturbing Quotes From Obamacare Architect’s ‘Die At 75′ Article
jackconrad Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 06-09-2003
Posts: 67,461
7 Most Disturbing Quotes From Obamacare Architect’s ‘Die At 75′ Article
Profile photo of David Rufful
David Rufful


Screen Shot 2014-09-23 at 11.08.16 AM

Obamacare architect Ezekiel Emanuel shockingly claimed 75 is the optimal age to die in an article at The Atlantic.

Here are the 7 most disturbing quotations:

1. I think this manic desperation to endlessly extend life is misguided and potentially destructive. For many reasons, 75 is a pretty good age to aim to stop.

2. It is not just mental slowing. We literally lose our creativity.

3. Living parents also occupy the role of head of the family. They make it hard for grown children to become the patriarch or matriarch.

4. When parents routinely live to 95, children must caretake into their own retirement. That doesn’t leave them much time on their own—and it is all old age.

5. How do we want to be remembered by our children and grandchildren? … We want to be remembered as independent, not experienced as burdens.

6. But even if we manage not to become burdens to them, our shadowing them until their old age is also a loss. And leaving them—and our grandchildren—with memories framed not by our vivacity but by our frailty is the ultimate tragedy.

7. This means colonoscopies and other cancer-screening tests are out—and before 75. If I were diagnosed with cancer now, at 57, I would probably be treated, unless the prognosis was very poor. But 65 will be my last colonoscopy… After 75, if I develop cancer, I will refuse treatment. Similarly, no cardiac stress test. No pacemaker and certainly no implantable defibrillator. No heart-valve replacement or bypass surgery. If I develop emphysema or some similar disease that involves frequent exacerbations that would, normally, land me in the hospital, I will accept treatment to ameliorate the discomfort caused by the feeling of suffocation, but will refuse to be hauled off… Flu shots are out.

h/t Breitbart


Read more at http://www.youngcons.com/7-most-disturbing-quotes-from-obamacare-architects-die-at-75-article/#hDKrVIZvQ0y2IMV3.99
teedubbya Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Pretty interesting read (the original not this one).

He's not that architect of Obama Care. If my recollection is correct he wanted and wants a national health care voucher system.


The article itself is interesting from a bioethics perspective (again his, not this anti obamacare spin job).
frankj1 Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,221
Mitt Romnet is the architect of Obamacare. When he used the office of Governor of Massachusetts as a stepping stone he left us with it.
Gene363 Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,820

A rose is a rose... A death panel is a death panel...

Like most really good lies, there is always a grain of truth included.
victor809 Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Gene... By that logic death panels have existed since Drs have existed.

Every single person in the health care field considers the age and health of a patient when determining treatment. My dad spent a year going to different drs trying to get one to do a hip replacement for my mother (offering cash even). Due to her health they all essentially said no.

Are you saying that in a hypothetical situation, you'd spend an unlimited amount of money (not yours even but in the millions of dollars) to keep someone who's 90 alive exactly 1 more week?
TMCTLT Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
victor809 wrote:
Gene... By that logic death panels have existed since Drs have existed.

Every single person in the health care field considers the age and health of a patient when determining treatment. My dad spent a year going to different drs trying to get one to do a hip replacement for my mother (offering cash even). Due to her health they all essentially said no.

Are you saying that in a hypothetical situation, you'd spend an unlimited amount of money (not yours even but in the millions of dollars) to keep someone who's 90 alive exactly 1 more week?



Using Your logic then , why the Hell do we have trauma hospitals that give 2nd...third...and more chances to thugs shot in the commission of a crime? Why spend untold amounts of $$ and moreover take precious recources Away from good law abiding people??? There IS no good answer to this Q!!! I'd love to know what is spent annually saving the lives of those...who've tried to TAKE another's.....Think
Let's see your boy address those health care issues
victor809 Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
While I don't disagree with you that's completely irrelevant to the argument of "death panels". Hell, sounds like you're advocating death panels at the hospital level.
TMCTLT Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
victor809 wrote:
While I don't disagree with you that's completely irrelevant to the argument of "death panels". Hell, sounds like you're advocating death panels at the hospital level.



For pieces of **** who are shot during the commission of a crime.? Hell Yes, **** them, but no first they'll be saved and then even More precious recources wated on them with a trial....d'oh!
Gene363 Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,820
victor809 wrote:
Gene... By that logic death panels have existed since Drs have existed.

Every single person in the health care field considers the age and health of a patient when determining treatment. My dad spent a year going to different drs trying to get one to do a hip replacement for my mother (offering cash even). Due to her health they all essentially said no.

Are you saying that in a hypothetical situation, you'd spend an unlimited amount of money (not yours even but in the millions of dollars) to keep someone who's 90 alive exactly 1 more week?


Just the opposite, with government funded healthcare there will be limitations, some resulting in death earlier than today. The government standards will apply regardless of what you might be willing to spend. The very rich will avoid this by traveling to other locations for treatment.

I didn't struggle at all with the idea of death panels, there are many old folks no longer 'mentally home' kept alive simply because, "We need Momma's check, do everything to keep her alive!" The downside will be controls that may prevent you from living longer if say you are a very healthy 90 year old. Just like Obama Care forces older women and women with out ovaries to buy birth and birth control coverage. One size doe not fit all.
wheelrite Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 11-01-2006
Posts: 50,119
I hate to say it,
But I don't disagree with portions of the article....


wheel,
jetblasted Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 08-30-2004
Posts: 42,595
I think he just really hates the "old person smell"

Mellow
Abrignac Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,278
TMCTLT wrote:
For pieces of **** who are shot during the commission of a crime.? Hell Yes, **** them, but no first they'll be saved and then even More precious recources wated on them with a trial....d'oh!



Are you saying that when EMS rolls up on a shooting patient they should first allow the police to investigate to see if the patient is a victim or a perpetrator before taking them to a trama center?
TMCTLT Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
Abrignac wrote:
Are you saying that when EMS rolls up on a shooting patient they should first allow the police to investigate to see if the patient is a victim or a perpetrator before taking them to a trama center?



Are you saying that we always need the police to tell us who committed a crime? Let's be honest here, very seldom doohickey protect us from aggressors, but are only there to write up a report.
victor809 Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
I'm pretty sure the police aren't responsible for convicting people either.

For someone who doesn't want a lot of government control you're really suggesting the government based emergency services and hospitals make some pretty impactful decisions in peoples lives
Buckwheat Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 04-15-2004
Posts: 12,251
victor809 wrote:
I'm pretty sure the police aren't responsible for convicting people either.

For someone who doesn't want a lot of government control you're really suggesting the government based emergency services and hospitals make some pretty impactful decisions in peoples lives


Sadly, that's not what has been happening lately.
TMCTLT Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
The whole dog and pony show is a bit of a joke IMHO, don't misunderstand me I'm ALL for abiding our laws especially when it comes to the BIG ones...robbery / theft / assault etc. but the whole relationship between LE and our courts have become more of a way of filling the coffers what with fines... Court costs...attorney fees. The whole thing has become some what corruptive in it's own right iMHO
TMCTLT Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
victor809 wrote:
I'm pretty sure the police aren't responsible for convicting people either.

For someone who doesn't want a lot of government control you're really suggesting the government based emergency services and hospitals make some pretty impactful decisions in peoples lives



They already do and you and I both know it. Victims forced to relive what happened to them in court. Even when a perp is caught red handed with multiple witnesses....same dog and pony show with the law giving what seems More protection under the Constitution than the victim and their family members.
wheelrite Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 11-01-2006
Posts: 50,119
TMCTLT wrote:
They already do and you and I both know it. Victims forced to relive what happened to them in court. Even when a perp is caught red handed with multiple witnesses....same dog and pony show with the law giving what seems More protection under the Constitution than the victim and their family members.


Bro,
There is no law regarding the Victim's family members,,,

They are irrelevant in a criminal case,,,
They weren't killed, maimed or robbed,,,

Everyone deserves the best defense and are innocent until proven guilty,,

wheel,,
Abrignac Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,278
TMCTLT wrote:
They already do and you and I both know it. Victims forced to relive what happened to them in court. Even when a perp is caught red handed with multiple witnesses....same dog and pony show with the law giving what seems More protection under the Constitution than the victim and their family members.



Sure there is a dog and pony show. But, ..............

Quote:
nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law


Quote:
to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defense.


By and large most crime victims are victimized outside the presence of witnesses. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense to commit crimes in front of witnesses. The notion of someone being caught "red-handed" is mostly fiction perpetuated by TV.

As a part of the "system" I'm glad people accused of crimes have the rights they do. If my loved one stood accused of a crime I would certainly hope they have the ability to defend themselves. Do we really want to live where we are tossed in jail and presumed to be guilty and have to prove our innocence?
Abrignac Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,278
TMCTLT wrote:
Are you saying that we always need the police to tell us who committed a crime? Let's be honest here, very seldom doohickey protect us from aggressors, but are only there to write up a report.



Protect us from aggressors? Since when is that a function of law enforcement? Just because some agencies choose to put "Protect & Serve" on the sides of their cars how does one suppose law enforcement can protect it's citizens? To do so would require as many law enforcement officers as those seeking protection. How can a person be protected in their home against a rapist by a law enforcement officer patrolling 3 blocks away?

Law enforcement officers aren't body guards. They are there to investigate criminal acts and take into custody perpetrators to be held over until 1) taken to trial by a prosecutor, 2) released because a prosecutor declines to take a person to trial or 3) released by a judge & or jury for lack of evidence.
TMCTLT Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
Abrignac wrote:
Protect us from aggressors? Since when is that a function of law enforcement? Just because some agencies choose to put "Protect & Serve" on the sides of their cars how does one suppose law enforcement can protect it's citizens? To do so would require as many law enforcement officers as those seeking protection. How can a person be protected in their home against a rapist by a law enforcement officer patrolling 3 blocks away?

Law enforcement officers aren't body guards. They are there to investigate criminal acts and take into custody perpetrators to be held over until 1) taken to trial by a prosecutor, 2) released because a prosecutor declines to take a person to trial or 3) released by a judge & or jury for lack of evidence.




Anthony. Then you tell Me why is it in virtually every community when there is a spike in crime or a run on criminal activity the answer is ALWAYS to hire more LEO's ?? Because they ( Mayor / COP etc. want to instill a False sense of security that the population will now " be safer " but I'm not convinced the cost to taxpayers is worth what they get in return. And it's interesting you say they're not body guards but there to investigate the crime...I thought that's what the Detectives didThink
TMCTLT Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
wheelrite wrote:
Bro,
There is no law regarding the Victim's family members,,,

They are irrelevant in a criminal case,,,
They weren't killed, maimed or robbed,,,

Everyone deserves the best defense and are innocent until proven guilty,,

wheel,,



Didn't say anything about family members and to some extent I disagree. There are lifetime criminal who understand completely the dog and pony show that exists and repeatedly thumb their nose @ our laws with total disregard and ALL@ taxpayer expense.
Abrignac Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,278
TMCTLT wrote:
Anthony. Then you tell Me why is it in virtually every community when there is a spike in crime or a run on criminal activity the answer is ALWAYS to hire more LEO's ?? Because they ( Mayor / COP etc. want to instill a False sense of security that the population will now " be safer " but I'm not convinced the cost to taxpayers is worth what they get in return. And it's interesting you say they're not body guards but there to investigate the crime...I thought that's what the Detectives didThink


Detectives are law enforcement officers. But, detectives don't investigate every case. In fact patrol officers make numerous cases themselves with little or no assistance from detectives. Depends on the case.

Money is power. Increasing ones budget is a way to garner more power. Adding employees is a great way to increase a budget.

Most departments operate on a very simple plan. They have officers who are on patrol. About the only places they actually patrol is small "Mayberry" type towns though. What that really do 12-16 hours a day is go from one call to the next. "Stolen" cell phones, 911 hang ups, "suspicious" persons walking alongside the road, fights, corner dope deals, "beer runs," etc. Detectives get called out on major incidents like rapes, robberies, murders, burglaries, etc....

Law enforcement is really not about safety. It is for the most part a reactionary force called after the fact.

All that being said, law enforcement is at times proactive. But, as a reaction to something that has happened. For instance, suppose a neighborhood has experienced a rash of burglaries or rapes. Then law enforcement with react by stepping up patrols and/or stakeouts in those areas provided they have sufficient resources to do so.

As far as hiring more officers when crime rates go up, is that any more different than a contractor hiring more carpenters when housing sales go up.

It seems you have little regard for law enforcement officers. But, who is going to arrest the thugs?
TMCTLT Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
Abrignac wrote:
Detectives are law enforcement officers. But, detectives don't investigate every case. In fact patrol officers make numerous cases themselves with little or no assistance from detectives. Depends on the case.

Money is power. Increasing ones budget is a way to garner more power. Adding employees is a great way to increase a budget.

Most departments operate on a very simple plan. They have officers who are on patrol. About the only places they actually patrol is small "Mayberry" type towns though. What that really do 12-16 hours a day is go from one call to the next. "Stolen" cell phones, 911 hang ups, "suspicious" persons walking alongside the road, fights, corner dope deals, "beer runs," etc. Detectives get called out on major incidents like rapes, robberies, murders, burglaries, etc....

Law enforcement is really not about safety. It is for the most part a reactionary force called after the fact.

All that being said, law enforcement is at times proactive. But, as a reaction to something that has happened. For instance, suppose a neighborhood has experienced a rash of burglaries or rapes. Then law enforcement with react by stepping up patrols and/or stakeouts in those areas provided they have sufficient resources to do so.

As far as hiring more officers when crime rates go up, is that any more different than a contractor hiring more carpenters when housing sales go up.

It seems you have little regard for law enforcement officers. But, who is going to arrest the thugs?



You would be mistaken about how I regard LEO's but @ the same time I do not put them on a pedestal. I very much appreciate that they / you put yourselves on the line @ times and understand it can be a thankless job but I think more often than not it's the legal industry and our Courts who let you guys and their communities down.
Abrignac Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,278
TMCTLT wrote:
You would be mistaken about how I regard LEO's but @ the same time I do not put them on a pedestal. I very much appreciate that they / you put yourselves on the line @ times and understand it can be a thankless job but I think more often than not it's the legal industry and our Courts who let you guys and their communities down.


Respect is earned, not demanded. In all walks of life, there are those who forget this.

The criminal justice system is one big puzzle. You will most certainly hear officers complain of judges that continuously let criminals go. Truth be told, in many, but not all cases the officers were deficient in their presentation to those judges. I've seen this many times first hand. Those same officers will curse defense attorneys for embarrassing them on the witness stand. That being said, I have seen judges rule one way on a particular issue. Then do an about face and overrule their own ruling on the same matter.

I don't really think anyone is being let down. Our system isn't perfect, but no system really is. In some countries, a citizen can be accused of a crime and incarcerated even though there is little evidence to prove such a case.

Recently, there was a case from Iran that gained worldwide attention. A lady was accused of murdering a person who if memory serves me tried to rape her. There was very little evidence against her. But, as we all know women are not afforded nearly as many rights as men in that country. Long story short, she was minutes from execution when her life was spared for the second time. One wonders how many lives she has.

At the end of the day, I prefer our system. The notion that one's freedom can be taken away is one that should always be carefully considered, errors should fall on the side of the accused and only when we are sure without any reasonable doubt should a person be deprived of their liberty. To do so however, means that some guilty parties will walk. But, as with anything there is an opportunity cost.
teedubbya Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I'm puzzled by how many folks think nearly everything in this country is effed up yet still claim to think this country is great.

Our legal system has son warts but by god I'm glad we have ours as opposed to virtually any other.

Then again I'm one of those folks that would rather have 10 guilty go free than 1 innocent incarcerated. To accomplish that there will be cases to bitch about.
teedubbya Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I'm puzzled by how many folks think nearly everything in this country is effed up yet still claim to think this country is great.

Our legal system has son warts but by god I'm glad we have ours as opposed to virtually any other.

Then again I'm one of those folks that would rather have 10 guilty go free than 1 innocent incarcerated. To accomplish that there will be cases to bitch about.
teedubbya Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I'm puzzled by how many folks think nearly everything in this country is effed up yet still claim to think this country is great.

Our legal system has son warts but by god I'm glad we have ours as opposed to virtually any other.

Then again I'm one of those folks that would rather have 10 guilty go free than 1 innocent incarcerated. To accomplish that there will be cases to bitch about.
teedubbya Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I'm puzzled by how many folks think nearly everything in this country is effed up yet still claim to think this country is great.

Our legal system has son warts but by god I'm glad we have ours as opposed to virtually any other.

Then again I'm one of those folks that would rather have 10 guilty go free than 1 innocent incarcerated. To accomplish that there will be cases to bitch about.
teedubbya Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Whoa. That was weird.
TMCTLT Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
teedubbya wrote:
I'm puzzled by how many folks think nearly everything in this country is effed up yet still claim to think this country is great.

Our legal system has son warts but by god I'm glad we have ours as opposed to virtually any other.

Then again I'm one of those folks that would rather have 10 guilty go free than 1 innocent incarcerated. To accomplish that there will be cases to bitch about.



Let's just say it's " losing " some of its greatness. And I'm not sure I agree with your take on the whole 10 to one scenario, with the friggin appeals process we have it's rare anymore that when it's over that the wrong man / woman went to jail or prison. Unless of course there was some falsifying of evidence going on somewhere.
cacman Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 07-03-2010
Posts: 12,216
teedubbya wrote:
Then again I'm one of those folks that would rather have 10 guilty go free than 1 innocent incarcerated.

Glad I don't live in that neighborhood!
But it offers another good reason to own a firearm!
Abrignac Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 02-24-2012
Posts: 17,278
teedubbya wrote:
I'm puzzled by how many folks think nearly everything in this country is effed up yet still claim to think this country is great.

Our legal system has son warts but by god I'm glad we have ours as opposed to virtually any other.

Then again I'm one of those folks that would rather have 10 guilty go free than 1 innocent incarcerated. To accomplish that there will be cases to bitch about.



It puzzling that you've so puzzled. On the other hand, I don't think or judicial system is edged up, though there are surely some effed up people who are a part of said system.
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