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Last post 8 years ago by tailgater. 62 replies replies.
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editorial cartoon shows Obama kids as monkeys.
tailgater Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Got your attention?

How would that play out in the media if it happened?

Well, if you're a Latino Senator from Texas, then your kids are fair game.
As Ted Cruz recently found out.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2015/12/23/ted-cruz-cartoon-children-washington-post-2016-campaign/77798556/


This was 100% pure partisan hatred by the paper.
They should stick to the more subtle approach so the pantie wasted liberals don't have to soil themselves trying to justify their filthy hypocrisy.
rfenst Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,436
family, especially children, shoud be off-limits- unless that individual makes themself a political public-character

what was done to cruz' kids was terrible
Speyside Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
The media has no shame. That was wrong on so many levels.
tonygraz Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
Cruz wants it both ways - wants to use the girls in ads but doesn't want they portrayed by anyone else. I think he liked the fact that he could get some press out of it.
rfenst Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,436
tonygraz wrote:
Cruz wants it both ways - wants to use the girls in ads but doesn't want they portrayed by anyone else. I think he liked the fact that he could get some press out of it.


That is not a good enough reason to depict them negatively in a political cartoon.
tailgater Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
tonygraz wrote:
Cruz wants it both ways - wants to use the girls in ads but doesn't want they portrayed by anyone else.



The guy has his kids in his campaign ad so it's OK to draw them as monkeys?
It would be difficult for me to think less of you if this is how you truly feel.

cacman Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 07-03-2010
Posts: 12,216
The libs would go into full blown meltdown if the big "O"s kids where portrayed as monkeys. Have to give Cruz credit for the way he has handled it without playing the race card.

But what's OK for the libs to do (steal secret voter data, store top secret data on private server, illegally run guns through Benghazi, etc) is not OK for the conservatives. The classic "do as I say, not as I do" scenario!

But I did hear Moochelle was trying-out for the role of Chewbacca's new love interest.
TMCTLT Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
rfenst wrote:
That is not a good enough reason to depict them negatively in a political cartoon.




But....there is a good enough reason out there???? Think
rfenst Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,436
TMCTLT wrote:
But....there is a good enough reason out there???? Think


Yeah, for example if they were adults out on the campaign trail for their dad. Like Hillary's daughter or Jeb's son.
tonygraz Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
Too much hate, too much racism. Nice things for the Christmas holiday.
victor809 Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Tail,neither politician's kids should be drawn as monkeys. That being said, to pretend that drawing Latino kids as monkeys is the same as drawing black kids as monkeys is simply stupid. One is a nasty unnecessary insult to a kid, the other is a nasty unnecessary and racist insult to a kid.
Brewha Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,202
So with Trump insulting nations, right wing commentators like Limbaugh insulting everyone's intelligence and our very own Cbid Right calling the First Lady a monkey we will now take moral high ground by denouncing a cartoon. A cartoon that was pulled. A cartoon that fairly mocked Cruz for parading his kids a bit too much.

Sometimes irony can be pretty ironic.....
ZRX1200 Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,662
Who called Moochelle a monkey?

I said Wookie.
Brewha Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,202
Ok, I was taking artistic license.

But Chewie always looked like a monkey to me.....
Covfireman Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 09-03-2015
Posts: 809
Howard Cosell was fired for saying look at that monkey run .
cacman Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 07-03-2010
Posts: 12,216
victor809 wrote:
Tail,neither politician's kids should be drawn as monkeys. That being said, to pretend that drawing Latino kids as monkeys is the same as drawing black kids as monkeys is simply stupid. One is a nasty unnecessary insult to a kid, the other is a nasty unnecessary and racist insult to a kid.

Why is it racist to draw black kids as a monkey, but it's not racist and only an insult to draw latino kids as a monkey??
Talk about encouraging a double-standard you putz.



Covfireman wrote:
Howard Cosell was fired for saying look at that monkey run .

A white announcer.
Wonder what would happen if Dion Sanders said "look at that monkey run".

Or is this another one of those "n" word instances where it's OK for them to call each other that. But God forbid anyone else call them that and they are considered a racist SOB.
tonygraz Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
There are no indigenous monkeys in Canada that I know of. Perhaps mules would have been more appropriate.
cacman Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 07-03-2010
Posts: 12,216
tonygraz wrote:
There are no indigenous monkeys in Canada that I know of. Perhaps mules would have been more appropriate.

Funny. In some places the term "canadian" is a derogatory/slang term instead of using "monkey" or the "n" word.
tailgater Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
Tail,neither politician's kids should be drawn as monkeys. That being said, to pretend that drawing Latino kids as monkeys is the same as drawing black kids as monkeys is simply stupid. One is a nasty unnecessary insult to a kid, the other is a nasty unnecessary and racist insult to a kid.


How utterly PC of you.
You say it's wrong with your first sentence, then explain how it could be even more wrong depending on the color of the kids. That's a viewpoint born from liberal thought inbreeding.
A 6 year old kid wouldn't know racism unless it was taught to them by the BLM movement or some other terrorist hate group.
But a 6 year old does know when they're being ridiculed or poked fun of.

And when it's a so-called adult doing it?
And when people say "well, it's not like they were black"?

So I guess we can burn a cross in Cruz's front yard. I mean, it's not like he's black so it wouldn't really be "hate".




Brewha Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,202
tailgater wrote:
How utterly PC of you.
You say it's wrong with your first sentence, then explain how it could be even more wrong depending on the color of the kids. That's a viewpoint born from liberal thought inbreeding.


I hear that Victor aspires to someday be a liberal.
Although this is an admittedly bumpy start.....
tonygraz Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
tailgater wrote:
How utterly PC of you.
You say it's wrong with your first sentence, then explain how it could be even more wrong depending on the color of the kids. That's a viewpoint born from liberal thought inbreeding.
A 6 year old kid wouldn't know racism unless it was taught to them by the BLM movement or some other terrorist hate group.
But a 6 year old does know when they're being ridiculed or poked fun of.

And when it's a so-called adult doing it?
And when people say "well, it's not like they were black"?

So I guess we can burn a cross in Cruz's front yard. I mean, it's not like he's black so it wouldn't really be "hate".



He probably has at least one cross in his front yard, making that task easier.
tonygraz Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
Brewha wrote:
I hear that Victor aspires to someday be a liberal.
Although this is an admittedly bumpy start.....


"Now, I'm liberal, but to a degree
I want ev'rybody to be free
But if you think that I'll let Barry Goldwater
Move in next door and marry my daughter
You must think I'm crazy!
I wouldn't let him do it for all the farms in Cuba."
victor809 Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
I can only assume that people here are being intentionally obtuse.
To my knowledge (I will admit I'm not up on the latest racist insults) the black race is the only race which has been intentionally and in some cases institutionally linked to another animal. And incidentally that animal is a monkey.

Just because a 6 year old isn't going to know the institutional history of a racist slur doesn't absolve the adult author of one. As there is no historical racist association of either Canadians or Latinos with monkeys I have to assume that the cartoon, while inappropriate and insulting has no more racism behind it than there is when drafter's boyfriend calls him a bear.

I'm not surprised that this goes above the head of people here. This was the same group that was jumping up and down with joy at a picture of Obama drawn as a monkey.
gummy jones Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
https://padresteve.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/1942xthis_is_the_enemy_us_2.jpg
tonygraz Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
And for those who are racist and believe in the bible, we are all the descendants one one couple. Maybe they want to change that with the story of creationism to fit their prejudices.
banderl Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 09-09-2008
Posts: 10,153
victor809 wrote:
I can only assume that people here are being intentionally obtuse.
To my knowledge (I will admit I'm not up on the latest racist insults) the black race is the only race which has been intentionally and in some cases institutionally linked to another animal. And incidentally that animal is a monkey.

Just because a 6 year old isn't going to know the institutional history of a racist slur doesn't absolve the adult author of one. As there is no historical racist association of either Canadians or Latinos with monkeys I have to assume that the cartoon, while inappropriate and insulting has no more racism behind it than there is when drafter's boyfriend calls him a bear.

I'm not surprised that this goes above the head of people here. This was the same group that was jumping up and down with joy at a picture of Obama drawn as a monkey.



Wait, Drafter's boyfriend calls him a bear?
DrafterX Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,588
Shame on you


Drafter's girlfriends say he's hung like a bear... Mellow
banderl Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 09-09-2008
Posts: 10,153
That's not what Victor heard.
DrafterX Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,588
Victor is deaf in one ear.... to many, well, I won't go there... Mellow
tonygraz Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
DrafterX wrote:
Shame on you


Drafter's girlfriends say he's hung like a bear... Mellow


Male or female ?
DrafterX Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,588
Mellow
Buckwheat Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 04-15-2004
Posts: 12,251
Minor children should be off limits. Period!
banderl Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 09-09-2008
Posts: 10,153
Buckwheat wrote:
Minor children should be off limits. Period!



That's right, so quit picking on Drafter.
Brewha Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,202
victor809 wrote:
I can only assume that people here are being intentionally obtuse.
To my knowledge (I will admit I'm not up on the latest racist insults) the black race is the only race which has been intentionally and in some cases institutionally linked to another animal. And incidentally that animal is a monkey.

Just because a 6 year old isn't going to know the institutional history of a racist slur doesn't absolve the adult author of one. As there is no historical racist association of either Canadians or Latinos with monkeys I have to assume that the cartoon, while inappropriate and insulting has no more racism behind it than there is when drafter's boyfriend calls him a bear.

I'm not surprised that this goes above the head of people here. This was the same group that was jumping up and down with joy at a picture of Obama drawn as a monkey.

Correction; the French have been associated with weasels.
tonygraz Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,320
I thought it was frogs.
tailgater Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Brewha wrote:
Correction; the French have been associated with weasels.


And the weasels have taken offense.
tailgater Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
tonygraz wrote:
He probably has at least one cross in his front yard, making that task easier.


Now that's funny.
Applause
tailgater Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
Brewha wrote:
I hear that Victor aspires to someday be a liberal.
Although this is an admittedly bumpy start.....


Victor knows that I don't consider him a liberal.
But I equate his reasoning on this subject as being born from the liberal institution of mainstream media.


tailgater Offline
#39 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
I can only assume that people here are being intentionally obtuse.
To my knowledge (I will admit I'm not up on the latest racist insults) the black race is the only race which has been intentionally and in some cases institutionally linked to another animal. And incidentally that animal is a monkey.

Just because a 6 year old isn't going to know the institutional history of a racist slur doesn't absolve the adult author of one. As there is no historical racist association of either Canadians or Latinos with monkeys I have to assume that the cartoon, while inappropriate and insulting has no more racism behind it than there is when drafter's boyfriend calls him a bear.

I'm not surprised that this goes above the head of people here. This was the same group that was jumping up and down with joy at a picture of Obama drawn as a monkey.


You're missing the point.
I'm not saying the cartoon is offensive because it's racist. It's offensive because it negatively portrays little kids.
You claim this offense would be somehow WORSE if it also were one of several neat little "Hate" categories. I say it wouldn't be. It's offensive First and Foremost because it's aimed unfairly at little kids.
Everything else is just dressing.

The artist KNEW it wasn't funny.
Wasn't even obvious.
So she went for offensive. Ridicule the 5 year old. And while you're at it be sure to choose a subject that will make people defend her artwork by default. Because "at least it's not racist". Which at the end of the day is a vote in her favor.



And for the record, I think the Italians might find the organ grinder/monkey association somewhat offensive.
But the Italians wouldn't b*tch about it.
They'd just put out a hit...
Speyside Offline
#40 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
It may not be racist, but certainly it is hateful, bigoted, and offensive. No matter what the children's ethnicity is displaying them as monkeys is wrong.
gummy jones Offline
#41 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
tailgater wrote:
You're missing the point.
I'm not saying the cartoon is offensive because it's racist. It's offensive because it negatively portrays little kids.
You claim this offense would be somehow WORSE if it also were one of several neat little "Hate" categories. I say it wouldn't be. It's offensive First and Foremost because it's aimed unfairly at little kids.
Everything else is just dressing.

The artist KNEW it wasn't funny.
Wasn't even obvious.
So she went for offensive. Ridicule the 5 year old. And while you're at it be sure to choose a subject that will make people defend her artwork by default. Because "at least it's not racist". Which at the end of the day is a vote in her favor.



And for the record, I think the Italians might find the organ grinder/monkey association somewhat offensive.
But the Italians wouldn't b*tch about it.
They'd just put out a hit...


yea but racism and hate crimes and stuff are extra bad and stuff fog
victor809 Offline
#42 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Tail, the bulk of that response was to cacman who literally asked "why is it racist to call black kids monkeys but not racist to call Latino kids monkeys" or some such nonsense.

You did however choose to bring racism into the conversation with your thread title. You could have just said "hey look at how insulting this cartoonist was".
tailgater Offline
#43 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
Tail, the bulk of that response was to cacman who literally asked "why is it racist to call black kids monkeys but not racist to call Latino kids monkeys" or some such nonsense.

You did however choose to bring racism into the conversation with your thread title. You could have just said "hey look at how insulting this cartoonist was".


True,
But it wasn't just the insult that made me mad, but the excused hypocrisy.
You yourself stated that it was "bad, but not as bad as it would be if it were racist".
And even though you don't mean to suggest that the cartoon is therefore OK, the cumulative effect of people half shrugging it off diminishes any negative impact on the artist.











victor809 Offline
#44 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
An insulting cartoon insults the kids depicted in it.
A racist cartoon insults the kids depicted in it as well as all kids of that race as well as perpetuating a specific denigration of a particular race (something which has long term consequences)

One could argue there isn't a difference, but I kind of think there is.
tailgater Offline
#45 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
victor809 wrote:
An insulting cartoon insults the kids depicted in it.
A racist cartoon insults the kids depicted in it as well as all kids of that race as well as perpetuating a specific denigration of a particular race (something which has long term consequences)

One could argue there isn't a difference, but I kind of think there is.


Not saying there isn't a difference.
Just not buying that racism makes it a trump card in the offensive category. Pun not entirely intended.


If I call a guys wife a whore, that's an offensive insult.
If I call her a black whore I get kicked out of the lodge.

Treating both instances as equally wrong in no way diminishes the vulgarity of the racist remark. But treating the racism as "worse" actually does diminish how the non-racial comment is viewed.

Potato Patahto. But I've grown weary of the protected class demanding MORE outrage.

BLM anyone?



Brewha Offline
#46 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,202
Speyside wrote:
It may not be racist, but certainly it is hateful, bigoted, and offensive. No matter what the children's ethnicity is displaying them as monkeys is wrong.

The cartoonist should have drawn them as Wookies - which would have been ok.

Ah, there is such a fine like between genius and stupidity.......
Speyside Offline
#47 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
If you say so, I thought that was also hateful, bigoted, and offensive. Though that's just my opinion.
Brewha Offline
#48 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,202
Actually I was just taking a poke at Z.

I agree it was offensive and needed to be pulled. But when it comes to the things typically drawn, written and said in the political arena, was it really a stand out?
gummy jones Offline
#49 Posted:
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
Brewha wrote:
Actually I was just taking a poke at Z.

I agree it was offensive and needed to be pulled. But when it comes to the things typically drawn, written and said in the political arena, was it really a stand out?


i have seen obama kids in the spotlight and pro obama ads but never in negative ones (as it should be)

so ya
Speyside Offline
#50 Posted:
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
No, but family should not be fair game for political satirists, Republican or Democrat.
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