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Prayers for Sutherland Springs....
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DrafterX Offline
#1 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 8:20 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
Pray Pray


Strange times were living in....Mellow
Speyside Offline
#2 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 9:34 AM EST
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
Sick times.
RMAN4443 Offline
#3 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 1:19 PM EST
Joined: 09-29-2016
Posts: 7,683
DrafterX wrote:
[-o< [-o<


Strange times were living in....Mellow

I just don't get it.......what reason could you have to shoot up a churchNot talking edit: or synagogue

[-o< [-o<
victor809 Offline
#4 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 1:28 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
While thing coulda been avoided....


...if only people would just stay out of churches... dangerous things those...
TMCTLT Offline
#5 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 1:44 PM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
victor809 wrote:
While thing coulda been avoided....


...if only people would just stay out of churches... dangerous things those...



Yeah...especially so when an atheist drops by with his gun.

http://nypost.com/2017/11/06/ex-friends-say-shooter-was-creepy-atheist-who-berated-religious-people/

http://www.breitbart.com/texas/2017/11/05/report-texas-church-shooter-atheist-thought-christians-stupid/

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/high-school-classmates-say-texas-church-shooter-preached-atheism-online/article/2639727
victor809 Offline
#6 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 1:49 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
... an atheist who taught bible school....
TMCTLT Offline
#7 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 1:50 PM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
victor809 wrote:
... an atheist who taught bible school....



Speaking of creepy atheists....
victor809 Offline
#8 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 2:05 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
...while I'll gladly be called an atheist... hell I'd gladly be called creepy by the likes of you (sort of a reverse complement... if someone as screwed up in the head as you thinks I'm creepy I must be doing something right).

But I think it might be premature to call the Texas shooter an atheist.
TMCTLT Offline
#9 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 2:12 PM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
victor809 wrote:
...while I'll gladly be called an atheist... hell I'd gladly be called creepy by the likes of you (sort of a reverse complement... if someone as screwed up in the head as you thinks I'm creepy I must be doing something right).

But I think it might be premature to call the Texas shooter an atheist.



Really? Look @ ANY report coming out of this tragedy....his own "friends" referred to him as a CREEPY ATHEIST.

Keep up the good karma there Vicki!!!!
victor809 Offline
#10 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 2:47 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
If by "any report" you mean a daily caller article... sure.
And by "friends" you mean quotes from a couple Facebook friends...

It's not hard to see how you get your news.

But I'm gonna hold off a little, given that the guy did spend a summer teaching bible study (this is not just reported by random internet "friends" of his).

But, even if he is an atheist... so? I hear some atheists are good people... there were probably bad actors on both sides.
victor809 Offline
#11 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 2:52 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Apologies... daily mail, not daily caller.
Ewok126 Offline
#12 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 2:55 PM EST
Joined: 06-25-2017
Posts: 4,356
victor809 wrote:
If by "any report" you mean a daily caller article... sure.
And by "friends" you mean quotes from a couple Facebook friends...

It's not hard to see how you get your news.

But I'm gonna hold off a little, given that the guy did spend a summer teaching bible study (this is not just reported by random internet "friends" of his).

But, even if he is an atheist... so? I hear some atheists are good people... there were probably bad actors on both sides.



One of my best friends is an Atheist. He is one of the best people that I know. He is just more science oreinted by nature. I myself am a christian but yet science is my background. I just tend to have faith.
delta1 Offline
#13 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 3:56 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,788
I have faith that we haven't seen the end of bad stuff in our life-times, prolly more horrible than we've ever seen. Mankind keeps getting more and more obsessed with self-destruction...

I also have faith that there is more beauty and wonder yet to be seen in our lifetimes...

Unlike shopping at the grocery store, in real life you must take the bad with the good...
victor809 Offline
#14 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 4:06 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
If only people would learn to stop gathering in places... things like this wouldn't happen.

Poor guy just wanted to shoot his mother in law...
DrMaddVibe Offline
#15 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 4:09 PM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,431
victor809 wrote:
If only people would learn to stop gathering in places... things like this wouldn't happen.

Poor guy just wanted to shoot his mother in law...



Everyone interviewed talking about him describes him as being a d!ck. Being an atheist is like icing on the cake.
victor809 Offline
#16 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 4:28 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
... everyone interviewed describes him as a d!ck... huh.
Suppose that's a refreshing change from "he was such a nice guy I didn't expect him to kill and eat all those people"...

...wonder how online "friends" would describe many of us if our names ended up associated with an incident like this?

On a side note... are you advocating some sort of law against being a d!ck? Or just pointing it out?
MACS Offline
#17 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 4:32 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,779
The good news is... he's dead, and it didn't cost the taxpayers any money for a lengthy court battle and incarceration.
RMAN4443 Offline
#18 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 5:31 PM EST
Joined: 09-29-2016
Posts: 7,683
MACS wrote:
The good news is... he's dead, and it didn't cost the taxpayers any money for a lengthy court battle and incarceration.

Always look on the bright side of life Whistle
Mattie B Offline
#19 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 5:40 PM EST
Joined: 12-12-2005
Posts: 6,350
My heart hurts for the victims. Such a tragedy.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#20 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 6:58 PM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,431
victor809 wrote:
On a side note... are you advocating some sort of law against being a d!ck? Or just pointing it out?


Why you looking to photograph it or something? Frame it for the house? Put it on your desk at work? Post it here on CBid?
Gene363 Offline
#21 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 7:21 PM EST
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,817
MACS wrote:
The good news is... he's dead, and it didn't cost the taxpayers any money for a lengthy court battle and incarceration.


Yup, two slugs from the armed citizen that shot his worthless carcass and one to the head that appeared to be self inflicted.
Gene363 Offline
#22 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 7:27 PM EST
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,817

It sounds like the NCIS system is not getting convictions from the military justice systems. The S'bag shooter was convicted of beating his wife and child while in the Air Force. That alone would be enough to bar him from buying a weapon and if he had a dishonorable discharge, (felony?), that too should have kept him from buying a firearm.
victor809 Offline
#23 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 7:38 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
So I'm gonna be honest... threads like this are irritating.

I'd read an opinion piece on cnn which sort of trended this direction, but it was really whiny and pro gun controlly and crap so I'm not gonna link it.

but there's a message which shouldn't be ignored.

We don't really care.

honestly, I don't think we should care. And I'm fine with us not caring.

but threads about "praying for the victims" or "thoughts and prayers" and all that crap is simply bullsh$t lip service.

This was an unfortunate incident which we don't really care about outside of being glad it didn't happen to anyone we know.

Perhaps some people care... those who are trying to actually change something to make sure it doesn't happen again. But I don't think they are spending their effort in a worthwhile manner. They may care, but through caring they're mostly doing things which will restrict the rights of people who didn't get killed.

But be honest. If all you're doing is typing "prayers go out" or even actually praying... you don't really care.

I'm sorry to be blunt, and I'm sure some here will call me an azzhole. But I'm just tired of this crap. It's happened a number of times before. It will happen a huge number of times in the future. You know this, I know this. To know this and do nothing is fine.... we have a lot of human lives, we can lose a whole bunch without any impact on the world. But to know this, pretend to be sad about it, but still not actually try to change any behavior, any laws or anything at all... that's just weak.
DrafterX Offline
#24 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 7:45 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
It's always about you...Not talking
MACS Offline
#25 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 8:17 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,779
We all agree violent people shouldn't have guns. Nor mental patients. Looks like this tool was both, and still got a gun. I think the one thing that can be done, will never be done... and that's to do away with CCW's and say, if you can legally buy a gun, you can carry it concealed.

The media is decrying another mass shooting, in church no less, and pretty much barely glossing over the fact the dude was shot twice by an armed citizen. Good job to the armed citizen.

Allowing more folks to carry concealed won't stop lunatics, but it may allow someone to shoot them a lot sooner so they kill less people.
victor809 Offline
#26 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 8:51 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
I don't think the media is glossing over it at all MACS. Every article I have seen always stated he was shot by an armed citizen. You should be concerned if someone is telling you otherwise
MACS Offline
#27 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 9:11 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,779
Yeah. Stated it. As an afterthought. They say nothing else about it... like, "Good thing that guy was there with his gun, or it could have been worse".

And if people praying and showing empathy for others is a source of 'irritation' for you, that says more about you than it does about those being empathetic to their fellow citizens.
teedubbya Offline
#28 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 9:14 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
This is about as accurate as the atheist and the previously reported antifa thing

https://www.theonion.com/no-way-to-prevent-this-says-only-nation-where-this-r-1820163660

Prayers. It must stop.
teedubbya Offline
#29 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 9:46 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Dumb question. Why is this in the politics thread and why are we making it political. Both sides ought to think about that.
MACS Offline
#30 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 9:51 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,779
teedubbya wrote:
Dumb question. Why is this in the politics thread and why are we making it political. Both sides ought to think about that.


WE didn't. The politicians and the media made it political damn near as soon as it happened. As usual.
delta1 Offline
#31 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:01 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,788
the side that believes there isn't anything we can do about this because Americans have the 2nd Amendment right to buy as many guns, and whatever type of gun, they want to protect themselves and their families -- has prevailed. Gun sales generally spike after mass shootings...ergo "now is not the time to talk about gun policy" ...

There are so many guns already in circulation in our country that any effort to control or regulate them will be useless. Opposing viewpoints are hopelessly outnumbered...might as well get on the train or be run over...
teedubbya Offline
#32 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:07 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Macs you seem to be less and less about personal responsibility.

Yes we did. Drafter posted it in here and folks followed suit. WE didn’t have to make it political. No one forced us to. We chose to.

Don’t blame the politicians for our actions.

Gene363 Offline
#33 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:11 PM EST
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,817
victor809 wrote:
So I'm gonna be honest... threads like this are irritating.

I'd read an opinion piece on cnn which sort of trended this direction, but it was really whiny and pro gun controlly and crap so I'm not gonna link it.

but there's a message which shouldn't be ignored.

We don't really care.

honestly, I don't think we should care. And I'm fine with us not caring.

but threads about "praying for the victims" or "thoughts and prayers" and all that crap is simply bullsh$t lip service.

This was an unfortunate incident which we don't really care about outside of being glad it didn't happen to anyone we know.

Perhaps some people care... those who are trying to actually change something to make sure it doesn't happen again. But I don't think they are spending their effort in a worthwhile manner. They may care, but through caring they're mostly doing things which will restrict the rights of people who didn't get killed.

But be honest. If all you're doing is typing "prayers go out" or even actually praying... you don't really care.

I'm sorry to be blunt, and I'm sure some here will call me an azzhole. But I'm just tired of this crap. It's happened a number of times before. It will happen a huge number of times in the future. You know this, I know this. To know this and do nothing is fine.... we have a lot of human lives, we can lose a whole bunch without any impact on the world. But to know this, pretend to be sad about it, but still not actually try to change any behavior, any laws or anything at all... that's just weak.


It's your opinion about something you don't believe in so why even comment? I don't believe in ghosts, but I don't go around arguing with those that do or call their ideas baloney, unless they ask me. I may also laugh out loud. The point being it does not affect me in the least what other believe, why does it bother you so much. It's like you're a reverse Jehovah witness.
teedubbya Offline
#34 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:11 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
That didn’t capture my tone. I was just tweaking ya Macs.
victor809 Offline
#35 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:23 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Gene... my irritation has nothing to do with my lack of belief in it working. Whether prayer worked or not (and let's be honest, if it did then missing family members would miraculously appear, both teams would win a football game, all our pen1ses would be 12 inches in girth etc etc etc) it is the lack of any interest in doing something to stop it from happening again.

Hell... people aren't even dedicated enough to pray that this is the last mass shooting ever. Notice its always "thoughts and prayers for the families of the dead" not "thoughts and prayers that this will never happen again"....They're impotently reacting rather than showing any interest in stopping another. It's very telling. And I must reiterate, I don't think there is any value to stopping the next one, but why pretend to care about this one when you have no interest in it not happening again?
victor809 Offline
#36 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:32 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
What's funny about the onion article TW posted is it's from after a different mass shooting...

Nothing changed.

Gene363 Offline
#37 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:46 PM EST
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,817
victor809 wrote:
Gene... my irritation has nothing to do with my lack of belief in it working. Whether prayer worked or not (and let's be honest, if it did then missing family members would miraculously appear, both teams would win a football game, all our pen1ses would be 12 inches in girth etc etc etc) it is the lack of any interest in doing something to stop it from happening again.

Hell... people aren't even dedicated enough to pray that this is the last mass shooting ever. Notice its always "thoughts and prayers for the families of the dead" not "thoughts and prayers that this will never happen again"....They're impotently reacting rather than showing any interest in stopping another. It's very telling. And I must reiterate, I don't think there is any value to stopping the next one, but why pretend to care about this one when you have no interest in it not happening again?




"Gimmie" prayers don't work. Life is not all happy go lucky, sometimes there is pain, it's part of life and finally, prayers are answered, but not always in the way you want.

People do have empathy for others, psychopaths do not. Again, why do you care? It smacks of sympathy for others, sounds like you're a closet caring person. Not talking
MACS Offline
#38 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 10:58 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,779
Sounded more like psychopath...
victor809 Offline
#39 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 11:03 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Gene363 wrote:
"Gimmie" prayers don't work. Life is not all happy go lucky, sometimes there is pain, it's part of life and finally, prayers are answered, but not always in the way you want.

People do have empathy for others, psychopaths do not. Again, why do you care? It smacks of sympathy for others, sounds like you're a closet caring person. Not talking


Why do I care?
Because it's phenomenally embarrassing to be associated with a species which does this.... over and over and over again.

And are you really calling a prayer that this is the last mass killing a "gimme" prayer? Seriously? that seems pretty selfless to me... but no one does it. Hell, do a search of this forum... I'd bet you wouldn't find a single person praying that we've seen the last mass killing. Lots and lots of "prayers for those who were killed" or "prayers for their families"... nobody even actually cares enough to take a couple seconds to ask their personal deity to not have it happen again.

It smells of false sympathy to me.
Gene363 Offline
#40 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 11:22 PM EST
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,817
MACS wrote:
Sounded more like psychopath...


Possible, or overcompensation for a soft centered and really caring person. LOL
Gene363 Offline
#41 Posted: Mon, Nov 6 2017, 11:28 PM EST
Joined: 01-24-2003
Posts: 30,817
victor809 wrote:
Why do I care?
Because it's phenomenally embarrassing to be associated with a species which does this.... over and over and over again.

And are you really calling a prayer that this is the last mass killing a "gimme" prayer? Seriously? that seems pretty selfless to me... but no one does it. Hell, do a search of this forum... I'd bet you wouldn't find a single person praying that we've seen the last mass killing. Lots and lots of "prayers for those who were killed" or "prayers for their families"... nobody even actually cares enough to take a couple seconds to ask their personal deity to not have it happen again.

It smells of false sympathy to me.


Yup, as I said, life is not all fun and games. I cannot speak for others but I'd bet there are plenty of prayers made by posters here that will never appear on this forum. Some might even be for you.
DrafterX Offline
#42 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 8:29 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
teedubbya wrote:
Macs you seem to be less and less about personal responsibility.

Yes we did. Drafter posted it in here and folks followed suit. WE didn’t have to make it political. No one forced us to. We chose to.

Don’t blame the politicians for our actions.





I'm sorry... Sad




but I knew it would get political even if it shouldn't... Mellow
DrMaddVibe Offline
#43 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 8:32 AM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,431
DrafterX wrote:
I'm sorry... SadMellow



Meh.


You weren't the failed comedian or actor or politician that did that. Nobody even mentioned them yet by name.

Walk it off.


It was a tragedy created by a mentally ill person that got their hands on something that the Air Force failed to acknowledge. Oh how the lawsuits are gonna come down like rain.
TMCTLT Offline
#44 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 8:44 AM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
victor809 wrote:
So I'm gonna be honest... threads like this are irritating.

I'd read an opinion piece on cnn which sort of trended this direction, but it was really whiny and pro gun controlly and crap so I'm not gonna link it.

but there's a message which shouldn't be ignored.

We don't really care.

honestly, I don't think we should care. And I'm fine with us not caring.

but threads about "praying for the victims" or "thoughts and prayers" and all that crap is simply bullsh$t lip service.

This was an unfortunate incident which we don't really care about outside of being glad it didn't happen to anyone we know.

Perhaps some people care... those who are trying to actually change something to make sure it doesn't happen again. But I don't think they are spending their effort in a worthwhile manner. They may care, but through caring they're mostly doing things which will restrict the rights of people who didn't get killed.

But be honest. If all you're doing is typing "prayers go out" or even actually praying... you don't really care.

I'm sorry to be blunt, and I'm sure some here will call me an azzhole. But I'm just tired of this crap. It's happened a number of times before. It will happen a huge number of times in the future. You know this, I know this. To know this and do nothing is fine.... we have a lot of human lives, we can lose a whole bunch without any impact on the world. But to know this, pretend to be sad about it, but still not actually try to change any behavior, any laws or anything at all... that's just weak.



The quick answer to your Atheist problem assholio.....just leave. If praying for others is " undoing you " just leave.
Moreover..what the hell makes YOU think you know how or what people are praying for and rather or not they mean it? Just because they didn't quote a passage from the good book for YOU to read / piss on....doesn't mean they didn't say a silent yet meaningful prayer for others whom they don't even know. Your conceited so your reaction to this comes as no real surprise.

con·ceit·ed
/kənˈsēdəd/

adjective

1. excessively proud of oneself; vain. synonyms: vain, narcissistic, self-centered, egotistic, egotistical, ... more
Speyside Offline
#45 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 9:53 AM EST
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
Victor, most here DGAF what you think when it comes to prayer and positive thoughts. If it makes the individual praying feel better I find this good. If it gives the individual asking for prayers comfort I find this good. I expect that you DGAF also.
delta1 Offline
#46 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 2:37 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,788
I agree that most of you here DGAF about victor's opinion, and that is your prerogative.

but he makes a valid point...we as a nation have largely become complacent to mass murders, and have accepted them, however heinous and horrific, as part of our culture...just as it has become part of our culture to mouth the phrase "thoughts and prayers to the victims and their families"

At one point in my life, each of these incidents really bothered me...maybe because I feared that I would be confronted with such a tragedy in my working life. We spent countless hours doing workplace violence, hostage situations and active shooter training when I was working, so I was continuously thinking about those scenarios. My interactions with colleagues and students at work told me that they were frightened of the possibility that such incidents could happen, and thankful that they were taught some possible survival techniques.

Since my retirement and with fewer personal interactions with large numbers of people, the safety for whom I was responsible, I have become less affected by these incidents...just as I think most Americans have become numbed by them, for their own personal reasons. We've only talked about keeping homicides down, and want our police to catch the murderers, but we've never seriously considered homicide prevention, mostly because we've accepted that some Americans are going to commit murders and there's nothing we can do about it.
delta1 Offline
#47 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 2:37 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,788
apologies if I offended anyone...I didn't mean to say that we have become shallow...it is in our culture to also say "happy birthday" "cheers" "get well soon" "I love you" at appropriate times, and many people really mean it even if they say those things often...
Speyside Offline
#48 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 2:44 PM EST
Joined: 03-16-2015
Posts: 13,106
No offense taken, but I was only talking about his opinion on prayer. As I said in another post sometimes he makes me rethink my point of view on something, and that is a good thing. Also many times I agree with his opinion.
victor809 Offline
#49 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 3:09 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Spey... notice I said "thoughts and prayers". People who aren't religious do the same dumb thing... this pretending to care about the victims who they don't know... while also showing no interest in doing anything to ensure there arebt future victims they don't know.

We don't really care. The statements are no more than a "happy birthday".
DrafterX Offline
#50 Posted: Tue, Nov 7 2017, 3:10 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,551
Think
so, 'they prolly had it coming' would be more appropriate..?? Huh
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