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teedubbya Offline
#51 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 3:46 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Gene363 wrote:
"Distilled Water", the typical water you buy as distilled is not heat distilled and not sterile. They use reverse osmosis and or ion exchange resins to remove all the minerals from the water. It's fine for irons, but should not be considered sterile.



Rereading the clinical literature they don't seam to use the word distilled (RO or heat) but they do use the word sterile. No you got me thinking.....


great just great my hypochondria now has me with the brain bug
teedubbya Offline
#52 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 3:48 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
victor809 wrote:
RO may be energy efficient (I honestly don't know if it is or is not).... but they are a huge waste of fresh water. The amount of water waste used in flushing the RO membranes is huge. Maybe there's a lot of waste in distillation as well? I don't know.... I just remember being shocked at how much water was sent to drain (in California no less!) to create RO purified water.



I was looking at getting an RO system and if you ever look at the requirements you draw the same conclusion. There are ways to capture it for other use though (I think)
MACS Offline
#53 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 3:51 PM EST
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,809
I'm not sure home RO systems and the Navy's RO desalinization systems are the same.

They're turning seawater into safe drinking water.
victor809 Offline
#54 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 3:54 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
MACS wrote:
I'm not sure home RO systems and the Navy's RO desalinization systems are the same.

They're turning seawater into safe drinking water.


That's probably a much better application, as any waste water from the process is just flushed back into the ocean where it started.
I wasn't talking home-use. I worked with a couple water purification systems for pharma companies... those are using already "clean" drinking water and purifying them further down to sterile. That's a huge waste, as the waste water is actually clean drinking water, that's just being flushed down into the drain.
teedubbya Offline
#55 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 3:56 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
MACS wrote:
I'm not sure home RO systems and the Navy's RO desalinization systems are the same.

They're turning seawater into safe drinking water.



I was talking about RO, not desalinization. You are correct, they can not possibly be the same. Is it practical to make them larger scale for use in places like cali? I know it happens on some scale but think it may be on a very small scale?
teedubbya Offline
#56 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 3:57 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
victor809 wrote:
That's probably a much better application, as any waste water from the process is just flushed back into the ocean where it started.
I wasn't talking home-use. I worked with a couple water purification systems for pharma companies... those are using already "clean" drinking water and purifying them further down to sterile. That's a huge waste, as the waste water is actually clean drinking water, that's just being flushed down into the drain.



I'm surprised they do not repurpose it.
victor809 Offline
#57 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 4:06 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
teedubbya wrote:
I'm surprised they do not repurpose it.


It's a pharma company. Technically the water is "waste"... there's no way it could be used in any manufacturing since there's no certification on the composition... it would have to be put in some sort of holding vat if it were to be used for employee drinking water or flushing, and that would require all sorts of work to prove you're keeping that clean.

So they just flush it.

FYI, RO can be used for purifying tap water, or for desalinating salt water. I believe it is the same principle, and likely almost identical equipment. There may be small differences I'm not aware of, but probably only for efficiency and because of the low cost (free) of supply water for desalinization.
teedubbya Offline
#58 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 4:09 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
so while going all village people MACS likely added salt to water that had previously had the salt removed in order to clean out his orifices?
teedubbya Offline
#59 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 4:11 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
victor809 wrote:
It's a pharma company. Technically the water is "waste"... there's no way it could be used in any manufacturing since there's no certification on the composition... it would have to be put in some sort of holding vat if it were to be used for employee drinking water or flushing, and that would require all sorts of work to prove you're keeping that clean.

So they just flush it.

FYI, RO can be used for purifying tap water, or for desalinating salt water. I believe it is the same principle, and likely almost identical equipment. There may be small differences I'm not aware of, but probably only for efficiency and because of the low cost (free) of supply water for desalinization.



You would think they could have used it for fire suppression or something similar..... but I get the certification obstetrical.
victor809 Offline
#60 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 4:14 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
teedubbya wrote:
You would think they could have used it for fire suppression or something similar..... but I get the certification obstetrical.


hehehe....

They prob could have it feed the fire suppression, but I bet that water barely ever moves. Usage there would be just a fraction of the waste water and they would need to set a valve to make sure it's "off" when the system is full.... and the waste water doesn't come out at a strong flow 100% of the time, so they would likely have to have it default to city mains for emergencies....

I get why they don't bother. But I was pretty amazed at the waste.
izonfire Offline
#61 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 4:24 PM EST
Joined: 12-09-2013
Posts: 8,647
You guys should snort some ammonia floor cleaner and be done with it...
delta1 Offline
#62 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 5:08 PM EST
Joined: 11-23-2011
Posts: 28,807
now I don't feel so bad for using tap water with my saline rinse...
teedubbya Offline
#63 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 7:33 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I just repurpose my coffee enemas.
Whistlebritches Offline
#64 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 7:57 PM EST
Joined: 04-23-2006
Posts: 22,128
victor809 wrote:
If they use RO it's sterile. Pore size on an RO filter is smaller than the diameter of viral particles. Standard RO purification is used for injectable products from pharma.
Ion exchange is much different than RO and should not be lumped in together. Perhaps you are confusing purified water with deionized water? DI water is different than purified and you generally use DI water for chemical experiments. DI water is achieved after passing water across ion exchange resins and does not actually say anything about the purification.

Bottom line - RO is generally considered more sterile than heat distilled. DI is not RO, but water can be both purified and then deionized if necessary.



RO is only as sterile as it's delivery system.Secondly RO is ridiculously wasteful...….I run two water plants and we have fought off RO for several years showing them how much waste is involved.Third good surface water treated properly and delivered with chloramines intact may not be considered sterile but there are no brain eating bugs that can survive in it.

Lastly if you need sterile water buy sterile water but please remember this water was not meant to be ingested,it's primarily used as an irrigant.There is no antimicrobial preservatives in sterile water so the possibility of bacterial growth and pyrogen formation is quite high once opened,all unused contents of the opened container should be discarded.There are some single use containers out there if you look...….I have a couple lab test I perform with sterile water,mine come in 100 ml popper viles at approximately .19 each if you order by the thousand.
USNGunner Offline
#65 Posted: Wed, Jan 29 2020, 9:47 PM EST
Joined: 05-17-2019
Posts: 4,402
teedubbya wrote:
I just repurpose my coffee enemas.


We just call that expresso.
Brewha Offline
#66 Posted: Thu, Jan 30 2020, 8:39 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
Abrignac wrote:
Been dealing with sinus congestion and headaches for about 4 days. In the midst of a bad headache I took off to Walgreens to get one of those plastic bottles that come with the salt packets so I could flush my sinuses. Used to have one but, I can’t find it.

So I squirted about 1/3 of a cup up each side. I’ve used them before so I knew I’d have vertigo for a few minutes afterwards. I felt like I was in the matrix. Seems I was rotating on a least 4 axis at the same time. I grabbed the countertop and hung on for what felt like an eternity when in reality it was a minute or so. But, my headache is gone so it was worth the magic carpet ride.

+1

It works for me.

And my nose is so big people ask if they can stand under it when it rains....
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