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Supreme Court clears ban on gay conversion therapy
rfenst Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,349
AP | By LISA LEFF

Published June 30, 2014 05:33PM EDT


SAN FRANCISCO (AP) — The U.S. Supreme Court cleared the way Monday for enforcement of a first-of-its-kind California law that bars psychological counseling aimed at turning gay minors straight.


The justices turned aside a legal challenge brought by supporters of so-called conversion or reparative therapy. Without comment, they let stand an August 2013 appeals court ruling that said the ban covered professional activities that are within the state's authority to regulate and doesn't violate the free speech rights of licensed counselors and patients seeking treatment.


The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals ruled last year that California lawmakers properly showed that therapies designed to change sexual orientation for those under the age of 18 were outside the scientific mainstream and have been disavowed by most major medical groups as unproven and potentially dangerous.


"The Supreme Court has cement shut any possible opening to allow further psychological child abuse in California," state Sen. Ted Lieu, the law's sponsor, said Monday. "The Court's refusal to accept the appeal of extreme ideological therapists who practice the quackery of gay conversion therapy is a victory for child welfare, science and basic humane principles."


The law says professional therapists and counselors who use treatments designed to eliminate or reduce same-sex attractions in their patients would be engaging in unprofessional conduct and subject to discipline by state licensing boards. It does not cover the actions of pastors and lay counselors who are unlicensed but provide such therapy through church programs.


Liberty Counsel, a Christian legal aid group, had challenged the law, as did other supporters of the therapy. They argue that lawmakers have no scientific proof the therapy does harm.


"I am deeply saddened for the families we represent and for the thousands of children that our professional clients counsel," Liberty Counsel Chairman Mat Staver said in a statement. "The minors we represent do not want to act on same-sex attractions, nor do they want to engage in such behavior."


New Jersey last year became the second U.S. state to ban gay conversion therapy with children and teenagers, and Liberty Counsel also has been fighting that law, which took effect after it was signed by Gov. Chris Christie. The group's litigation counsel, Daniel Schmid, said Monday that the Supreme Court's refusal to consider a challenge to California's law, as opposed to issuing a ruling on the merits, has no bearing on Liberty Counsel's case in New Jersey, which is scheduled to be heard by the 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals on July 9.


"We hope to get a good ruling out of the 3rd, which will hopefully get us back up to the Supremes," he said.


California's law was supposed to take effect last year, but it has been on hold while a pair of lawsuits seeking to overturn it made their way to the Supreme Court.


Now that the high court has declined to take the case, the state will be able to start enforcing the law after the 9th Circuit lifts an injunction it put into place during the litigation, an action that is expected to come within days, according to Christopher Stoll, a senior staff attorney at the National Center for Lesbian Rights.


Another eight states and the District of Columbia have pending legislation modeled after the California and New Jersey laws, while lawmakers in five other states have refused to pass similar bans. Meanwhile, the Texas Republican Party this month endorsed reparative therapy, adopting policy language recognizing "the legitimacy and efficacy of counseling, which offers reparative therapy and treatment for those patients seeking healing and wholeness from their homosexual lifestyle."
ZRX1200 Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
If it helps WILLING participants what is the harm?
rfenst Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,349
ZRX1200 wrote:
If it helps WILLING participants what is the harm?


It's only pertains to minors.
ZRX1200 Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Ah.... more banning parental wishes. Got it.
TMCTLT Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
rfenst wrote:
It's only pertains to minors.



Perhaps because it's TOO difficult to teach Ole Dogs....new tricks.
rfenst Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 06-23-2007
Posts: 39,349
TMCTLT wrote:
Perhaps because it's TOO difficult to teach Ole Dogs....new tricks.


Perhaps it is because minors cannot give consent?
ZRX1200 Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Like I said......
victor809 Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Seems like it's similar to being able to charge Christian Scientist parents with neglect when they are withholding medical care from their minor children due to their personal religious beliefs.

Parental wishes don't extend to the point where they are deemed to be harmful to the child.
ZRX1200 Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Because the state owns them.
teedubbya Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
We used yo be able to own people.
victor809 Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
ZRX1200 wrote:
Because the state owns them.



Hey, I don't particularly care about children. If parents want to kill them off, that's totally acceptable to me. They aren't people until they're 18.

But lets be consistent. If we, as a country, keep yelling about "for the children!", and if we specifically legislate against parents beating their kids, locking them in basements, selling them as sex slaves etc etc etc... AND if we specifically have precedent where parents religious beliefs do not extend to the harm of their children... then this fits with the precedent.

If we can sell kids off as sex slaves, or sacrifice them to the god Xenu, then sure this law makes no sense.
teedubbya Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
But if the have caught the gay shouldn't we be able to provide the cure?
teedubbya Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Isn't it abuse not to try to cure them from this hideous disease? If they caught Ebola or Islam wouldn't we be resulted go try to heal them?
victor809 Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
I want to go back to the good old days of owning islamic gay sex slaves with ebola.
ZRX1200 Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Vic you're really swell.

Yes beating, murder, locking in a basement and sex trafficking are SURELY common tennants of most religious beliefs.

Try again spanky it's been a rough day for you. Maybe you should get to sleep before 3.
teedubbya Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
If my kid catches the gay can I beat it out of them? How about starve if out of them. What if we call it a fast? What about light therapy with Debbie Boone songs?
victor809 Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
ZRX1200 wrote:
Vic you're really swell.

Yes beating, murder, locking in a basement and sex trafficking are SURELY common tennants of most religious beliefs.

Try again spanky it's been a rough day for you. Maybe you should get to sleep before 3.


Read carefully Z. Two separate concepts. 1 was abuse, another was religion justifying actions.

ZRX1200 Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Teedubya the Mooselems do a 30 day fast and the left is afraid of challenging minority groups so yeah you'd be ok there. Just convert.
victor809 Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
ZRX1200 wrote:
Teedubya the Mooselems do a 30 day fast and the left is afraid of challenging minority groups so yeah you'd be ok there. Just convert.


Yeah... and how is ramadan in any way potentially harmful?

RollEyes
ZRX1200 Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
It doesn't matter they're not Christians..... TW was talking about fasting . They're flying I said boy, they're flying right over your head today.

You shouldn't work so much your sleep schedule is really messing you up.
victor809 Offline
#21 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
ZRX1200 wrote:
It doesn't matter they're not Christians..... TW was talking about fasting . They're flying I said boy, they're flying right over your head today.

You shouldn't work so much your sleep schedule is really messing you up.


TW was talking randomly about fasting as a cover for starving one's kids.

You were referring directly to the muslim practice of ramadan (or fasting for 30 days).

Ramadan is not particularly harmful (unless the kid has diabetes or something like that), and is not really comparable to starving one's kids, unless you're only starving them for a few hours.

You're not on point here today Z... you keep trying to draw connections that aren't there.
ZRX1200 Offline
#22 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Maybe I should talk slower and draw a picture.

It was a reference to the left not persecuting minority religions in the US such as Mooselems The way that they target criticism twords Christians. You've got to be kidding that you did not pick up on the sarcasm in that. They also have something called of honor killings which pretty well directly affects the well being of a child.
Thunder.Gerbil Offline
#23 Posted:
Joined: 11-02-2006
Posts: 121,359
teedubbya wrote:
If my kid catches the gay can I beat it out of them? How about starve if out of them. What if we call it a fast? What about light therapy with Debbie Boone songs?


Send the kid to bloody's dad for a week, he'll beat it out of him.
ZRX1200 Offline
#24 Posted:
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,628
Talking to you today is kind of like having that last little brown baby hanging on tight and not wanting to fall into the toilet. I'm tired of shaking my ass at you and I am ready to wipe.
teedubbya Offline
#25 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Poor brown babies. Maybe bloods dad can beat them out of you too.
victor809 Offline
#26 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
ZRX1200 wrote:
Maybe I should talk slower and draw a picture.

It was a reference to the left not persecuting minority religions in the US such as Mooselems The way that they target criticism twords Christians. You've got to be kidding that you did not pick up on the sarcasm in that. They also have something called of honor killings which pretty well directly affects the well being of a child.


Except you chose an example that no one would be persecuted for. Why would the left persecute the muslims for ramadan? That's like persecuting jews for having hanukkah. Now, if you'd led with "honor killings" your point may have made sense. I suspect you didn't because you realized it'd be an irrational argument and no one would allow honor killings in the us.
victor809 Offline
#27 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
ZRX1200 wrote:
. I'm tired of shaking my ass at you and I am ready to wipe.



.... why exactly are you shaking your ass at someone again?
teedubbya Offline
#28 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Maybe if Islam incorporated the morning after pill and iud as honor killing techniques it could be argued hobby lobby is anti Islam.
victor809 Offline
#29 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
teedubbya wrote:
Maybe if Islam incorporated the morning after pill and iud as honor killing techniques it could be argued hobby lobby is anti Islam.



Oooh... maybe if hobby lobby paid for insurance that covered pre-natal anti-gay conversion therapy they could get the supreme court to listen to it?
teedubbya Offline
#30 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I'd hate to work for an Islamic based corporation and expect my insurance to pay for Trichinosis treatment.
teedubbya Offline
#31 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Or pig valve reacements.
victor809 Offline
#32 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
teedubbya wrote:
Or pig valve reacements.


Apropos of nothing TW, you may appreciate this.

I'm with a group of friends at a bar, and some strange, possibly drunk black woman starts talking to us randomly.. I guess she's a "pastor" of some reformed jewish church, or something like that.

Anyway, as we normally do, we started joking around with her about sticking your d@ck in a woman's butt... because my friends and I are juvenile.

The woman's response? "I tell my sons, if you're gonna d@ck a woman in the @ss, please use a condom. We don't need any prostrate cancer in the women. But if you want to play with your own titties, that's all right."

This is why can't let religious groups have an opinion on medicine.
teedubbya Offline
#33 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
She is right though.
sd72 Offline
#34 Posted:
Joined: 03-09-2011
Posts: 9,600
A black woman pastor of a jewish church. There may be a few miscues in that sentence.
teedubbya Offline
#35 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Rod Carew is Jewish.
teedubbya Offline
#36 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
And Sami Davis jr only had one eye.
sd72 Offline
#37 Posted:
Joined: 03-09-2011
Posts: 9,600
I heard he wore the patch to look cool
teedubbya Offline
#38 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
No that's drafter.
sd72 Offline
#39 Posted:
Joined: 03-09-2011
Posts: 9,600
So drafter wears a patch, and has been probed by aliens. What are the odds.
teedubbya Offline
#40 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
Pretty much 100%. Aliens are attracted to eye patches and terry velour short shorts.
sd72 Offline
#41 Posted:
Joined: 03-09-2011
Posts: 9,600
Oh, google says the odds are 98.2 to 1.
teedubbya Offline
#42 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I heard drafter showed them his boobs.
sd72 Offline
#43 Posted:
Joined: 03-09-2011
Posts: 9,600
The big ones on top, or the underboob bulge, that resembles a second pair ?
teedubbya Offline
#44 Posted:
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I think both but I'm not sure. They weren't even the type of aliens that probe but he insisted. He had to show them how.
sd72 Offline
#45 Posted:
Joined: 03-09-2011
Posts: 9,600
I told him the video would come in handy one day.
victor809 Offline
#46 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
teedubbya wrote:
She is right though.


Prostate cancer is rampant among women who take it in the @ss....
sd72 Offline
#47 Posted:
Joined: 03-09-2011
Posts: 9,600
Yup. If a black woman jewish pastor of a church says so.
MACS Offline
#48 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,817
teedubbya wrote:
But if the have caught the gay shouldn't we be able to provide the cure?


I think we should inoculate children at birth so they don't catch it. It's the right thing to do, ya know...
MACS Offline
#49 Posted:
Joined: 02-26-2004
Posts: 79,817
ZRX1200 wrote:
Teedubya the Mooselems do a 30 day fast and the left is afraid of challenging minority groups so yeah you'd be ok there. Just convert.


Technically, the 30 day 'fast' is only during daylight hours, so it isn't really a fast, per se. They just can't eat during daylight hours.They have meals before sunrise and after sunset.
victor809 Offline
#50 Posted:
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
The anti-gay vaccine causes autism tho....



**cbid trifecta win**

Thank you very much.
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