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Last post 19 years ago by Robby. 19 replies replies.
FOR THE FLIP-FLOP LOVERS THAT ABOUND HERE
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
'Steadfast' Bush's amazing flip-flops

BUSH-CHENEY team likes to say president is "steadfast." And John Kerry is "flip-flopper." But
Senator Kerry is bolted to floor compared to Bush. President Bush is no more steadfast than Tony
Soprano is faithful.

Never burdened by reality, Bush says departing CIA chief George Tenet did "superb job." That assumes Tenet's job was to fail miserably to anticipate 9/11 and to goad Bush into going to war under false pretenses. Bush doublespeak is matched only by his amazing flip-flops, which are underreported. Armchair Strategist aims to fix this, with help from Center for American Progress, liberal (There, I said it!) think tank.

Bush can't get enough of Chalabi. Chalabi cons Bush's neocons into toppling Saddam; sits behind Laura Bush at State of Union speech; always looks marvelous in custom-made $1,000 suits. US paid him $335,000 a month for "intelligence."

US troops raid Chalabi's house. US soldiers raided Chalabi's home and seized documents and computers. (Hope they didn't wrinkle his suits.) While on US payroll, told Iran that US had cracked code for Iran's secret communications. Time magazine says, "The US's abandonment of Chalabi may prove to be the most head-snapping reversal of all."

Bush called Osama number one priority. "There's an old poster out West that says, `Wanted: Dead or Alive.' . . . The most important thing is to find Osama bin Laden. It's our Number One priority. We will not rest until we have found him." (Sept. 13 and 16, 2001.)

Now Bush doesn't care about him. "I don't know where he is. I have no idea and I really don't care.
It's not that important." (March 13, 2002.)

Cheney: We will be greeted as liberators. On "Face the Nation" Cheney predicts war in Iraq will
"go relatively quickly." On "Meet the Press," says "things have gotten so bad inside Iraq, from the
standpoint of the Iraqi people, my belief is we will, in fact, be greeted as liberators." (March 16,
2003.)

Bush: That's Cheney's story, and I'm sticking with it.

On Feb. 7, 2004, Tim Russert asks: "It's now nearly a year, and we are in a very difficult situation. Did we miscalculate how we would be treated and received in Iraq?"

Bush: "Well, I think we are welcomed in Iraq." (Pentagon reports 820 US troops killed in Iraq and
4,682 injured, June 3, 2004.)

Bush opposes Department of Homeland Security. Former press secretary Ari Fleischer says Bush told Congress, "There does not need to be a Cabinet-level Office of Homeland Security."
(White House press briefing, Oct. 24, 2001.)

Bush supports Department of Homeland Security. "So tonight, I ask the Congress to join me in creating a single, permanent department with an overriding and urgent mission: securing the homeland of America." (June 6, 2002.)
'
Page 2 of 2 -- Bush: Al Qaeda and Saddam same. "You can't distinguish between Al Qaeda and Saddam when you talk about the war on terror." (Sept. 25, 2002.)

Bush: Saddam had no role in 9/11. "We've had no evidence that Saddam Hussein was involved in
Sept. 11." (Sept. 17, 2003.)

Bush acrobatics on 9/11 commission. Bush was against creating commission, then for it. Against National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice testifying, then for it. Against testifying himself, then for it. Said he'd testify only for one hour. Then said no time limit but had to have Cheney along -- to keep their stories straight.

Bush says president should talk OPEC into lower prices. "The president ought to get on the phone with the OPEC cartel and say we expect you to open your spigots . . . The president of the United States must jawbone OPEC members to lower the price." (Jan. 26, 2000.)

But not this president. With gas prices soaring, President Bush refuses to "personally lobby oil
cartel leaders to change their minds." (Miami Herald, April 1, 2004.)

Bush then: gay marriage is state issue. "The states can do what they want to do. Don't try to trap me in this state's issue like you're trying to get me into." ("Larry King Live," Feb. 15, 2000.)

Bush now: for constitutional amendment banning gay marriage. "Today I call upon the Congress to promptly pass, and to send to the states for ratification, an amendment to our Constitution defining and protecting marriage as a union of man and woman as husband and wife." (Feb. 24, 2004.)

Flip-flops, ad nauseam. Against nation-building, then for it. Found WMD, then lost them. Against McCain-Feingold campaign finance reform, then signed it into law. Tariffs? Not gonna have 'em; puts 'em on steel, then lifts 'em. Mocks Al Gore's idea for hybrid fuel car; calls for $1.3 billion to develop one. For extending ban on assault weapons in 2001; now against it.

Fashion idea for DNC conventioneers: Bush flip-flop shoes. If it flips, wear it.

Dan Payne is a Boston-based media consultant who worked on John Kerry's Senate campaigns
eleltea Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 03-03-2002
Posts: 4,562
Kerry is less Kennedy than Bush is less Reagan. Class dismissed.
DrMaddVibe Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,618
School's Out - Alice Cooper
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
sounds right to me, or it would if i could understand what you mean.

i guess it means kerry gets less then kennedy did and bush's blankness is not as fully developed as regean's alzheimers was.
eleltea Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 03-03-2002
Posts: 4,562
We used to call flip-flops Japanese motorcycle boots.
xibbumbero Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 01-25-2002
Posts: 12,535
Then the name was changed to thongs...then something happened and thongs went some kind of transformation. X
Robby Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 10-30-2002
Posts: 5,067
No source?
BeatDragon Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 02-28-2003
Posts: 4,754
I prefer my Tevas to flip flops
tailgater Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
You can't even begin to compare Bush's inconsistencies with Kerry's flip flops.
It's not even close.
Yes, I read your informative post. It's thought provoking but does nothing to prove your point.

For crying out loud, John Kerry even flip floppped on what NATIONALITY he is!!
Every St Patricks day in Boston, Kerry would belly up to a local bar with local Irish politicos, TV cameras not far behind.
Every year we'd hear him toast his "Fellow Irishmen".
Every year this seemingly benign act would win favor with the local drunks, er Irish Americans in South Boston.
And now we find out that EVERY YEAR, Kerry was Lying through his teeth.
He's not Irish.
Not now, not ever.

No big deal? Not the little white lie unto itself. Let's face it, who really cares what nationality he is?
But if he's willing to lie about something like this, he could likely teach Bill Clinton a thing or two about non-truths.

And that's not easy to do.

nfldraftman Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 01-28-2004
Posts: 642
I don't see what is wrong with flip-flopping your nationality. Every St. Patrick' Day I'm Irish. Every Oktoberfest, I'm German. Big deal.
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
Robby

if i tell you the source was laura, his wife, or i mention a comlunist, or i mention a newspaper, or i mention a radio program, or i mention o'reilly, will that matter to you.

you will simply ridicule the source, because you don't want to believe it.
uncleb Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 11-13-2002
Posts: 1,326
Tailgater,

I will preface by saying tht I think both Bush and Kerry flip flop to suit their needs. I am curious though why you say with Bush they are "inconsistencies" and with Kerry they are "flip flops"?
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
uncleb

excellent question?
dbguru Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
All politicians change their positions on things in response to changing circumstances and public opinion. Sometimes new information demand changes in position like what happened to Chalabi. If politicians didn't shift or modify positions to flexibly and intelligently adapt to shifting circumstances, you might consider them to be stupidly stubborn.

Once you stand back and gain some perspective what you see are Republicans being excessively outspoken in their labeling and exaggerating a common politician's attribute to Kerry in a cleverly comprehensive and derogatory campaign. But of course Bush flip flops too, if that's what you want to call it. Sometimes I just gotta laugh at the comments about Kerry Flip flops, Kerry looks French, Kerry uses Botox, since they accustions without a lot of substance (But ones the GOP is spening millions on). On the other side you have the Bush can't read, Bush needs Cheney to think for him, Bush the Chicken-Hawk. Did you hear the one on Jay Leno last night.... went something like this

Bush 41 is parachuting into his presidential library for his 80th birthday this weekend and W is very nervous about attending this event... Of course W always gets nervous around libraries.

Below these superficialities and labels there is some realities. I think Rick's post kind helps to keep that in perspective... Thanks

DB

dbguru Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 03-06-2002
Posts: 1,300
For those questioning the source... Rick clearly posted the author who is clearly partisan...Personally I've seen these juxtapositions on a number of left leaning websites.

From Ricks post:
"Dan Payne is a Boston-based media consultant who worked on John Kerry's Senate campaigns"

Thanks for posting the source, Rick
Robby Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 10-30-2002
Posts: 5,067
"you will simply ridicule the source, because you don't want to believe it. "

Rick, I've never seen you take any offense whatsoever when this tactic is practiced by the left? Why is that? Aren't you open-minded? Fair? Balanced? LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (rhetorical question) I've seen many libbys ask for sources only to cast aspersions on their authenticity... Without a word of chastisement? Why could this be?
Robby Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 10-30-2002
Posts: 5,067
Sorry Libby, My browser says, We can't find "www.DanPayne.com"

This is not a source, mearely a contributor. Usual spin... Yawn
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
Robby

are you refering to the vast left wing conspiracy that permeates this forum like the insidious liberall left wing media.

the overwhelming number of the botl that are liberal, or maybe even socialist pinkos that won't fly old glory to show their patriotism.

you know, the kind of guys that should go live in communist ethiopia or russia if they don't like this country. go live somewhere where if there are elections, they are fixed. they make me puke.

i'll bet there are at least three of us, and i'm not even a liberal.

i am a RACHMONES CONSERVATIVE.
tailgater Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
All politicians "change their mind".
All people in general do that.
On occassion.

My use of terminology was purposeful. I have, after all, learned from the best when it comes to making a point while trying to appear impartial: The Boston Globe and other like-minded (left-minded) papers have been doing it for YEARS.

Either way, my point was ignored so you could ask an inconsequential question regarding my choice of verbage. The fact of the matter is that despite knowing that all people, and therefore all politicians are entitled to change their minds, John Kerry has done so in far greater proportions than any other person or politician that I've ever known.

That is where an "inconsistency" becomes a "flip flop".

People dislike GWB because he embodies a set of goals that they may personally disagree with.
People dislike Kerry because he tries to be everything for everybody.

Based on that fairly undeniable observation, which candidate is more true to their core values?
And which one has reinvented the term "Flip Flop"?

Robby Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 10-30-2002
Posts: 5,067
gater, very well said.
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