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Last post 19 years ago by bloody spaniard. 19 replies replies.
Nearly Half of Bush "Pioneers" Get Fed Jobs
Cavallo Offline
#1 Posted:
Joined: 01-05-2004
Posts: 2,796
when the rules aren't convenient, tap dance around them -- then give them jobs and appoint them as ambassadors. enron's ken lay is the LAST person who should be telling bush who to appoint on energy councils, for cryin' out loud.

i was pretty surprised to find out how few people really contributed, although not surprised to see how many were big businessmen.

one thing that disappoints me more and more about the republican party is how they were supposed to be the champion of small-mid businesses; seems like they've finally deserted the folks (middle class) who really built and supported the GOP.

The Bush campaign has raised $296.3 million since 1998, giving it the advantage in both the 2000 and 2004 elections. One-third to one-half of this $296.3 million was donated to the Bush campaign by only 631 people.

This is the end result of Bush's "Pioneers" campaign fund. The maximum individual donation to a presidential candidate by law is $1000; however, the Pioneers have been able to work around this regulation by creating a network of people, mostly businessmen, who are each able to persuade 100 friends or more to donate the $1000 maximum to their cause. Donors who have raised at least $100,000 are dubbed "Pioneers". Those who have raised at least $200,000 are called "Rangers".

Of the 246 Pioneers and Rangers in the 2000 campaign, 104 of them have received a job or appointment during Bush's reign in the White House. Twenty-three of them have been made ambassadors.

2000 election Pioneer Kenneth Lay, former Enron chairman, sent the White House a list of eight persons he recommended for appointment to the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission upon Bush's election. Two of the persons he recommended were appointed to the five-person commission.

The Pioneers group is now twice as large as it was in the 2000 election.

(Source: Cohen, Sarah, Thomas B. Edsall and James V. Grimaldi. "Pioneers Fill War Chest, Then Capitalize." Washington Post, 16 May 2004)
usahog Offline
#2 Posted:
Joined: 12-06-1999
Posts: 22,691
Cav,

ask the Washington Post how much or who I am cuz, I donated 20 bucks once!!!

Oh and was this all legal through the Federal Elections Commision?

Hog
Cavallo Offline
#3 Posted:
Joined: 01-05-2004
Posts: 2,796
hog -- sorry, my friend. neither one of us are wealthy enough to afford to buy a job like that. lol

as for the legalities, it's legal but not the most ethical thing. likewise, there's the issue of bush encouraging churches to preach sermons saying to vote for him. churches, in govt terms, are considered to be tax-exempt charitible organizations, and this sort of thing violates the charter blatently:

the IRS reminded both Republican and Democratic national committees in a recent letter that tax-exempt charitable groups "are prohibited from directly or indirectly participating or intervening in any political campaign on behalf of, or in opposition to, any candidate for public office."

in that case, it's neither ethical NOR legal. but we seem to let a lot slide.
usahog Offline
#4 Posted:
Joined: 12-06-1999
Posts: 22,691
likewise, there's the issue of bush encouraging churches to preach sermons saying to vote for him. churches, in govt terms, are considered to be tax-exempt charitible organizations, and this sort of thing violates the charter blatently:

um... has this one been run through snoops.com yet??

is this based on facts? what are the sources for the facts behind this one Cav???

I watch many church programs on TV.. (pay extra for the service) and have not once seen anything of this nature.. one would think this would be global as in nationwide networking??? I have not heard GWB's name mentioned at my local church either... I also go to allot of online sites... Grant Jefferies, http://www.grantjeffrey.com/
http://www.gospelcom.net/
http://www.jvim.com/
I can name more but these have been the recent surfs I've done...

so please tell me which and what churches are pressured by the GWB campain offices???

Hog
Cavallo Offline
#5 Posted:
Joined: 01-05-2004
Posts: 2,796
hog, will you be devoting this much scrutiny to those posts sourced by "the drudge report"? or do are you willing to just trust any ol' source, so long as it's bush-supportive?

this isn't a jab at you -- i'm serious. friendly, but serious.
bloody spaniard Offline
#6 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
Cavallo, again your eloquence is only superceded by your logic.

Despite his never-ending lies, the piece of garbage in office HAS abandoned the small/mid-level business community. Despite that, the corporate community has "miraculously" flourished. To think, that I contributed to his (and his father's) campaign. I could vomit.

I am sending my autographed photo w/thank you from dubya to Rickamaven so that he can defecate on it and then post it.

Abdicate your throne, you rich phoney, before you're humiliated by Kerry/Edwards!

blood
Cavallo Offline
#7 Posted:
Joined: 01-05-2004
Posts: 2,796
and about the churchgoers... why the skepticism? bush's campaign spokesman isn't denying this at all! heck, back when i attended centerville christian church in the 80's, the pastor there told us we'd all go to hell if we didn't vote for reagan. lol but that's different from an organized campaign like is being run here, and it does appear to violate the law.

as far as i know, though, no one's sueing over it. :)

here's the article i read. terry holt is the spokesperson from the bush-cheney campaign.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A19082-2004Jun30.html

The Bush-Cheney reelection campaign has sent a detailed plan of action to religious volunteers across the country asking them to turn over church directories to the campaign, distribute issue guides in their churches and persuade their pastors to hold voter registration drives.

Campaign officials said the instructions are part of an accelerating effort to mobilize President Bush's base of religious supporters. They said the suggested activities are intended to help churchgoers rally support for Bush without violating tax rules that prohibit churches from engaging in partisan activity.

"We strongly believe that our religious outreach program is well within the framework of the law," said Terry Holt, spokesman for the Bush-Cheney campaign.

But tax experts said the campaign is walking a fine line between permissible activity by individual congregants and impermissible activity by congregations. Supporters of Sen. John F. Kerry (Mass.), the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee, charged that the Bush-Cheney campaign is luring churches into risking their tax status.

"I think it is sinful of them to encourage pastors and churches to engage in partisan political activity and run the risk of losing their tax-exempt status," said Steve Rosenthal, chief executive officer of America Coming Together, a group working to defeat Bush.

The instruction sheet circulated by the Bush-Cheney campaign to religious volunteers lists 22 "duties" to be performed by specific dates. By July 31, for example, volunteers are to "send your Church Directory to your State Bush-Cheney '04 Headquarters or give [it] to a BC04 Field Rep" and "Talk to your Pastor about holding a Citizenship Sunday and Voter Registration Drive."

By Aug. 15, they are to "talk to your Church's seniors or 20-30 something group about Bush/Cheney '04" and "recruit 5 more people in your church to volunteer for the Bush Cheney campaign."

By Sept. 17, they are to host at least two campaign-related potluck dinners with church members, and in October they are to "finish calling all Pro-Bush members of your church," "finish distributing Voter Guides in your church" and place notices on church bulletin boards or in Sunday programs "about all Christian citizens needing to vote."

The document was provided to The Washington Post by a Democrat. A spokesman for the Internal Revenue Service, Frank Keith, said, "It would be inappropriate for the IRS, based on a limited set of facts and circumstances, to render a judgment about whether the activities in this document would or would not endanger a church's tax-exempt status."

He pointed out, however, that the IRS on June 10 sent a strongly worded letter to both the Republican and Democratic national committees, reminding them that tax-exempt charitable groups "are prohibited from directly or indirectly participating or intervening in any political campaign on behalf of, or in opposition to, any candidate for public office."

That warning came one week after The Post and other news media reported on a Bush-Cheney campaign e-mail that sought to identify 1,600 "friendly congregations" in Pennsylvania where Bush supporters "might gather on a regular basis."

The IRS letter noted that religious organizations are allowed to sponsor debates, distribute voter guides and conduct voter registration drives. But if those efforts show "a preference for or against a certain candidate or party . . . it becomes a prohibited activity," the letter said.

Milton Cerny, a tax specialist in the Washington office of the law firm Caplin & Drysdale who formerly administered tax-exempt groups for the IRS, said there is nothing in the campaign instructions "that on its face clearly would violate" the law.

"But these activities, if conducted in concert with the church or church leadership, certainly could be construed by the IRS as the church engaging in partisan electioneering," he said. "The devil is in the details."

Rosemary E. Fei, a tax specialist at the San Francisco law firm of Silk, Adler & Colvin, said the campaign checklist "feels dangerous to me" not just because of what is in it, but because of what is not. "There's no mention whatsoever that churches should be careful to remain nonpartisan," she said.

Holt suggested such warnings are unnecessary. "Why would we warn one citizen about the boundaries of their political discussion with another citizen?" he said.
dccrens Offline
#8 Posted:
Joined: 04-04-2004
Posts: 721
Bloody, and Cavallo,

You might want to actually check the latest FAR (Federal Aquisition Rules)and DFAR regulations on government contracting. As a "federal contractor" I have to be up on them and the Bush administration has done more for small business (at least in the federal government and DoD arenas) than any other. In fact, there are more "set aside" contracts for SB, WOSB, VOSB, Hub Zone, and other SDB types that at any time in the past. Set asides are those contracts that only SDBs/SB's can compete for and win. For most of the DoD and Agencies I work with, at least 20% of the total contracting dollars are set asides. Also on all of the large bids, almost all of them have a 24% SB requirement where the Large Prime contractor must have SBs on their team and give the SBs 24% or more of the work. THis has in fact led to a problem where some SB are wining work that they don't have the skills and people to do. Largely because of this they also have established "Mentor Protege" programs where Large businesses must "Mentor" SBs. In fact my company has at least 10 SB proteges. We not only teach them HOW to compete for and execute federal work but we also team with them and actively get them work. The climate is so pro small business in the federal arena that many folks, especial verterans, are leaving Large business and starting their own SB. Not saying I agree with all of Bush's actions and policies but this is one area where (at least for the SB's doing government, Fed/DoD work) the facts speak pretty clearly.

Cheers
calavera Offline
#9 Posted:
Joined: 01-26-2002
Posts: 1,868
Bush/Cheney in '04


J


When you got nothing else, show your purple hearts.
Homebrew Offline
#10 Posted:
Joined: 02-11-2003
Posts: 11,885
Calavera Wrote
"When you got nothing else, show your purple hearts."
At least Kerry was in a place, where he could get them. Instead of running a campaign, for his fathers friend, and not showing up for drill. A weekend a month, was too much service for GWB.
Later
Dave (A.K.A. Homebrew)
Cavallo Offline
#11 Posted:
Joined: 01-05-2004
Posts: 2,796
dc: you'll have to address bloody about that. he would be the expert on govt. contracts for small businesses (seeing that he owns one and all). i defer to his comments on the subject.
bloody spaniard Offline
#12 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
DCCRENS wrote:You might want to actually check the latest FAR (Federal Aquisition Rules)and DFAR regulations on government contracting. As a "federal contractor" I have to be up on them and the Bush administration has done more for small business (at least in the federal government and DoD arenas) than any other. In fact, there are more "set aside" contracts for SB, WOSB, VOSB, Hub Zone, and other SDB types that at any time in the past. Set asides are those contracts that only SDBs/SB's can compete for and win. For most of the DoD and Agencies I work with, at least 20% of the total contracting dollars are set asides. Also on all of the large bids, almost all of them have a 24% SB requirement where the Large Prime contractor must have SBs on their team and give the SBs 24% or more of the work. THis has in fact led to a problem where some SB are wining work that they don't have the skills and people to do. Largely because of this they also have established "Mentor Protege" programs where Large businesses must "Mentor" SBs. In fact my company has at least 10 SB proteges. We not only teach them HOW to compete for and execute federal work but we also team with them and actively get them work. The climate is so pro small business in the federal arena that many folks, especial verterans, are leaving Large business and starting their own SB. Not saying I agree with all of Bush's actions and policies but this is one area where (at least for the SB's doing government, Fed/DoD work) the facts speak pretty clearly.

Blood responds: I promised myself a long hiatus from this forum but I simply have to say,"What in heavens' name are you talking about???

I've read the aforementioned propaganda but I don't believe it. My company deals with about 8,000 manufacturers/importers/suppliers. I speak to HUNDREDS of suppliers AND clients every month. I cannot recall the last time ANYONE said that they were better off now than they were 3-1/2 years ago. Many of us are taking 6 figure losses in gross sales!!! This is unbelievable to me.

Without going into detail. Have you ever heard of JWOD????? The Government buyers, ie. USAF, NAVY, ALL of the abc agencies- ALL of them- are being mandated to go to TWO and ONLY TWO sources for many commodities. Those two sources are the National Industries for the Blind and the GSA (General Services Administration)schedule.

The Federal Government is the largest buyer of services and products. It does so for it's own survival and to stimulate the econmy. Until dubya came into power, vendors had AMPLE opportunities to partake in small set-asides and a PLETHORA of small bidding situations were the LOW bid would usually win. Gore had the foresight to introduce the government credit card which further facilitated the process and reduced paperwork. That is mostly gone now that the simpleton in office has copied the corporate template. You either have to become a part of GSA or forget about doing business with most of the Government. The irony is that by doing this, the Government has stopped open market bidding and is now paying 40%- 70% for the same goods and services. This man is also leaving a HUGE number of contractors and subcontractors to die on the vine & file bankruptcy even if they belatedly negotiate for a tiny piece of the pie by getting on the schedule.

Look, I won't try to convince you or any of the other botls on this forum EXCEPT to say that I base my rebuttal to you and your "talking points" on my personal experience and on that of MANY other competitors and factories.

What the current President is doing is noting short of a recipe for economic disaster. I pity veterans or anyone else who is thinking about entrepreneurship in this current climate. Once their life savings are spent, they are in for a world of hurt--especially if they expect to enter a "open market". It doesn't exist anymore.

There, I've said 1% of what I REALLY wanted to say, but who on this forum really cares, right?

All I can say to my former conservative brothers is, sayonara suckers! If he wins, the rich simpleton in office has big expensive plans for all of us.

Give his opponents a shot. If nothing else they have a Republican majority (of cowards)in Congress to hopefully keep them in check.

blood

PS: Oh yeah, regarding the argument that you need the "conservative" dubya for appointment of like-minded judges. Look at who his daddy picked-Souter & Kennedy- a couple of liberal jerks who rarely apply constitutional standards to their decisions. Listen, the rotten fruit doesn't fall far from the tree.
dccrens Offline
#13 Posted:
Joined: 04-04-2004
Posts: 721
BS,

You may want to read http://www.sba.gov/advo/stats/sbqei.pdf

"Your experience" doesn't seem to coincide with the mainstream. Unless of course the SBA is lying...

Cheers
bloody spaniard Offline
#14 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
The SBA is a failed, inept, self-perpetuating bureaucracy. They remind me of a "banana republic". Great on generating paperwork, bad at getting results. We met with them in DC & tried to help them iron out several problems that they had with their 8(a) & 7(a) programs. Both of which are mostly hype. They never cared to implement our suggestions.

Now I KNOW that you don't what you're talking about (sorry about the preposition).
Your "talking points" are apocryphal. Get some first- hand experience as a small business participant before you pontificate with your "theories". Get out from behind your desk and go out into the field. TALK to hundreds of small businesses and suppliers/mfgs like we have. There are those that "teach/talk" and those that do.

BTW, the reason that we know the SBA so well is that we temporarily "participated" in one of their programs before we quickly opted out, and because they are also a client- albeit a small one. LOL!

"Cheers" (Do you hoist a few while you post? Well, that explains a few things.) LOL!(again)

That's enough outta me. "BS" says, please take your bs elsewhere. Maybe to one of your corporate-mentoring seminars, where you can throw misrepresentations (lies) around and glad-hand one another as you toast (cheers) your faux accomplishments.

blood
bloody spaniard Offline
#15 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
One major correction on my previous post--I forgot to put in the word, "MORE":

"You either have to become a part of GSA or forget about doing business with most of the Government. The irony is that by doing this, the Government has stopped open market bidding and is now paying 40%- 70% MORE-MORE-MORE for the same goods and services."

Now, back to your cocktails...

"Cheers"

blood
dccrens Offline
#16 Posted:
Joined: 04-04-2004
Posts: 721
BS,

You are very bitter aren't you. I was trying to have an intelligent discussion on various political views. I don't think I insulted you nor did I belittle you views.

At this point I guess it makes no since to try an have a discourse with you. I don't remember who, but someone once said, that folks who have nothing intelligent to say in a debate normally resort to name calling. I had hoped that would not be the case as I enjoyed some of your previous posts. Oh well... Try to have a good life.

Cheers
bloody spaniard Offline
#17 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
^More like anger & sarcasm than bitterness. Bitterness will ensue if dubya wreaks 4 more years of economic havoc. LOL

You belittle me and millions of other hardworking business owners when you publicly spew "facts" that I know to be false. Your SBA chart skews and manipulates numbers. I don't know how the bean counters arrived at their conclusions but I know that the real business picture is very bleak--all you have to do is LISTEN to the folks on the front lines.

Unfortunately for you, I've been around the block a few times and know how the system works, and no, I'm no longer a fan of large corporations--now that I understand their workings. They are greedy, have no loyalty to their employees or country, AND they will try to skirt the law unless the Government reigns them in.

Too bad if you're offended.

Cheers
pabloescabar Offline
#18 Posted:
Joined: 02-25-2005
Posts: 30,183
cheers, that mean you's drink'n blood...
pabloescabar Offline
#19 Posted:
Joined: 02-25-2005
Posts: 30,183
cheers, that mean you's drink'n blood...
bloody spaniard Offline
#20 Posted:
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
Pablo, looks to me like you're seeing double...

Where's your Puerto Rican coffee, for Rick's sake?! LOL


I'm fed up with corporate wonks (SBLO's, SDBL's, MBEC's, etc.) who paint a false picture and build up the expectations of young, naive entrepreneurs. After 16+ years of "hard labor", I can spot these road apples a mile away. Sometimes, I smell 'em first.

Now, they come out of the woodwork in order to garner votes for the charlatan- in- chief. Give me a break!

blood
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