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Ok Here is my last and longing Political Thread I will use to post all info I gather and help keep the Misc board cleaned up a bit... Macs was right as far as 6 in a row etc. etc... and I appolagize for all that....

Now lets talk some **** here LOL

you can even call me a Self Ritchious SOB if ya want...

I gots some thick skin!!! LOL

Hog

Yeah, you sure are.

Charlie

Yo Hog:

Main Entry: mis·cel·la·neous
Pronunciation: "mi-s&-'lA-nE-&s, -ny&s
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin miscellaneus, from miscellus mixed
1 : consisting of diverse things or members : HETEROGENEOUS
2 a : having various traits b : dealing with or interested in diverse subjects.

Yo Hog:

Thanks to you and other warriors we on this forum have the right to post as many posts as we choose and to read any posts that we choose and to reply to any posts that we choose!

I enjoy reading "ALL" your posts and find them very informative. Keep up the good work!

JonR

Thanks all... and CW is right... as I said I myself see the same in my posts and others.. flooding away at the Misc board here... but it is Election time and I'm fired up... I cannot believe there's another IMO POS running for office who cannot get his story's straight to save his A$$ (literally) and the sad thing is... he's got a chance at winning (like as Clinton did) I know and felt for a fact 8 yrs of Clintons Regime... he didn't go after Terrorists... he went after America... Janet Reno and Hillary's Linch Mob did more harm to this Country then good... and Mr. John the BaB Tist Kerry wants to be the Next JFK.. sick SOB even changed his middle name to F from G and started into Politics before he even left the damn Swiftboat he served on... everything built about this Ego Grabbing POS smells like **** and thats being nice about it... he will sink the Military as did Clinton and this is one thing this Nation does not need at this time...

as Zell Miller said and I'm with him.. what are they going to fight with... Spitballs?

I'm a pissed off Veteran and Retired to boot.. Retired not because I want to be but because "YES MEN" like this POS wanted me out... and They Denied me my Veterans Rights on the Way out!!!!

I'd rather be Jambing Bombs and protecting this land that I love from adversary's as I swore to uphold in my Oath...
but in the last 26 months I've been finding out some of these Advisary's are the very same who elect to put you in Harms Way... and allot of this has to do with the All Mighty Buck.... Many like as in Kerry and the Clintons would do anything for this Buck at no matter what the cost...

enough for now....

Hog

After the RNC Polls...
http://www.time.com/time/press_releases/article/0,8599,692562,00.html

Campaign 2004: Bush Opens Double-Digit Lead
TIME Poll: Among likely voters, 52% would vote for President George Bush, while 41% would vote for John Kerry and 3% would vote for Ralph Nader

Other results include:
Was U.S. Right Going to War with Iraq? Over half of those surveyed (52%) think the U.S. was right in going to war with Iraq, while 41% think the U.S. was wrong to go to war.

Hog

Hog go a head and keep 'um rolling. Sometimes people just get too uptight. After all it's up to the individual if they want to read them.

When I get tired of the politics I just post other subjects.

Na Xrun this is a USAHOG Thread...

long time no see how ya doin??

Hog

Yup. Just to reiterate (that means say it again) I ain't mad atcha hogman! Never was. We is bruthas from different muthas.

But i'll stay away from the political stuff.

http://www.theggordonliddyshow.com/

IF IT’S SUNDAY, IT’S MISLEAD THE PRESS
Kerry And Edwards Continue Their Extreme Makeover On The Sunday Shows

KERRY-EDWARDS TOUT INTEL EXPERIENCE, BUT FAIL
TO MENTION THEY DIDN’T SHOW UP FOR WORK

Kerry-Edwards Ticket Tours Their Experience On Senate Intelligence Committee. SEN. JOHN EDWARDS: “As you know, for many years, John served on the Intelligence Committee. I’m on the Intelligence Committee now.” (Fox News’ “Fox News Sunday,” 8/1/04)

But Kerry And Edwards Didn’t Show Up For Work On Committee:

ü While On Committee, Kerry Missed 38 Of 49 Intelligence Committee Hearings. During John Kerry's eight years of service on the Senate's Select Committee on Intelligence, there were 49 open, public hearings. Of these 49, John Kerry attended just 11 (22.4%). Among the most notable of those he missed is the June 8, 2000, hearing on the report of the National Commission on Terrorism, which warned about the terrorist threat we now face and recommended numerous steps to address that threat (few of which were adopted prior to 9/11/01).

ü Of Eight Public Hearings Of Senate Select Intelligence Committee Since Edwards Joined Committee, He Has Attended Just Four. The Senate Intelligence Committee had held eight open, public hearings since Edwards joined the committee and he attended four of them. This does not count numerous closed-door hearings, which we have no way of knowing if Edwards attended or not. It also does not count the hearings (some open, some closed) of the joint House-Senate Intelligence Committee investigation into the 9/11 attacks. (U.S. Senate Select Committee On Intelligence Website, “Hearings: 107th Congress,” intelligence.senate.gov, Accessed 7/14/04; U.S. Senate Select Committee On Intelligence Website, “Hearings: 108th Congress,” intelligence.senate.gov, Accessed 7/14/04; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 2/7/01, Edwards Present; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 9/24/01, Edwards Present; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 2/6/02, Edwards Present; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 4/17/02, Edwards Not Present; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 7/31/02, Edwards Not Present; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 10/9/02, Edwards Not Present; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 2/11/03, Edwards Present; Select Committee On Intelligence, U.S. Senate, Hearing, 6/17/03, Edwards Not Present)

Sen. John Cornyn (D-TX) Called On Kerry And Edwards To Release Their Attendance Records At Closed Door Hearings Of Intelligence Committee As Well. SEN. JOHN CORNYN: “In terms of the intelligence oversight that has been conducted by congress, I think the American people would be shocked to know that during the time that Senator Kerry served on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, he missed 38 out of 49 of the public meetings of the Senate Intelligence Committee. Of the public hearings during Senator Edwards’s tenure on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence he has only made four out of the eight public meetings. So I would like to call on Senator Edwards and Senator Kerry today to publicly release their attendance records at the private, or classified, hearing on the intelligence committee so the American people can really know the truth. Where does the failure of oversight come from? Is it because they didn’t bother to show up? I think the American people deserve to know and they deserve to know the truth now.” (Sen. John Cornyn, Press Conference, Boston, MA, 7/29/04)

KERRY IS “A FISCAL HAWK”?

Edwards Claims Kerry Is Fiscally Conservative. SEN. JOHN EDWARDS: “Any kind of objective analysis says this guy’s [Sen. John Kerry] a fiscal hawk. He just is. He has been the whole time he’s been in the Senate. But we need to make sure voters in the South know that.” (ABC’s “This Week,” 8/1/04)

Kerry Voted 98 Times For Tax Increases Totaling More Than $2.3 Trillion. (Republican National Committee Website, “Sen. John Kerry: Votes For Higher Taxes,” http://commrnc.grassroots.com/resources/KerryVotesForHigherTaxes.pdf, Accessed 8/1/04)

Kerry Voted At Least 126 Times Against Tax Cuts Totaling More Than $5.3Trillion. (Republican National Committee Website, “Sen. John Kerry: Votes For Higher Taxes,” http://commrnc.grassroots.com/resources/KerryVotesForHigherTaxes.pdf, Accessed 8/1/04)

Kerry Has Voted 73 Times To Reduce The Size Of A Tax Cut. (Republican National Committee Website, “Sen. John Kerry: Votes For Higher Taxes,” http://commrnc.grassroots.com/resources/KerryVotesForHigherTaxes.pdf, Accessed 8/1/04)

Kerry Voted 67 Times For Smaller Tax Cuts (Democrat Alternatives). (Republican National Committee Website, “Sen. John Kerry: Votes For Higher Taxes,” http://commrnc.grassroots.com/resources/KerryVotesForHigherTaxes.pdf, Accessed 8/1/04)

Kerry Voted 11 Times Against Repealing Tax Hikes. (Republican National Committee Website, “Sen. John Kerry: Votes For Higher Taxes,” http://commrnc.grassroots.com/resources/KerryVotesForHigherTaxes.pdf, Accessed 8/1/04)

Sen. Kerry Voted For Higher Taxes On Social Security Benefits Eight Times:

ü Twice For Clinton’s Tax Hike On Social Security Benefits.(H.R. 2264, CQ Vote #190: Passed 50-49: R 0-43; D 49-6, With Vice President Al Gore Casting The Tie-Breaking Vote, 6/25/93, Kerry Voted Yea; H.R. 2264, CQ Vote #247: Adopted 51-50: R 0-44; D 50-6, With Vice President Al Gore Casting The Tie-Breaking Vote, 8/6/93, Kerry Voted Yea)

ü Three Times To Keep Hike In Clinton Plan.(S. Con. Res. 18, CQ Vote #57: Motion Agreed To 52-47: R 0-43; D 52-4, 3/24/93, Kerry Voted Yea; S. Con. Res. 18, CQ Vote #59: Motion Agreed To 55-44: R 0-43; D 55-1, 3/24/93, Kerry Voted Yea; S. 1134, CQ Vote #169: Motion Agreed To 51-46: R 1-41; D 50-5, 6/24/93, Kerry Voted Yea)

ü Three Times Against Repealing 1993 Increase.(S. Con. Res. 57, CQ Vote #142: Adopted 50-48: R 49-4; D 1-44, 5/22/96, Kerry Voted Nay; H.R. 8, CQ Vote #188: Adopted 58-41: R 54-1; D 4-40, 7/13/00, Kerry Voted Nay; S. Con. Res. 23, CQ Vote #94: Rejected 48-51: R 48-3; D 0-47; I 0-1, 3/25/03, Kerry Voted Nay)

ü Increased Taxes On Seniors Making As Little As $34,000 Per Year. “The 1993 budget deal - which passed by one vote, with Kerry’s support … raised taxes on millions of middle-income retirees, by subjecting more of their Social Security benefits to taxation. The hike amounted to at least several hundred dollars a year for elderly couples with incomes starting at $44,000 a year, or individuals making at least $34,000 a year.” (“The Debate: Sorting Out Fact From Fiction,” The Boston Globe, 4/10/96)

And Sen. Kerry Voted Against Balanced Budget Amendment At Least Five Times.(S. J. Res. 1, Roll Call Vote #24: Rejected 66-34: R 55-0; D 11-34, 3/4/97, Kerry Voted Nay; H.J. Res. 1, Roll Call Vote #158: Rejected 64-35: R 52-1; D 12-34, 6/6/96, Kerry Voted Nay; H.J. Res. 1, Roll Call Vote #98: Rejected 65-35: R 51-2; D 14-33, 3/2/95, Kerry Voted Nay; S. J. Res. 41, Roll Call Vote #48: Rejected 63-37: R 41-3; D 22-34, 3/1/94, Kerry Voted Nay; S. J. Res. 225, Roll Call Vote #45: Rejected 66-34: R 43-10; D 23-24, 3/25/86, Kerry Voted Nay)

DECIDING WHICH ESTATE TO MORTGAGE
AN EXAMPLE OF EXECUTIVE LEADERSHIP?

Kerry Cited Decision To Mortgage Boston Mansion As Example Of Executive Decision Making.
“Well, I think I do have executive experience and I think I’ve shown in the course of my life decisiveness and a willingness to take command and take charge and make decisions that are tough decisions. … I made tough decisions in this campaign- tough decisions about mortgaging my own home, tough decisions about changing my own leadership in the campaign in midstream.” (CNN’s “Late Edition,” 8/1/04)

“From A Sailing Mecca To A Ski Resort, Presumptive Democratic Nominee John Kerry And His Wife, Teresa Heinz Kerry, Enjoy The Trappings Of Their Wealth In At Least Five Homes And Vacation Getaways Valued At Nearly $33 Million.” (Lolita C. Baldor, "Kerry, Wife Call Several Locales Home, From Nantucket To Ketchum," The Associated Press, 3/22/04)

One Of The Five Estates Is 15th-Century Manor Imported >From England. “There are five residences: the Heinz family farm in Pittsburgh, homes in Nantucket, Georgetown, and Beacon Hill, and a ski retreat in Idaho - a 15th-century barn that she and Heinz had imported from England and then reassembled.” (Sally Jacobs, “Running Mate Teresa Heinz Kerry Brings Her Outspoken Style To Her Husband’s Campaign,” The Boston Globe, 3/26/03)

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/05/politics/campaign/05campaign.html?ei=5006&en=9105c6c3ef9ca4f0&ex=1094961600&partner=ALTAVISTA1&pagewanted=print&position=

September 5, 2004
DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIES
Democrats Urge Kerry to Turn Up Intensity of Campaign
By ADAM NAGOURNEY and JODI WILGOREN

President Bush roared out of his New York convention last week, leaving many Democrats nervous about the state of the presidential race and pressing Senator John Kerry to torque up what they described as a wandering and low-energy campaign.

In interviews, leading Democrats - governors, senators, fund-raisers and veteran strategists - said they had urged Mr. Kerry's campaign aides to concentrate almost exclusively on challenging President Bush on domestic issues from here on out, saying he had spent too much of the summer on national security, Mr. Bush's strongest turf.

As the Labor Day weekend began, Mr. Kerry appeared to be heeding the advice with an aggressive attack on Mr. Bush's economic leadership. But many supporters also said they wanted to see Mr. Kerry respond more forcefully to the sort of attacks they said had undercut his standing and to offer a broad and convincing case for his candidacy.

"He's got to become more engaged,'' said Harold Ickes, a former political lieutenant to President Bill Clinton who is now running an independent Democratic organization that has spent millions of dollars on advertisements attacking President Bush. "Kerry is by nature a cautious politician, but he's got to throw caution to the wind."

Senator Bob Graham of Florida, a former rival of Mr. Kerry for the Democratic nomination, said Mr. Kerry still had not settled on a defining theme to counter what Democrats called the compelling theme of security hammered into viewers of the Republican convention.

"The people are there, the candidate is there; it's the reason to vote for the candidate that's still a little out of focus," Mr. Graham said.

Gov. Edward G. Rendell of Pennsylvania said Mr. Kerry "has got to start smacking back."

And Senator Christopher J. Dodd, an influential Democrat from Connecticut, said his party's standard-bearer had "a very confused message in August, and the Republicans had a very clear and concise one."

Mr. Dodd was one of several Democrats who said they now thought Mr. Kerry had made a mistake at his convention in July by talking mainly about his history as a Vietnam War veteran and criticizing Mr. Bush's policies, without offering a vision of what a Kerry term would be like.

"We did not adequately lay out the contrast, compare and contrast what a Kerry administration would do and what the Bush administration has done," Mr. Dodd said of the Democrats' convention in Boston. "That was a mistake. Vietnam, in terms of John Kerry's service, that was a good point to make, but making it such a central point sort of invited the kind of response you've seen."

If nervous about the state of play going into Labor Day, Democrats were far from ready to concede defeat in a contest that typically does not engage until the start of September. They pointed to polls showing continued unhappiness with the direction of the country and Mr. Bush's mediocre job approval ratings.

And not incidentally, they invoked Mr. Kerry's history of getting more focused on a contest only when he was faced with the prospect of imminent defeat; that is what happened when he ran for re-election to the Senate from Massachusetts in 1996 and when he won the Iowa caucuses this year after many Democrats had dismissed his candidacy as finished.

"John Kerry had a great July and George Bush had a good August,'' said Gov. Tom Vilsack of Iowa, one of a handful of Democrats who said they were not concerned by the turn of events. "It doesn't mean a thing. This battle starts right now."

Still, Democrats said Mr. Bush's convention, combined with an aggressive advertising effort by former Vietnam veterans with ties to Mr. Bush's supporters to discredit Mr. Kerry's war record, had turned this contest away from a referendum on Mr. Bush's presidency and into a referendum on Mr. Kerry's character, war record and stand on Iraq.

Some Democrats described this as an ominous development that Mr. Kerry had to address.

"What they did is they lost control of the ball," said Representative Rahm Emanuel of Illinois, who was a senior political adviser in the Clinton White House. "They allowed the election to not be about George Bush but to be about themselves. They have to get back on their game."

And Mr. Graham said, "It's become a referendum on the challenger."

The remarks suggested something of a reassessment by many Democratic leaders who had, almost unanimously, praised Mr. Kerry's convention when he left Boston in July.

Their concern has mounted as Mr. Kerry has fended off an attack on his Vietnam record, and seem to have come to a head after a convention in New York where the Republicans systematically sought to take advantage of what they saw as lapses in Mr. Kerry's own convention. Those included the decision by Mr. Kerry and his aides to focus almost entirely on promoting his biography, for the most part avoiding the kind of sharp attacks on his opponent that were a dominant theme of Mr. Bush's convention.

"If you give me a hundred dollars, I couldn't tell you a single policy thing they talked about,'' Ed Gillespie, the national Republican chairman, said. "They gave us a huge opening, and we jumped on it.''

Mr. Kerry's situation is complicated by the fact that because the Republicans scheduled their convention so late, there is relatively little time to turn things around.

The questions about Mr. Kerry's campaign came as the candidate has beefed up his staff, bringing in some longtime party veterans, and shown signs of what aides said would be a new aggressiveness on the stump and on television. In a break from tradition, Mr. Kerry held a rally at midnight soon after Mr. Bush accepted his nomination to lash into Mr. Bush and Vice President ****** Cheney for questioning his combat record, noting that both Republicans had not served in Vietnam.

"You're seeing a different John Kerry," Mr. Vilsack said. "He was up at 12 o'clock at night. He was saying, 'I am ready to rock and roll.' "

Kerry is taking today off at his wife's farm in Fox Chapel, Pa., to celebrate the 31st birthday of his eldest daughter, Alexandra. Some of the criticism of Mr. Kerry's campaign was cosmetic. Several Democrats said they were not happy to see news photographs of Mr. Kerry windsurfing in the Atlantic waters off Nantucket during the convention, suggesting that it underlined the very image of Mr. Kerry - as a wealthy, culturally out-of-touch liberal - that the Republicans were trying to convey.

"I might have gone windsurfing - you certainly have a right to clear your head,'' said Mr. Rendell, a former head of the Democratic National Committee. "But I'm not sure I would have taken the press with me."

Mr. Kerry's aides defended their strategy, saying the campaign would change, as planned, in tone and substance now that the Republicans were finished.

"There are stages in this race and the fall has always been about painting stark difference between the two candidates," said Stephanie Cutter, Mr. Kerry's communications director. "You're just going to see an aggressive campaign that will go right at the real issues in this race."

And while taking questions in Ohio on Saturday, Mr. Kerry said he was not worried about how the campaign was going.

"We're doing good," he said. "They are going to get a bounce out of the convention. But we'll be coming back."

And Democrats said all of this would be forgotten at what was shaping up as the next critical moment of the campaign: the two or three presidential debates, starting at the end of September. Aides to both sides said the encounters could be decisive, suggesting that many more undecided voters would watch them than had seen Mr. Kerry or Mr. Bush at their conventions.

In questioning the Kerry campaign, some Democrats offered challenges to some of its most fundamental strategic decisions.

Senator Evan Bayh of Indiana said Mr. Kerry had spent too much time talking about national security, including his own views on the Iraq war, and overplayed Mr. Kerry's Vietnam war experience, inviting the attacks that have dominated debate in recent weeks.

The focus on security was calculated to erase Mr. Bush's advantage on the issue. But Democratic leaders said the Kerry campaign had become ensnared in a debate that played to Mr. Bush's strength, and diverted him from challenging Mr. Bush on his domestic record.

"He needs to define this election," Mr. Bayh said of Mr. Kerry. "So much of the convention was focused on national security - if that's where the election is, I don't think he can win."

Most of all, Democrats were perturbed with what they described as the Kerry campaign's unsteady response to the Vietnam veterans groups making unsubstantiated charges about the combat medals Mr. Kerry won while in Vietnam.

They expressed sympathy with the political dilemma Mr. Kerry confronted in trying to determine whether to respond to such charges would serve only to draw attention to them, but said they were astonished to see him struggling with what was supposed to be his strength.

"All of a sudden Kerry is on the defensive about his service and Bush is on the offensive about his service," Senator John B. Breaux of Louisiana said. "It's absolutely amazing."

Gov. Jennifer M. Granholm of Michigan said: "I think it is very critical that you don't answer a tuba with a piccolo. If he's hit, and he will be, he needs to stand up and fight."

Mr. Rendell said the mood of Democrats had swung sharply since Mr. Kerry's nominating convention.

"I think there is real concern," he said. But he added, "Everybody has a level of optimism that it can turn around and will turn around."

Howard Dean, the former governor of Vermont who lost the Democratic nomination to Mr. Kerry, said Democrats were overreacting, noting Mr. Kerry's come-from-behind victories against William Weld in the 1996 race for Senate in Massachusetts and Mr. Kerry's decisive defeat of Dr. Dean in Iowa.

"They've been very aggressive and they've really turned withering fire on John Kerry and clearly we have to respond to that," Dr. Dean said. "I tell you, I'm the one person in America other than Bill Weld that knows John Kerry can respond"

hogmeister, you go on and say your piece(s). i made a decision to stay out of political threads and take a break from them for personal reasons. it was taking too much time and energy that i needed to put into other things. the negativity (in general, no specifics here) was also getting to me.

that doesn't mean i want folks to shut up (that's bill o'reilly's tactic) ;) -- just means it was time for me to take personal responsibility for what i was ingesting, so i chose to take a break. it's not like there's a space limit here -- plenty of room for EVERYONE to speak out about whatever they want.

for awhile i was doing a lot of thread starting of my own, basically counterpoint facts, but man that just gets nowhere. folks will believe what they want to believe, and i'm cool with that.

politics-wise now all i have to say is try to get ALL the facts, register to vote and then go do it, and vote for whichever candidate suits you.

as for hog, russ is a bro, no matter where we stand on the political spectrum, and he's welcome in my home any time.