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cwilhelmi Offline
#1 Posted: Wed, Aug 7 2002, 2:57 PM EST
Joined: 07-24-2001
Posts: 2,739
Would you rather have a weak President with strong morals, or a strong President with weak morals?



This is not a question to spark controvery between Clinton and Bush, just a question... chris
CJBully Offline
#2 Posted: Wed, Aug 7 2002, 6:49 PM EST
Joined: 07-31-2002
Posts: 753
since the pres is commander in chief, would you rather have a weak miltary with strong morals or a strong military with weak morals?
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#3 Posted: Wed, Aug 7 2002, 7:35 PM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
cwilhelmi

not clinton vs bush my ass. i do respect your opinions about who is weak and who was strong.

i prefered truman who when asked if he regreted using the atomic bomb on japan replied "i haven't heard an apology for pearl harbor."
cwilhelmi Offline
#4 Posted: Wed, Aug 7 2002, 8:10 PM EST
Joined: 07-24-2001
Posts: 2,739
Rick



Your right, I was implying it, but to be honest I could give a sh*t as to the President's morals, as long as he's doing a good job running the country. I think Bush is very self-serving and overall I think Clinton was better. But I definitely don't think Gore would have done a better job than Bush has done.



And before anyone jumps to George's recue look at Cuba. The only reason we're keeping the embargo is so he and his brother will get re-elected(remember the whole florida debacle...), it's in America's best interest to open the trade policy. We can farm out cheap labor down there and the government can charge tax on the cigars. Anyone who thinks Cuba is more of a threat than some of our other trading partners are fooling themselves. There is no need for the antiquated embargo!



anyway, must sleep... chris
eleltea Offline
#5 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 3:16 AM EST
Joined: 03-03-2002
Posts: 4,562
Rick, you said it. The Clinton legacy: character does not count.
Charlie Offline
#6 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 4:28 AM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
Bubba was a real character, he just did not have any character! Charlie
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#7 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 4:53 AM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
eleltea

not like it counts in the senate or the congress, where all the women are strong, all the
men are good looking and all the children are above average.do you understand the reference?

does anyone?
eleltea Offline
#8 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 6:06 AM EST
Joined: 03-03-2002
Posts: 4,562
Garrison Keilor is a bleeding heart liberal. Funny guy, though, and maybe brilliant.
jjohnson28 Offline
#9 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 10:41 AM EST
Joined: 09-12-2000
Posts: 7,914
Well hell,I'd just as soon keep the one we have a strong patriotic President with strong morals?

SteveS Offline
#10 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 11:06 AM EST
Joined: 01-13-2002
Posts: 8,751
I second your motion, Jim ... I'm happy with the one we've got and even happier with the strong team he's surrounded himself with ...
Charlie Offline
#11 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 12:18 PM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
Do we need another 2nd or would it be a third! We need a President like GWB during this tragic period of American History---not a playboy who "did not have sex with that women"! Charlie
cwilhelmi Offline
#12 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 12:39 PM EST
Joined: 07-24-2001
Posts: 2,739
Charlie - you're avoiding the issue that was brought up.


You can put a flag in anyone's hand and have his "team's" hands up his a$$ making him say whatever you like. But GWB himself is not a strong President on his own, and whenever he goes off script this is apparent as he gets flustered and reverts to his yokel roots. Clinton may be a playboy, but he was a strong President, although morally corrupt. And who gives a sh*t who he's boinked? If you think he was the first President to do so you're very naive!!



In a perfect world we would have a strong President who only acted in the best interest of the country, instead of the best interests of the puppeteers and the well-funded contributors. Since I don't see that ever happening we make due with GWB, because he's our yokel. Like I said, I don't think Gore would do any better, and I don't know who would... chris
tailgater Offline
#13 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 5:30 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
So, Chris, you feel that a President is only strong if they are a good impromptu speaker? Perhaps we could elect a radio talk show host, or a stand up comedian. No sir, in all due respect, a truly strong President will indeed surround himself with the cream of the crop in their respective fields, and he will challenge them to be better while being humble enough to accept their wisdom. No one person can possibly be the most knowledgable in foreign affairs, fiscal responsiblity, and social wellbeing. But now I am to understand that he also needs to be a wiz with the microphone. Bush used just enough well written speeches and political clout to land the job at hand. But his effectiveness is in his ability to relate to the professionals he has chosen to guide him in matters of concern. Yes, Clinton looked more comfortable in front of the camera. But to equate that to being a strong president is quite a stretch. A strong president would have been able to get his VP elected to replace him. Bill Clinton has become a characature of himself. A feat only matched by Nixon who at least had the decency to step down for the good of the Country.
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#14 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 6:51 PM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
tailgater

excuse me.

"whenever he goes off script this is apparent as he gets flustered and reverts to his yokel roots." cwilhelmi was not refering to his speaking ability, but rather that without a script, he has no idea what to say. why? because he is a dumb sh*t.

"You can put a flag in anyone's hand and have his "team's" hands up his a$$ making him say whatever you like" have you noticed cheney doesn't drink water when bush is speaking?

bushe's speech pattern is short phrases. he looks at his script and see's the next phrase and repeats it. if anyone mixed up the pages of his written script, he would not know the difference.

and Charlie, "not a playboy". are you in denial about bushe's past, shall we say indiscretions, or have you fogiven him?

the market is close to collapse, we are bombing civilians as his father did when he went for noriega, the leader of a sovereign area, and killed over 500 civilians, some estimate closer two 2000.

bush inc wants to kill sadaam whatever his name is. the fact that he is the leader of his country, as bad as he might be, we do not have the right to assassinate him, unless you are willing to accept the fact that castro or any other dictator has the right to kill our president because he believes the usa is dangerous to them. the idea of a preventative strike against a dangerous enemy, is a well grounded reality, and is perfectly sensible technique to avoid harm to your own people, but that is not what this is all about. are we going to kill sadaam and set up our own puppet government as we have done many times in the past?

it is incumbent that the democrats gain a majority in both houses, not because they are smarter or more liberal or less evil than the republicans, but as an offset against bush inc's agenda.

i'm not corrrect about everything i say and neither are you, but if i am in charge you are screwed and vice versa. we need to accommidate each other so we can live together in peace. if you keep a perfect lawn, i should at least keep a decent one. if i stay up till all hours of the night, i shouldn't run any power tools that would interfere with your sleep.

if we are kind to each other, life works.
jjohnson28 Offline
#15 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 8:45 PM EST
Joined: 09-12-2000
Posts: 7,914
Sorry Chris but I believe your the one that has clouded the issue with your loaded question to begin with, so I'll say it once again.



I'd just as soon keep the one we have a Strong Patriotic President with Strong Morals?

jjohnson28 Offline
#16 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 8:49 PM EST
Joined: 09-12-2000
Posts: 7,914
So Rick,I take it by your post that your happy with a democratic majority that will and is purposely trying to tank our economy so as they can regan.hold on to control. WOW thats putting the people/country first isn't it?
jjohnson28 Offline
#17 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 8:50 PM EST
Joined: 09-12-2000
Posts: 7,914
regain/hold on to control...LOL
cwilhelmi Offline
#18 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 9:18 PM EST
Joined: 07-24-2001
Posts: 2,739
jim - I never said I was a democrat, which I am not, nor a republican, you asumed I was and therefore condoned the acts of congress.



I don't think the house or senate should undermine the President unless he is not doing what's right for the counrty. Do you really think congress is trying to tank the economy? They have a lot to lose by doing so, considering their wealth it's a pretty good assumption that a vast majority of them are stock holders!! But I guess they don't care about personal wealth right??



And like I said before, GWB acts with more self interest than genuine concern for our country 50% of the time. Right now the puppetmasters are thinking about the 04 election, as well as the coming election, more than they should be. They gotta get Jeb re-elected in FL, and get yokel another term as well!
cwilhelmi Offline
#19 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 9:27 PM EST
Joined: 07-24-2001
Posts: 2,739
tailgater - It seems to me that the FACT that GWB is not a good speaker does say a lot about his strength. He is worthless at impromptu speaking because he is a moron, he cannot communicate intelligently about the given subjects because he doesn't understand them and doesn't know which note card to misread.



And the fact that gore did not get elected means nothing, if gore had taken the help that clinton was willing to give he probably would have won the election, not that that would have been a good thing anyway. And if I recall, GB Sr. couldn’t even get a second term because he was smoked by clinton, or did you forget that? And the reason Clinton was more comfortable was because he is a very intelligent man, no one can refute this, and no one can say the same for GWB!!
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#20 Posted: Thu, Aug 8 2002, 11:01 PM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
jjohnson28

"tank the economy?"

our economy is already in the toilet. bush has managed to enrich his peers and destroy the financial lives of the rest of the country in less than 2 years. i'm sorry i meant his handlers have done it.

remember a few years ago, when the big, pardon the pun, story was clinton and his sexcapades?

the market, a barometer of what's happening to the economy, was up and the scandal of watergate that cost $70,000,000.turned up nothing.

the democrats need to win both houses to put the breaks to bush inc before we end up in a nuclear war.

who is in this new coalition? england? they are getting a little shakey about hanging around with us. any other country? israel, because the minute we launch any attack, they will be targeted by iraq. when that happens, israel will not do what she did during the last fiasco, sit still for the benefit of the usa, and allow missils to be used against her.

remember when israel took out the nuclear plant that was being built in iran or iraq, two countries seperated only by their last letter.

jjohnson28 Offline
#21 Posted: Fri, Aug 9 2002, 8:41 AM EST
Joined: 09-12-2000
Posts: 7,914
Sorry Chris but you'll have to point me to where I said you were either a Democrat or a Republican. It aint there buddy,why because I assumed neither.



To both of you the Dems and their leaders have been and will continue to stonewall any meaningful legislation hell they won't even let most of it come up for a vote.They've blocked almost every one of the Presidents appointments,hell they won't even let them come up for a vote.Yes they will do everything(including holding the economy hostage) they can to hold on to power,hell they'de probably be even happier if there were no election in Novemeber,then the people wouldn't even have to vote.
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#22 Posted: Fri, Aug 9 2002, 10:54 AM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
jjohnson28

since i am neither a democrat nor a republican and hold both in low esteem, i can point out the republicans shut the government down several years ago by not voting on a budget, not even an emergency budget.

it's a shame voting had little to do with the last presidental election.

i think the differnce between parties is that the republicans are a self-serving bunch of bastards that stick together and have the cajones to push their agenda forward.

the democrats are a self-serving bunch of bastards that don't have the cajones to do anything.

if clinton had all the sh*t on him that bush has, the republicans would have not only impeached him, but got him thrown out on his ass.

the democrats sit there and do nothing.
eleltea Offline
#23 Posted: Fri, Aug 9 2002, 3:12 PM EST
Joined: 03-03-2002
Posts: 4,562
Rick, how do you really feel about George W. Bush as president? This time, don't hold anything back.
banshee Offline
#24 Posted: Sat, Aug 10 2002, 6:15 PM EST
Joined: 07-12-2002
Posts: 10
The only thing strong I noticed about Clinton was the stench left behind as he left office . He did his best to decimate the military, raised taxes (too much by his own admission). Don't forget it was during his watch that the economy boomed. Now we see why, every big corporation in existence was cooking the books. It is now time to pay the piper for those years. The military has to be rebuilt and the losses which were being called profits by magic bookkeeping have to b e paid back. He chose for one of his appointees Papa Doc's P.R. man and he couldnt tell the truth about anything if his life depended on it. Those were his good points. However, I will admit he lied eloquently. Even Mr. Gore was preferable to Buba. Not that it matters, I am a Democrat, but I was taught to tell the truth.
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#25 Posted: Sat, Aug 10 2002, 8:17 PM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
banshee

bush bumped his head the other day getting into his helicopter.

that damn clinton.
jjohnson28 Offline
#26 Posted: Sat, Aug 10 2002, 10:45 PM EST
Joined: 09-12-2000
Posts: 7,914
Sounds like a pretty fair assessment to me Banshee.
Welcome!
banshee Offline
#27 Posted: Sun, Aug 11 2002, 3:41 AM EST
Joined: 07-12-2002
Posts: 10
RICKAMAVEN I knew Buba had to behind that, lol
eleltea Offline
#28 Posted: Sun, Aug 11 2002, 5:54 AM EST
Joined: 03-03-2002
Posts: 4,562
Everything is George's fault. Nothing is Clinton's fault. This is called logic and reason. Glad to bring it to the discussion.


Along with the usual sarcasm, of course.
eleltea Offline
#29 Posted: Sun, Aug 11 2002, 5:56 AM EST
Joined: 03-03-2002
Posts: 4,562
Off Topic: excuse me. my font sizes are out of whack. this is just a test. excuse me. sorryexcuse mesorry
tailgater Offline
#30 Posted: Sun, Aug 11 2002, 4:38 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
This board amuses me. Folks equate speaking poise with political strength and patriotism. They refuse to be labeled Democrat or Republican, yet embrace their secret parties agenda with affection. Truths are mixed with lies, opinions are laced with attacks, and the sophomoric slander reeks of unoriginality. The hypocracy here is exceeded perhaps nowhere else but in our own political system. But I do know of several things to be fact: Our economy is tight, World Peace seems unachievable, and our soil has been tainted with the death of thousands for no obvious reason. But through it all, I'm more proud to be an AMERICAN today than I ever have been in my 36 years on God's green earth. And I KNOW that the current administration is one of the reasons. So while some of you think Dubya is a moron, or a yokel, I thank him for his humanity. It's LONG overdue...
Charlie Offline
#31 Posted: Sun, Aug 11 2002, 4:53 PM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
I fully agree with Tailgater on this and we should be lucky to have a great leader like GWB and his Administration, which by the way, is the most diverse and racially mixed of any of our past Administrations! Yet the NACCP will campaign against GWB in next election! Charlie
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#32 Posted: Mon, Aug 12 2002, 3:09 AM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
Charlie

BS
RICKAMAVEN Offline
#33 Posted: Mon, Aug 12 2002, 3:10 AM EST
Joined: 10-01-2000
Posts: 33,248
Charlie

by the way did you get the closeup of the hummingbird i sent you?
PMoreno349 Offline
#34 Posted: Wed, Aug 28 2002, 7:25 AM EST
Joined: 07-05-2002
Posts: 665
PMoreno349 Offline
#35 Posted: Wed, Aug 28 2002, 7:28 AM EST
Joined: 07-05-2002
Posts: 665
That first post is because I was speachless. Let me ask this question, "Do you care whether the President is intelligent?" BTW, tailgater, you have been listening to too much AM talk radio, "On God's Green Earth"
Charlie Offline
#36 Posted: Wed, Aug 28 2002, 7:55 AM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
To all of you!!! Go back and read all of the posts on this thread and you will see the same "labeling" and mud slinging over and over! All I can say is that it is a good thing Algore (not a typo) did not win! We would still be running opinion polls to see what action to take because of the Politically Incorrect actions of 9/11! He would probably be renting the Lincoln Bedroom for contributions and reinventing the internet.......what a great leader and public servant Algore was! Bah (laughing to myself) Charlie
tailgater Offline
#37 Posted: Wed, Aug 28 2002, 5:47 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
At the risk of sounding like bubba, please define what you mean by "intelligence". If you refer to one's capacity to learn and interperet data, then Yes I think we'd all agree that it's important. If instead you are refering to the ability to speak elequantly so as to SOUND intelligent, then I'm not that easily impressed.


I honestly feel that it is MUCH more important to "Walk the Walk" than it is to "Talk the talk".

tailgater Offline
#38 Posted: Wed, Aug 28 2002, 5:50 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
For the record, I've used the term "God's green earth" most of my life. And I prefer my local FM talk jocks on the rare occassions that I can listen to the radio.
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