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https://api.nationalgeographic.com/distribution/public/amp/history/article/how-confederate-battle-flag-became-symbol-racism

Good read. Thanks.

Lewistown, Pa residents and the surrounding 5 mile radius sure love displaying the Confederacy stars and bars...
No political correctness B.S. going on up there...
CNN should do a CRT STORY about the local school curriculum...

Thanks, you laid the exact foundation for the Union as a Lincoln saw it too.
I reckon you need to do more reading.

Lincoln On Slavery:

“… when they [slaveowners] remind us of their constitutional rights, I acknowledge them, not grudgingly but fully and fairly; and I would give them any legislation for the claiming of their fugitives.” ~ Lincoln, speaking in support of the Fugitive Slave Act of 1850.

“…in nearly all the published speeches of him who now addresses you… I do but quote from one of those speeches when I declare that ‘I have no purpose, directly or indirectly, to interfere with the institution of slavery in the states where it exists. I believe I have no lawful right to do so, and I have no inclination to do so.’ ”

“I have no objection to its being made express and irrevocable.” ~ Lincoln, speaking in regards to slavery and in support of a proposed Thirteenth Amendment to explicitly guarantee slavery.

Lincoln On Blacks:

“The whole nation is interested that the best use shall be made of these territories. We want them for the homes of free white people.” ~ Lincoln, on whether blacks – slave or free – should be allowed in the new territories in the west, October 16, 1854.

“I, as well as Judge Douglas, am in favor of the race to which I belong having the superior position. I have never said anything to the contrary.” ~ Lincoln, Aug. 21, 1858, in remarks stating his belief that blacks were naturally inferior to whites, which was a nearly universal belief on the part of whites in both the North and South long before and long after the Civil War.

“Root, hog, or die” ~ Lincoln’s suggestion to illiterate and propertyless ex-slaves unprepared for freedom, Feb. 3, 1865.

“They had better be set to digging their subsistence out of the ground.” ~ Lincoln in a War Department memo, April 16, 1863

“Send them to Liberia, to their own native land.” ~ Lincoln, speaking in favor of ethnic cleansing all blacks from the United States.

“I cannot make it better known than it already is, that I favor colonization.” ~ Lincoln, in a message to Congress, December 1, 1862, supporting deportation of all blacks from America.

Abolitionist and advocate of free trade, William Lloyd Garrison on Lincoln:

“President Lincoln may colonize himself if he choose, but it is an impertinent act, on his part, to propose the getting rid of those who are as good as himself.”

“[Lincoln] had not a drop of anti-slavery blood in his veins.”

Not to harsh. You were born dead. They were born brain dead.

Unless you are like borndead, who has swallowed the Lincolnian myth hook, line, and sinker, so he now can't handle the truth that Alexander H. Stephens views on race were the same as Abe Lincoln. And like it or not that was the predominant view on race of most people in the North and the South. I know it makes some people sob and cry. "No it can't be true!, they told me in skool that da Southerners were all racists and insurrectionists who wanted to destroy America and the Northerners led by Father Abraham all loved the black man and wanted him to be free and equal, and save the union and stuff.!"
All I can say is get a grip ya whiners!

The only thing the war settled was as historian Jeffrey Rogers Hummel said in his book, Emancipating Slaves, Enslaving Free Men, "The Civil War represents the simultaneous culmination and repudiation of the American Revolution", ...as a revolutionary right, the legitimacy of secession is universal and unconditional. That is how the Declaration of Independence reads. "Put simply", agrees William Appleman Williams, "the cause of the Civil War was a refusal of Lincoln and other northerners to honor the revolutionary right of self determination—the touchstone of the American Revolution".
[Jeffrey Rogers Hummel - Emancipating Slaves, Enslaving Free Men Page 351]

On the subject of the War to Prevent Southern Independence", If you are actually interested in the true historical record instead of the pre-packaged synthetic nonsense that is sold as history to promote this or that political agenda, then the debate will quickly devolve to schoolyard name-calling, "Neo-Confederate" will surely pop up as one. It's the equivalent of calling someone a "deplorable".
It's idiotic of course, even though there are secessionist movements of various types today in the U.S. today, I know of not one that is proposing the rebirth of the Confederate States of America.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._White. Look it up here's you constitutional answer.

so... in your mind they were not traitors? they were not the enemy? what do you call those fighting a war against the US from inside the US? Since when does support for ones Country against an enemy waging war on its soil require "imperial conditioning" ? Most of us refer to that as Patriotisms...

Riiiiiiight....

Traitors to what? Due to irreconcilable differences, they voted to secede peacefully and formed a sovereign republic which was their right if you believe in the Principles of '76. Of course, you don't really do you? They defended those principles and the original Constitution, adopting it as their own with some marked improvements. You see it wasn't inside the US anymore.

It was Lincoln who goaded them by stalling and refusing to leave the forts on their land. He even refused to hear any offers to buy them.
Fort Sumter was not just a fort, but a very important tariff collection point before secession. Lincoln stalled and lied like the corporate lawyer he was, his greed for his revenue was his paramount desire and clouded his thinking.
“If I do that, what would become of my revenue? I might as well shut up housekeeping at once!”, Lincoln said in response to the suggestion by the Virginian Commissioners to abandon the custom house of Fort Sumter. Housekeeping is a euphemism for federal spending, in other words, taxing consumers to subsidize special interests, or what we would call today, corporate welfare.” That was Lincoln's specialty in his life as an attorney.

All his scheming and doubletalk to lure the states back into the Union and return his revenue failed. It was understandable why many of his contemporaries didn't trust him. Contrary to modern myth, Lincoln wasn't a popular guy in his time.
https://www.battlefields.org/learn/articles/evidence-unpopular-mr-lincoln

Lincoln's decision was to reinforce and resupply Fort Sumter even though he was advised that it would be viewed as a double-cross and an act of war since Secretary of State William H. Seward had assured Confederate envoys that the fort was going to be abandoned. Seward rejected the idea of resupplying the fort but Lincoln decided against his advice and do it anyway. The resupply fleet was Lincoln's first open act of aggression against the Confederacy which resulted in retaliation of cannon fire in which one horse was killed.

Who invaded who? The war didn't start until Lincoln called for 75,000 volunteer troops to invade the Confederate States. I think you got who was waging war on whose soil confused. I suppose those Confederate troops weren't being patriots for defending their homes from an invading force?

You never heard any of this during your imperial conditioning?

well africans enslaved other africans and sold others plus black on black violence so slavery and cops killing blacks really are pretty much ok.



And the civil war had nothing to do with slavery.... it was about being able to wear tshirts without a bra

Finally, your most articulate post. Which of course is a very low bar.

**** = B a s t a r d flags

Labor cost for cotton have gone way up over the last few centuries

At least we never went to war over it

That deek put a lot of people out of business. A lot of good people who loved their jobs so much they refused pay. Many are still out of work.

They DID. That whole unrelated war thing screwed it up fir a lot of them.

It was just their loving way of saying thank you.

I knew you'd say that. It's a programmed response you learned during your imperial conditioning.
I know the neocon/leftist mind f**k well, never debate the actual facts in the historical record, just accuse the other party of having a ridiculous spin on history, accuse them of "revisionism", which arouses incredulity in the minds of the easily duped.
Naturally, there is always the usual name-calling if you choose, say they must be pro slaverrrry!, call them neo-confederates, and of course wait for it...THEY ARE LIKE HITLER!

BTW...Hitler was a Lincoln fanboy. In Mein Kampf Hitler echoed Lincoln's rediculous view on the American founding: "[T]he individual states of the American Union . . . could not have possessed any state sovereignty of their own. For it was not these states that formed the Union, on the contrary, it was the Union which formed a great part of such so-called states."

Why wouldn't Hilter have the same views? He was for centralizing power at the center like Lincoln, he said, "the cry for the elimination of centralization is really nothing more than a party machination without any serious thought behind it" and reveals "the inner hypocrisy of these so-called federalistic circles. The federative state idea, like religion in part, is only an instrument for their often unclean party interests"

Lincoln said the same thing in his revisionist history of the founding in his First Inaugural Address, "The Union is much older than the Constitution. It was formed in fact, by the Articles of Association in 1774. It was matured and continued by the Declaration of Independence in 1776. It was further matured and the faith of all the then thirteen States expressly plighted and engaged that it should be perpetual, by the Articles of Confederation in 1778. And finally, in 1787, one of the declared objects for ordaining and establishing the Constitution, was "to form a more perfect Union." But if [the] destruction of the Union, by one, or by a part only, of the States, be lawfully possible, the Union is less perfect than before the Constitution, having lost the vital element of perpetuity."

Imagine that, the Union was older than the states, the sovereign parties who in fact formed the constitutional compact. Crazy stuff!
I think the founding generation would be shocked that someone later would say, they the states decided that a more perfect Union would be perpetual, an unbreakable suicide pact. That's nothing like what they agreed upon at the Constitutional Conventions.

No, Hitler is all yours, the nationalist proponents of empire.

Sorry RayR , I would rather celebrate the good things of this Union, instead of living in the past.

But we all learn from the mistakes of the past or just replace them with new ones... Wisdom is the principal thing.

drglnc you will find many in here argue with youtube videos and regurgitate blogs etc rather than with their own original thoughts. And they want you to argue with their youtube videos and blog posts. Then they will respond with youtube videos and blogs rinse and repeat. It is because they can not argue with original thought and do not have the ability for a fluent discussion on their own. Just the way it is.

Wisdom isn't elusive, accepting it is.

Or January 6

Like progressivism.