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Cuban Cigars
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smithbw Offline
#1 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 9:35 AM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
Greetings All,

The cuban cigars are simply "Not" the best made cigars, nor the best tasting. I am fortunate that I live in Germany, recently moved her for a better job and can purchase them without fear!

But to be honest they are "Not All That"!

My absolute favorite smoke is Macanudo Maduro - All Sizes and Shapes. Now that is a great even smoke every time!

So, without rambling (Anymore) let me make my point. Don't fret if you have never smoked a Cuban! Enjoy the great easy to acquire smokes!

Regards to All,

BSmith
Slimboli Offline
#2 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 9:47 AM EST
Joined: 07-09-2000
Posts: 16,139
Sorry BSmith ... but Macanudo says it all ... ;-)
smithbw Offline
#3 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 9:56 AM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
I knew that I was going to take some heat for posting the message. But I stick by the Macanudo for the Consistency.

Can you say that about the Cubans???

:-)
SteveS Offline
#4 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 10:17 AM EST
Joined: 01-13-2002
Posts: 8,751
Mr smithbw ...

IMO, it is your prerogative to stick by Macanudo for ANY reason that you deem sufficient for YOU ... what I or others may find worth sticking by has no bearing on your taste, just as your findings don't necessarily bear on ours ... it is apparent from his remark that Slim does not share your fondness for Macanudo's and I must be frank in saying that I tend to agree with him, but the fact that Macanudo sells a great many cigars is proof that there are any number of those who agree with you.

There are cigars which I like that others don't care for and there are some they like that I find unacceptable ... one among the regular posters here openly admits to enjoing Lone Wolfs and he takes much teasing for his admission, but still, his taste is just that ... his.

Bottom line is that I also agree with your original premise ... Cubans are a sort of Holy Grail for cigar smokers that are in many instances overrated ... there are a great many very enjoyable and satisfactory brands of cigars that one may legally smoke.
cliffie3d Offline
#5 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 10:33 AM EST
Joined: 07-17-2002
Posts: 297
I'll step up and say "ditto" on the Mad Macs - they really are nice, smooth cigars with rich maduro taste.
Charlie Offline
#6 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 10:56 AM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
Not to cross swords with Slim, but I agree with you on the consistency of Macanudos, they just don't have enough "kick" for me! However, I respect your opinion and will say that I happen to like Onyx Reserves, Excaliburs, Padrons, CAO's to name a few! Some of us are much to judgemental and think we have the final opinion on everything, and I happen not to be in that group! Enjoy your Macs and enjoy Germany.

Charlie
GetYourOwn Offline
#7 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 12:35 PM EST
Joined: 04-05-2002
Posts: 734
I had smoked cigars for two years(including macanudo, punch, AF, etc) before I tried a Cuban Cohiba. While I was smoking it I said to myself "so this is what a cigar is supposed to taste like". Since then I have tried many cubans and some of them are not very good. But my favorite ones have that cuban taste.

As far as consistancy goes. I am not a judge of that. Maybe I am unusual but I do not have a "regular" cigar. I rarely smoke the same cigar twice in a row. I have 5 different types to choose from and I mix in odd singles.
Slimboli Offline
#8 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 1:38 PM EST
Joined: 07-09-2000
Posts: 16,139
Charlie --- consistancy?!? Every one I've tried so far is like smoking a 'broomstick' ... not once could I draw smoke through without a major struggle. And I agree on the body ... way too mild and one dimensional for my tastes.

Is there anything to all this fuss about Cuban cigars?

Absolutely! I used to think that the Cuban mystique was a combination of great marketing and nostalgia, until I smoked my first, a Montecristo #4 gifted to me by Rookie139.

I didn't pay a lot of attention to it at first, but as soon as it reached my lips ... even before lighting it ... the taste was marvelous and the scent of the perfectly cured tobacco was a revelation.

When I lit it up I literally had to sit down on my deck chair, in order to concentrate fully on the cigar. The taste was unmistakably unique from any 'domestic' cigar I had ever smoked. One that I can't describe ... but could tell was different. And then there is the trademark tingling of the lips and tounge, slight light-headedness and the relaxing in the afterglow ... that only a good Cuban cigar can promise.

Don't get me wrong. Not all Cubans are great, either. Many just plain 'suck'. But once you get a good one, you will know exactly what I'm talking about. On the other side of the coin, I've had many cigars from Nicaragua, Dominican Republic and Honduras that I like even better than many ISOM's, and think are far superior ...

But if we're going to talk about consistancy ... I don't care what cigar you are smoking, once that batch (crop) of leaves are gone, they are gone, never to be seen again. Sure ... if the factory has seasoned rollers, the construction will be the same ... but the taste will not. Oh, it will be close ... but not the same.

If you don't believe me ... get a first release Anejo 55 and the new Reserva Xtra Viejo (which is really the 55 in it's second release), and smoke them side by side. You can definately tell they are not from the same release ...
calavera Offline
#9 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 2:05 PM EST
Joined: 01-26-2002
Posts: 1,868
I have to say that some of the best cigars that I have ever smoked have been Cuban. The greatest smoke that I have ever had was a Partagas Serie D No 4, and now that I think about it, every one of these that I have ever had has been great. There just aren't very many non-Cuban cigars that can compare to Cubans. As a matter of fact, I am going to smoke a Bolivar Belicoso Fino right now to celebrate my birthday.
xrundog Offline
#10 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 2:10 PM EST
Joined: 01-17-2002
Posts: 2,212
Well.....Happy Birthday!
jjohnson28 Offline
#11 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 2:10 PM EST
Joined: 09-12-2000
Posts: 7,914
Happy Birthday calavera! I'll smoke one tonight as well. I don't care if you smoke Macs,I don't care if you smoke Cubans. Smoke what you like!
GetYourOwn Offline
#12 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 2:16 PM EST
Joined: 04-05-2002
Posts: 734
I'm with Slim. The taste the good ones have. Cant describe it but know it and like it.

Happy B-day dude.
rookie139 Offline
#13 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 2:32 PM EST
Joined: 03-02-2000
Posts: 2,149
Ditto on the Part SD #4...I've never had one that wasn't excellent!..I personally can't stand Macs..Ugh...I agree that Habanos aren't as consistent as cigars from Nicaragua and Honduras, but in my list of the top five cigars I've ever had in my five years of experience, every one of them are ISOMS..Here's my list:
1) Part SD #4
2) Saint Luis Rey Regios
3) Bolivar Belicoso Finos
4) R&J Celestiales Finos
5) Cohiba Siglo IIs
Other notable mentions are Partagas SHorts (simply the most consistent Habano I've had..every one of them are excellent!), Montecristo #4s (can be somewhat plugged at times..dependable flavor though), H. Upmann #2 (I've only had two or three and loved every one of them!).
Keith
FINMANDAN Offline
#14 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 3:11 PM EST
Joined: 09-02-2002
Posts: 42
FINMANDAN Offline
#15 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 3:19 PM EST
Joined: 09-02-2002
Posts: 42
While I am of the opinion that a Mac is better than no cigar at all (even a Lone Wolf!) it is a pretty bland piece of work.

On the other hand the No. 4 IMHO is a power-house of a cigar a true master piece and one of the top sticks known to man. (:>))
barryneedleman Offline
#16 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 3:41 PM EST
Joined: 08-23-2000
Posts: 1,689
IMO tobacco from different countries have "base" flavors that are unique. Many people really enjoy the
flavor(s) of Cuban cigars (me included). That said, many Cuban cigars constructed in recent years have had problems (construction, inferior tobacco, released too young, etc.). It looks as if they have mitigated these problems with current releases. That said, I enjoy many of the cigars from Nicaragua, Honduras and the Dominican Republic. There are many great cigars being made in the world today. If the flavor profile of the Macanudo is your cup of tea, great, what I like is different.

Barry
eze Offline
#17 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 3:51 PM EST
Joined: 09-04-2002
Posts: 1,748
Although personal tastes are for the most part subjective I find it laughable to hold a Mac. Maduro to such lofty standards. I agree with a previous post regarding the Partagas Series D #4. True..there are cubans that are sub-par, and keep in mind, quite a few counterfeits running amok out there. IMO, the Macs are a brand that is consistantly overreated and I can think of at least 2 dozen other non-cubans I would purchase instead. But....what the hell do I know!!
tailgater Offline
#18 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 5:55 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
What's a Macanudo?
Todog Offline
#19 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 6:10 PM EST
Joined: 05-05-2001
Posts: 804
Isn't that a dance that they do at weddings?
rayder1 Offline
#20 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 9:59 PM EST
Joined: 06-02-2002
Posts: 2,226
I'm amazed at the consistancy of Macs. They seem to manage to bridge the gap from crop to crop and maintain the distinct flavor they have. Not my favorite. I have acquired a more diverse taste. But I never turn down an offerred Mac.

IMHO:
They are quite mild (of course) and not a bad smoke when I don't want to power up on a particular day or occasion. My smoke hating spouse doesn't dislike the smell either (too much).

Not my every day, but in my taste, not a dog rocket either.
smithbw Offline
#21 Posted: Wed, Sep 25 2002, 10:17 PM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
I shall not try to defend my position because I am not capable of rating any cigars. I am a novice smoker by most people’s standards. I have only been smoking cigars for 3 years and smoke 2 to 4 daily.

The intent of my initial message was to dispel myths surrounding the Holy Cuban cigar(s). I was really excited about moving here to Germany to enjoy the Cuban but found out that it is not at all that great, in fact most of the Cubans that I have smoked are good but not great As stated previously I have a short list of Cubans that I have tried:

Romeo y Julieta Robusto Maduro
Montecristo #4
Montecristo #2
Partagas Serie D No.4
PartagasCoronas
Bolivar Coronas
Cohiba Robusto
H. Upmann Coronas
La Gloria Cubana Medaille D' Or 2

I realize that this is not a lengthy list and there are numerous Cubans that I have not tried but for my money and for my taste it is Mac.

My decision is based upon the last 6 months of smoking “Multiple Cubans Daily”! I will say that the Bolivar is a “Great Smoke”. Of course I am quick to point out that this is my opinion and everyone know what they say about opinions – Everyone’s got one! Just like everyone has a different taste.

Bottom Line: Life is too short not to enjoy the cigar (Regardless of Brand or style) that makes you happy!

Happy Birthday calavera !

BSmith
5augie5 Offline
#22 Posted: Thu, Sep 26 2002, 4:24 AM EST
Joined: 12-02-1999
Posts: 165
Beware Smithbrow,

Even in Germany, there are too many conterfits on the market. I've had Cubans given to me that I am sure are not the real McCoy, some were downright bad.

I smoked my first Cuban 25 years ago on my honeymoon in Bermuda, and it was a relevation. The true measure of a great cigar still passes through Habana. I do agree that there are many outstanding cigars to choose from here in the states (Padron Anniv. my fav.) but it still doesn't compare to a Monte #2 IMHO.
cliffie3d Offline
#23 Posted: Thu, Sep 26 2002, 4:47 AM EST
Joined: 07-17-2002
Posts: 297
LMAO at Todog!
Hey, guys, I'm not a Macanudo guy, either, except the maduros IMO are not a typical bland cigar. And I typically go for a stronger smoke. Mac Maduros are not strong, but they've got a good flavor.
I'm not big on buying Cubans because I'm not big on spending lots of money, but the few I've had were some of my best cigar experiences. Sancho Panza belicoso and Diplomaticos #2 - I was in perfect peace.
Slimboli Offline
#24 Posted: Thu, Sep 26 2002, 6:16 AM EST
Joined: 07-09-2000
Posts: 16,139
I think the key here, is to get the genuine article ... and you've got to remember that 90-95% of the Cuban cigars out there are counterfeit.
smithbw Offline
#25 Posted: Fri, Sep 27 2002, 8:26 AM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
Thank you all for your concern. I can honestly say that the cubans that I purchase and have smoked are:

Genuine, Genuine, Genuine!

I think that I will upload a picture of two of the "Real Cubans" which are calmly residing in the humi.

I buy them by the box which has the Republica De Cuba Green Label and the Habanos band. Inside the box comes the certificate of authenticity. The wrappers around the cigars all state Habanos. The box is numbered and says on the bottom: Habanos Hecho En Cuba Totalmento a Mano. Futhermore, my supplier is truly reliable - It is the Canadian Government. Therefore, more authentic you simply cannot get.

I will admit that the Cuban cigars that my wife bought for me today are "Remarkable" - Romeo Y Julieta No. 3. Wow! Now that is a cigar...Now that is a cigar but for a price!!!!

Still a MAC man...

Regards,

BSmith
Slimboli Offline
#26 Posted: Fri, Sep 27 2002, 8:47 AM EST
Joined: 07-09-2000
Posts: 16,139
You said, "... my supplier is truly reliable - It is the Canadian Government."

I'm not saying that what you've smoked isn't the real deal, but I hate to break this to you ... Canada is one of the countries known to be rampant with counterfeits.

In an article I just looked up on the internet, this is what I found ...

The most popular, and expensive, of the cigars are Cuban and the growing demand for Cuban product has created a flood of phony cigars. Some police estimates say 80 per cent of the Cuban cigars sold in Canada are fakes. And what passes as tobacco in some of these cigars would make the most dedicated puffer think twice.
smithbw Offline
#27 Posted: Fri, Sep 27 2002, 8:52 AM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
Slim,

Thanks for the advice. I am going to ask the Canadians about that one...and change to the British Government for the Cubans.

Regards,

BSmith :)
Slimboli Offline
#28 Posted: Fri, Sep 27 2002, 8:59 AM EST
Joined: 07-09-2000
Posts: 16,139
England is a great place to get Cuban Cigars, especially at reputable places like the one that is supplied by the famous 200 year old importers 'Hunters & Frankau'.
jmgiovi Offline
#29 Posted: Fri, Sep 27 2002, 11:52 AM EST
Joined: 09-10-2002
Posts: 20
Some observations about Cuban's:
1)Quality has fluctuated during the past 10 years due to supply/demand issues. This is where some of the crap cubans come from.
2)Counterfeits are common. The worst "Cohiba" I ever smoked was from Canada. I think some of the "fluctuation in quality" in cubans is due to counterfeits.
3)Many Cuban brands stink.
4)Cuban rollers tend to be excellent.
5)There are many excellent Cuban brands.
6)Smoker's tastes change over time. What is enjoyable may become boreing. What is nasty and nauseating may become sublime. If you enjoyed the cigar it was a good cigar.
7)That being said there are technical qualities of a cigar which can be described as "good" or "bad" regardless of how much an individual likes a cigar.
8)Time in a humidor improves cigars and can turn a real dog into a very smokable cigar.
9)Smoke what you like...and experiment often.

Just IMHO.

Jim
smithbw Offline
#30 Posted: Fri, Sep 27 2002, 11:07 PM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
Jim,

Thanks for your wonderful thoughts.

I purchased a box of Cuban's from the British store today. The exact some box that I purchased from the Canadian's yeterday - Romeo Juliet.

Let the comparision begin.

Best Regards,


BSmith
cliffie3d Offline
#31 Posted: Tue, Oct 1 2002, 8:35 AM EST
Joined: 07-17-2002
Posts: 297
There was some talk earlier on this thread about Macanudo Maduros. I decided to see if I still had the same opinion on these - Saturday night I smoked a big Prince Phillip with a couple years age, and it was really nice! I highly recommend Mac Maduros to anyone starting out with maduros. Great maduro flavor but without a big spicy kick.
jmgiovi Offline
#32 Posted: Tue, Oct 1 2002, 8:50 AM EST
Joined: 09-10-2002
Posts: 20
I agree on the Mac maduros. Much better than the regular Macs (not that I find Macs bad, just not great, kinda bland). Even burn, decent draw, some intersting tastes. All in all a good cigar. Not great. I don't look forward to them when I'm at work. But I'll trade five Lone Wolves for one Mac Mad.

Jim
smithbw Offline
#33 Posted: Tue, Oct 1 2002, 8:55 AM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
It is good to see some Maduro MAC supporters. However, I must be honest. I smoked a Romeo Juliet Number 3 today which I purchased from the "Brithish" store and found it to be remarkable. I cannot afford to smoke Cubans everyday but I think that I have found one of the best cigars in the world. Absolutely Amazing!

Although I really like the Romeo - I will never give up the MACS...

Regards to all,

BSmith

Biblitized Offline
#34 Posted: Fri, Oct 4 2002, 7:36 AM EST
Joined: 10-02-2002
Posts: 3
I'm going to agree with the philosophy that Mac's are bland and powerless. I will also agree that there are some other Cigars easily bought in the states, not cuban, that are better than cigars from Cuba. HOwever, I also agree with the statement about Cuban Cigars and their distinct nature. Just something about them...however recently I had been quite dissappointed to smoke a Cohiba Esplendido that had a great opening smell, a delicious flavor and tingle to the tongue and lips, but took my entire being to get the smoke from one end of the cigar to the other. Was a realy bummer because the light-headedness came from hyperventalation rather than a good jolt of supreme tabacco. There are never any guarantees. '

I would like to state for the record that the ACID line of Drew Estate cigars is a fine collection of several very unique and very pleasureful cigars.
Charlie Offline
#35 Posted: Fri, Oct 4 2002, 8:43 AM EST
Joined: 06-16-2002
Posts: 39,751
This is a most interesting thread, filled with the expected amount of snobbery when it comes to someone that likes Macanudo's! Veteran Cigar buffs are "epected" to frown when Macanudo is mentioned, and say "who smokes those"? Well, they happen to be the number one selling cigar in America, so somebody must smoke them! I used to smoke them, but moved on to fuller bodied more robust cigars! I was shocked to smoke a Macanudo Robust Hyde Park at a friend's house and find that it was a full flavored gem! Now, will I buy them.........no, not a Macanudo prices! I can buy a lot of cigars that I like one hell of a lot more for the same price or less! However, I do not stick my nose up or show a look of horror when someone smokes Macanudo!

Charlie
rookie139 Offline
#36 Posted: Sat, Oct 5 2002, 2:35 AM EST
Joined: 03-02-2000
Posts: 2,149
Biblicized, I agree with the "unique" part re: Lars and Drew Estates..."Very pleasurable" is debatable IMHO ;)
rookie139 Offline
#37 Posted: Sat, Oct 5 2002, 2:45 AM EST
Joined: 03-02-2000
Posts: 2,149
I have to say...When I hear people say that they smoke cigars, and when I ask them what cigars they smoke, some of them (my brother does this) says emphatically, "I smoke Macanudos!", like I'm supposed to be impressed and think of them as a cigar aficionado..Please don't get me wrong, I'm not knocking anyone here at all for what they smoke...My brother smokes just to smoke, for social reasons..not to enjoy the cigar but just to keep his mouth occupied (man that really doesnt sound good, does it?..LOL)...Macs seem to be the cigar of choice for those that only smoke cigars on bowling night, at a bar, or playing poker (which tonite I am playing poker with my brother and his friends, all of whom fit this profile to the T)...Tonite, I intend on bringing for them every Lone Wolf, Mac, and every other bland mild tasteless cigar I can find...I on the other hand (call me a cigar snob..My wife does) will be enjoying an Oliva O Ole, a Joya De Nic Antano (I've been waiting to enjoy this one) and maybe a CAO Brazilia Gol...I would enjoy a nice Habano but I like to save them for special occasions (Lately though, I've been discovering a lot of "special occasions" to enjoy them)
Last night, I enjoyed a Coh Siglo III (good but not excellent) and afterward enjoyed a wonderful Bolivar Beli Fino...The special occasion last night was "Watching TV at home"
Gotta go to sleep finally!
Keith
rookie139 Offline
#38 Posted: Sat, Oct 5 2002, 2:48 AM EST
Joined: 03-02-2000
Posts: 2,149
and I gotta add, occasionally (about once a year), if I happen to have a Mac Maduro that has been gifted, I'll smoke it...I just wouldn't spend money on them myself...As someone else said earlier (Charlie, right?) I can think of so many other cigars that I'd rather spend the money on
CJBully Offline
#39 Posted: Sat, Oct 5 2002, 4:23 AM EST
Joined: 07-31-2002
Posts: 753
damn rook!

a siglo and than a boli? mmm mmm good...
SteveS Offline
#40 Posted: Sat, Oct 5 2002, 6:18 AM EST
Joined: 01-13-2002
Posts: 8,751
Some time back when I first tried premium cigars, I was full of questions ... newbie stuff like 'is this a good cigar?', 'do you think I'll like that?', etc ... the store owner told me, hey ... everyone's got different taste ... that's why there's so many kinds of cigars ... try a lot of different ones, all of 'em if you want, but the most important thing about cigar smoking is to remember what you like and what you don't ... then buy more of what you like and smoke those ...

I gotta tell you that until I saw this thread, I did not realize there was any stigma attatched to Macanudos ... I've tried them, found I didn't care for them, don't buy 'em, and don't smoke 'em ... no ones ever given me one, but if they did, I'd keep it for either my wife whose taste in an occasional cigar runs toward what I would call mild and bland or for my indiscriminate next door neighbor who'll smoke anything to go with his boxed wine ...

But there's a lot of other brands I don't like much either ... I don't think there's anything wrong with someone who DOES like them, I just think their taste is different than mine is ... a good example of that is the Excalibur 1066 ... to a lot of guys, many of whom post here, these are one great smoke ... to me, they taste about as great as lawn clippings rolled in a dead leaf from the fruitless mulberry tree in my yard ... so, just like the Macs, I don't buy 'em, I don't smoke 'em and if someone gave me one, I wouldn't be upset and I wouldn't complain ... I'd just see what MrsS or the guy next door had to say about it ... one or both would like it fine and that's OK ... it's just a matter of individual taste .. works the same way in restaurants too ... if cucumbers arrive on my salad, they are gifted to MrsS ... is that canteloupe in the fruit salad? ... 'nother gift for Mrs ...

there's nothing wrong with someone who likes cucumbers, canteloupes, Macanudos or 1066s ... it just ain't me

smithbw Offline
#41 Posted: Sat, Oct 5 2002, 11:12 AM EST
Joined: 09-01-2001
Posts: 2,444
Okay, so here is where I have determined with the comparisons. Not that anyone really cares because I see that everyone has different tastes and their minds are made up on this subject and it appears that my simple thoughts will not sway a person nor are they designed to. :- )

The (Cuban) Romeo Juliet really is a better than average smoke. Here is what I found out about the cigar: It was firm full bodied and had a smooth even draw. A number of distinctive, good flavors and tastes came through the cigar. It had its own dominate flavor. If I had to describe the dominate flavor I would say it was almost nutty. The smoke white ash was consistent. At the back end it burned my tongue and had an earthy taste. Not the flavor that I tend to enjoy.

With all of this said – I continue to enjoy the Macanudo Maduro which in one word was Awesome. My taste!!

Summary: While Slim was right about the Canadian VS British store comparison. The British store’s Cubans are much better. I still prefer the Maduro MAC over the Romeo Juliet Number 3.

I will smoke the (Cuban) Bolivar this weekend while watching the (single) football game that I will be able to see here in Germany and make a comparison there too.

Steve – I am mailing you a surprise first thing Monday. It will not be any of the cigars mentioned here today. :-)

Regards,


BSmith
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