opelmanta1900
9 years ago
MACS:Police officers are 18 times more likely to be killed by a black man than they are to kill an unarmed black man.

VICTOR:ok, is that number higher or lower than the other races, or than the national average across races?



out of curiousity, in your mind Victor, what would it change about the above statistic if Police officers were 2 times more likely to be killed by a white man than they are to kill an unarmed white man?

what would it change about the above statistic if Police officers were 20 times more likely to be killed by a white man than they are to kill an unarmed white man?

and what would it change about the above statistic if Police officers were 200 times more likely to be killed by a white man than they are to kill an unarmed white man?



I've crunched the numbers a few times, a few different ways, and it turns out (unless you learned something different in Stat than I did) Police officers are still 18 times more likely to be killed by a black man than they are to kill an unarmed black man, no matter what number I plug into the stat on white people... Maybe I need to run one on Mexicans and Asians... you think that would change the number Victor? Or the meaning of that number? Or the reality of that number?


I know you're not an fool Victor, but it's a fools way to reject available data because other data that you want isn't available... you may not like what the data says, you may not like what people are trying to say with the data, but the data is either accurate or inaccurate, and that should be the issue...
victor809
9 years ago
Opel. When you compare two pieces of data, you have to have a reason. The temperature in Atlanta and the number of rows of bricks in the Washington monument are both valid pieces of data, but you only relate them to each other if there's a meaningful connection. That connection has to come from the theme of your argument.

The "cops are 18 times more likely to be killed by a black man than a black man shot by the cops" data point is implicitly suggesting a theme of "cops need to be worried about being shot by black men". However, the data being provided is incomplete. From that number all we can say is "cops get killed by black men more than they shoot black men, however we don't know if they get shot by black men more often than they get shot by white men or Asian men or by raccoons for that matter, cops may be safest around black men, but we weren't bothered to check because we stopped at a number that sounded scary"... They left out the rest of the narrative I included, because they didn't want you to follow their inner monologue.

You're right, it's a valid number (we'll, as I said earlier it doesn't actually pass a sniff test for 2014,but maybe she was using a compilation of other years which were worse) but the data is being used to make suggestions which it doesn't provide complete information for.
tonygraz
9 years ago

I got an A in Statics... does that count..?? 😕

DrafterX wrote:



Only if your barber charges you more than others.
opelmanta1900
9 years ago

Opel. When you compare two pieces of data, you have to have a reason. The temperature in Atlanta and the number of rows of bricks in the Washington monument are both valid pieces of data, but you only relate them to each other if there's a meaningful connection. That connection has to come from the theme of your argument.

The "cops are 18 times more likely to be killed by a black man than a black man shot by the cops" data point is implicitly suggesting a theme of "cops need to be worried about being shot by black men". However, the data being provided is incomplete. From that number all we can say is "cops get killed by black men more than they shoot black men, however we don't know if they get shot by black men more often than they get shot by white men or Asian men or by raccoons for that matter, cops may be safest around black men, but we weren't bothered to check because we stopped at a number that sounded scary"... They left out the rest of the narrative I included, because they didn't want you to follow their inner monologue.

You're right, it's a valid number (we'll, as I said earlier it doesn't actually pass a sniff test for 2014,but maybe she was using a compilation of other years which were worse) but the data is being used to make suggestions which it doesn't provide complete information for.

victor809 wrote:



Actually, you're trying to make the data suggest something it isn't trying to suggest on it's own...

the statement "cops are 18 times more likely to be killed by a black man than a black man shot by the cops", is not attempting to compare the probability of a cop being shot by a black man vs. a white man or any other color of man... that's you trying to do that...

the only thing the data seems to suggest is that police officers are 18 times more justified in fearing black men than black men are in fearing police officers...

If the study was done with any other race, I'm sure the result would still be that "police officers are x amount of times more justified in fearing y colored men than y colored men are in fearing police officers"...

It doesn't make any of the data incomplete... it's just not sufficient data to use when trying to say what you're saying the data is trying to say... but it isn't saying that...
banderl
9 years ago

Interesting FBI statistic about 'police brutality'. Police officers are 18 times more likely to be killed by a black man than they are to kill an unarmed black man.

MACS wrote:




You guys can argue about this all that you'd like but notice the bold part of this post.
Obviously, the vast majority of black men are armed while interacting with the police..
Abrignac
9 years ago
One can make statistics say pretty much anything they want them to say depending upon how the data sets are interpreted. At the end of the day, its nothing more than a tiger chasing its tail. The only stat that's relevant in this discussion is that 98.2% of those bundles of daisy fertilizer fought the law and the law won.
DrafterX
9 years ago

Only if your barber charges you more than others.

tonygraz wrote:




no idea what that is suppose to mean... 😟
opelmanta1900
9 years ago
I think it was a pole joke...
DrMaddVibe
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