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DrafterX
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#81

I remember some discussions about Saddam may be sheltering ole Bin.. but that wasn't why we went in... We gave Saddam like 90 days or somethin to comply with the Nuke inspectors and he refused... so other than pull an Obama, Bush bombed the chit out out of the place... Saddam still wouldn't comply so we bombed some more... He coulda stopped it at any time... 😟

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#82

DrafterX wrote:

so we won that one! Musta been when the peoples were throwing roses at the feet of our soldiers...RIIIIIGHT!

Here's the odd part, I agreed with the right views at the time to stay out. We had and still have our choice of brutal dictatorships to meddle with and overthrow, and it never works out. Plus, we are very (business) selective where we get involved, it's not really about freedom.

As it was, several of the dictators became established with our support, including the anti-communist Saddam. And Saddam was contained prior to the Bush administration and...

I can't believe I'm having to write this a decade later.

Too boring, folks can dig up facts that support what they want to be true. Not interested in this fight anymore.

DrafterX
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#83

Ya, we had some good ones here over this... 🤣

Pretty sure I was right tho... 😟

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#84

Ya, we had some good ones here over this... 🤣

Pretty sure I was right tho... 😟

DrafterX wrote:

could be. i really don't remember what either of us said.

DrafterX
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#85

I didn't mean you and I... just discussions in general... it was a bad deal all around. .. and I wish we didn't have had to go in... 😟

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#86

I didn't mean you and I... just discussions in general... it was a bad deal all around. .. and I wish we didn't have had to go in... 😟

DrafterX wrote:

I'll agree again

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#87

I wasn't involved then...so...Bush lied...American soldiers died...so there...betcha nobody ever said that...

MACS
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#88

He didn't lie. He relied on bad reports from the intelligence comunity, analysts, and not just ours. France, Germany, Russia... and both sides of congress supported it. These were folks who, after 9/11, did NOT want to underestimate terrorists any more.

So the Bush lied, people died rhetoric is complete BS. He did make mistakes based on some bad information, but it isn't like the information came only from us. It didn't. And as I've said... Saddam had plenty of time to move his chemical weapons to Syria. Where'd they get that sh*t they just used?? Yeah.

So to say he deliberately lied to go to war is completely false and patently partisan.

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#89

Syria might have been supplied by Russia, Iran, or developed themselves in recent years.

I'd have doubts, though far from certain, that Saddam could have moved much out of his country during the no-fly-zone years. His borders were pretty locked...until he was run out.

DrafterX
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#90

I specifically remember trucks going to Syria at one time.. everyone thought it could have been the WMDs.. you'd think somebody woulda known for sure.. don't know if we had authority to interfer at that time... 😟

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#91

that does sound familiar

tonygraz
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#92

Mac's loves yellow cake and forgets that some cigars come in aluminum tubes.

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#93

MACS wrote:

There are many reliable reports from the intelligence community that VP Cheney, a former head of the CIA, and with plenty of clout in the intelligence world, manipulated and falsified intel supporting the WMD in Iraq argument from US and European sources. Look up "the Italian letter+Iraq's WMD". French and German intel also couldn't find sources to support that claim.

There are reliable and ignored exculpatory evidence, as indicated by the outing of a CIA agent operating in Niger, Valerie Plame, who denied the WH claim that Iraq's yellow cake was originating there.

Internal documents from neo-con think tanks, whose members included Cheney and many of Bush's trusted senior advisers, that were produced before and near the beginning of GWB's first term, and before 9/11, were waiting for a reason to go to war in the Middle East, to establish more friendly pro-West governments (regime change). to provide a safer environment for Israel, and to establish a reliable source of fossil fuels, in that order.

...so blame it on the black guy for lying...didn't Gen. Powell make the case for going to war in Iraq in a speech to the UN?

edit: for an honest and un-biased assessment of US and British intelligence reports leading up to the War in Iraq, see the Center for Strategic and International Studies, widely considered a neutral and thorough source.

https://csis-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/legacy_files/files/media/csis/pubs/040126_wmdintelllesmainrpt.pdf

Edited by user 9 years ago | Reason: Not specified

DrafterX
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#94

Prolly fake news.... 😟

Burner02
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#95

Guess those that served are to stupid to understand anything about world events in the past 30 plus years.

tonygraz
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#96

Did you plagiarize that from a Trump speech ? Maybe the I know more than the generals one ?

Edited by user 9 years ago | Reason: Not specified

DrafterX
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#97

More fake news... 😟

Burner02
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#98

Did you plagiarize that from a Trump speech ? Maybe the I know more than the generals one ?

tonygraz wrote:

On my worst day I have a much better handle on the situation than you ever dreamed of having.

And where did I ever say that I knew more than the generals. That is the on going position of the left in all arenas.

An one final thought, I'm guessing the only thing you have ever served is yourself.

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#99

Guess those that served are to stupid to understand anything about world events in the past 30 plus years.

Burner02 wrote:

One of the hallmarks, and strengths, of our military is the obedience to the chain of command and the expectation that orders will be followed. The other is a hedge our founding fathers recognized was essential for a democracy: our military is obedient to a civilian Commander in Chief, the President. Most people I know who have served in uniform are good people and many of them are very intelligent.

If the Commander in Chief declares war and directs our military to achieve his lawful objectives, our military is bound to follow through without question. Generals who have openly questioned the President do not survive. So of course, those who served will accept the rationale to go to battle, whether or not it was flawed or intentionally misleading.

That sort of loyalty to the President explains why Mattis provided cover for Trump's claim that we were sending an "armada" to Korea. When it was discovered a few days later that the armada was heading in the opposite direction, Mattis announced that a planned exercise had been cut short and the ship was headed in that direction, as ordered...

Commanders in Chief can make the best generals and admirals look bad...

Edited by user 9 years ago | Reason: Not specified

MACS
Herf-A-Holic

9 years ago

#100

Mac's loves yellow cake and forgets that some cigars come in aluminum tubes.

tonygraz wrote:

I'm not really a fan of cake. I prefer ice cream.

I HAVE some cigars in aluminum tubes.

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