Marla --

Since I seem to be the resident clergy here goes!

"My only question is: Does this apply to the Hebrew, Greek, Latin, and other language texts as well? I'd like to know the answer if someone has heard of this before or will research it. Marla"

http://www.smu.edu/bridwell/publications/ryrie_catalog/xi_3.htm .

"Ask and it will be given to you" (Matthew 7:7)

Mike Gardner (iquester)

iquester, Are you really clergy? What kind?

United Methodist... But I am pretty ecumenical -- got lots or friends in all kinds of denominations.

M Gardner

.... where's my Bobblehead Jesus ....

... I wonder is Jesus would allow Mattel to manufacture a:

U Do VooDoo Anti-Christ Bobblehead figurine ... everytime someone says they don't believe ... you could inflict some sort of misfortune on them ... better YET -

- a U Do VooDoo HumiDoo -

- every non-believer would have their smokes infested with Cigar Beetles ... face drought conditions ... excessive humidity, etc.... until they profess ...

http://www.cigarbid.com/auction/forum/forum.cfm?action=list&forumID=9&messageDisplay=0000000007311 

Marla,

Along with iquester, I'm probably one of the few seminary grads here on the boards (and in fact I work at a seminary here in southern Cal). My take on your question is to say that throughout history there have been endless attempts at numerological interpretation and dissection of the scriptures, most of which is simply a distraction from the far more engaging truth that the scriptures consistently point to: God's gracious reconciling activity with humankind. I think you may have assurance concerning God's perfect will for you by reflecting on what He has done for you already. Check out John 6:40.

All the best,

Dan

Thanks Mike and Dan!

The entire chapter 6 of John is an amazing passage...

I was thinking of going to seminary when I was about twelve years old but I guess I forgot about it by the time I was thirteen. It probably would have been interesting. I think religion is one of the most fascinating things in human culture. The fact that I don't "get it" makes it even more interesting because I keep wondering what the fuss is all about. I have the same problem with sports, I suppose I'm missing a gene or two.

I’ve helped tutor a few semenairy students in my day…

"Religion, doesnt hurt, or kill anybody. Men that cant tolerate others religious beliefs start wars, not God.

It isnt written in any religion that I know of, to kill others or start wars to expand a religious base."

Magnifide,

Maybe not exactly correct if you consider the numerous fatwas by the Islamic hierarchy ordering the death of certain individuals for some very trivial things or for being outspoken against Islam itself.

Fred

I ain't a Bible scholar but I seem to recall that those Old Testament Israelites rubbed out a bunch of peoples just because they were there and God commanded them to be rubbed out. Presumably they were slaughtered for their own good and the greater glory of God.

I once knew a man from Guatemala and when he spoke of the atrocities committed by the Spaniard conquistadors he felt that it was worthwhile in the end because along with murder, corruption and disease the Spanish missionaries brought the "One True Faith". Likewise, religion was one of the justifications for genocide against the North American Indians.

Some people say that it's religous intolerance that results in the atrocities. But Christians are commanded to be intolerant. Their "Great Commission" is to evangelise the world with their religion, not to tolerate others. And there is precious little tolerance in Islam regardless of the propaganda we read in the newspapers.

If you made a list of the things that have resulted in human mysery religion would make the top ten easily, maybe the top five right up there with disease. Read up on the Crusades sometime--makes modern warfare look like a tea party.

Why is it that non-believers get so riled up about God? Why fret something that doesn’t exist right?

For all that like to complain about religion, a key point of E-Chick’s post is,

“Psalms 118.8 (NKJV) "It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man",

Gene363

Gene -

Maybe it has something to do with every "believer" forcing their beliefs on us at every opportunity. And it could be related to how our leaders constantly mention their higher powers in the same breath as their new plans, implying that their actions are gods work.

C

Maybe they have some good points though?

1 Corinthians 14:34 - 35*

34. Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but [they are commanded] to be under obedience, as also saith the law.

35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

cwilhelmi

Thank you for your response, I do have two questions:

You said, “…every “believer” forcing their beliefs…” I can’t recall this happening much since perhaps the Spanish Inquisition, though some Moslem countries do outlaw or severely restrict non-Moslem religions. Is the mere fact that a believer might mention their belief some how forcing them to face their own doubts, or are they bent on forcing all believers to adopt their ideas?

Second, “…related to how our leaders constantly mention their higher powers…” again, if they do not believe why they are so worried?

This is an old and polarizing argument in which intelligent people blessed with common sense abandon them both. Kind of like a young liberal espousing the virtues of diversity and openness until some one mentions opposing abortion or gun control. They can’t stand that some one else has a different view of the world than them selves. This works both ways too.

"...if a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days...but if she bear a maid child, then she shall be unclean two weeks..."

Leviticus 12:2-5

I can't wait to tell my son that his mother was only unclean for one week! Thank God he wasn't born a girl!

btw, NO ONE expects The Spanish Inquisition!!

Robby - Gotta love Monty Python!!

Gene - I over spoke by saying every believer, as in most cases their are extremists on both sides that ruin it for everyone else. I have no doubts in my non-beliefs, but at the same time I'm very supportive of others having their own beliefs, I just find it disconcerting when intolerance rules.

The reason it bothers me to have leaders invoking higher powers as support of their actions is quite simple; it erroneously makes people give higher credence to their statements and proposed actions due to the religious tie-ins, as opposed to weighing the actions on their own merits and eventual consequences. I realize that not all people are so weak minded as to be influenced this easily, but I also am not so naive as to think that these religious speeches are harmless.

^^