surfish1961
Thursday, April 16, 2009 7:10:00 PM
Sorry for the c&p. A bit long but a good read.

Democrats: Texas gov should disavow secession talk

AUSTIN, Texas - In a state that once was its own nation, a Republican governor who talked about secession without completely dismissing the idea has Democratic lawmakers in an uproar.

Gov. Rick Perry, in comments following an anti-tax "tea party" Wednesday, never did advocate Texas breaking away from the United States but suggested that Texans might at some point get so fed up they would want to leave the union. That was enough to feed opinions for and against secession on Web sites, cable TV and talk radio across the nation.

At the Texas Capitol on Thursday, Rep. Jim Dunnam of Waco, joined by several fellow Texas House Democrats, said some people associate talk of secession with racial division and the Civil War and that Perry should disavow any notion of seceding.

"Talk of secession is an attack on our country. It can be nothing else. It is the ultimate anti-American statement," Dunnam said at a news conference.

State Sen. Rodney Ellis, a Houston Democrat, said that by not rejecting the possibility of secession out of hand, Perry "is taking a step down a very dangerous and divisive path encouraged by the fringe of Texas politics."

The Democrats are proposing a House resolution expressing "complete and total disagreement with any fringe element advocating the 'secession' of Texas or any other state from our one and indivisible Union."

Perry emphasized Thursday that he is not advocating secession but understands why Americans may have those feelings because of frustration with Washington, D.C. He said it's fine to express the thought. He offered no apology and did not back away from his earlier comments.

Perry's remarks Wednesday were in response to a question from The Associated Press as he walked away from the Austin rally, where some in the audience had shouted "Secede!" during his speech. The governor said he didn't think Texas should secede despite some chatter about it on the Internet and his name being associated with the idea.

"We've got a great union. There's absolutely no reason to dissolve it. But if Washington continues to thumb their nose at the American people, you know, who knows what might come out of that. But Texas is a very unique place, and we're a pretty independent lot to boot," Perry said Wednesday.

A day later, Perry said he found the fascination with the remark interesting.

"I refer people back to my statement and I got a charge out of it," he said. "I was kind of thinking that maybe the same people that hadn't been reading the Constitution right were reading that article and they got the wrong impression about what I said. Clearly I stated that we have a great union. Texas is part of a great union. And I see no reason for that to change."

Texas was a republic from 1836, when it declared independence from Mexico, to 1845, when it became a U.S. state.

Perry has been speaking out against the federal government lately over federal economic stimulus spending. He's also in a tough race for re-election against a fellow Republican, U.S. Sen. Kay Bailey Hutchison, whom he is trying to portray as a Washington insider.

Perry spokeswoman Allison Castle criticized Dunnam, saying he was "trying to distract from the fact that yesterday thousands of Texans, including many in his own district, expressed their extreme displeasure at Washington's rampant taxation, big spending and bloated government."

Dunnam suggested Perry is positioning himself for his political future.

"We all knew he wanted to be president. I just didn't know it was president of the Republic of Texas," he said to chuckles from onlookers.

Whistlebritches
Thursday, April 16, 2009 7:14:00 PM
SECEDE NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ron

JadeRose
Thursday, April 16, 2009 7:18:00 PM
CigarBid does not ship outside of the United States.
surfish1961
Thursday, April 16, 2009 7:21:00 PM
^ As a seperate nation, they would be able to trade with Cuba, so.....
JadeRose
Thursday, April 16, 2009 7:23:00 PM
You got me there
big chief
Thursday, April 16, 2009 7:29:00 PM
but for the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, I might well live in the State of Jefferson...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson_State 

Gene363
Friday, April 17, 2009 3:47:00 AM
"The Gettysburg speech was at once the shortest and the most famous oration in American history...the highest emotion reduced to a few poetical phrases. Lincoln himself never even remotely approached it. It is genuinely stupendous. But let us not forget that it is poetry, not logic; beauty, not sense. Think of the argument in it. Put it into the cold words of everyday. The doctrine is simply this: that the Union soldiers who died at Gettysburg sacrificed their lives to the cause of self-determination -- that government of the people, by the people, for the people, should not perish from the earth. It is difficult to imagine anything more untrue. The Union soldiers in the battle actually fought against self-determination; it was the Confederates who fought for the right of their people to govern themselves."

--H.L. Mencken

jreddoch
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:35:00 AM
Our beloved governor sticks his foot in his mouth once again. What a surprise!

I've always thought he was a couple candies short of a pinata.

Whistlebritches
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:37:00 AM
Thank you Gene.

SECEDE NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Ron

wheelrite
Friday, April 17, 2009 2:18:00 PM
Secede Yep...

Texas does'nt need Yankee Welfare Moms...

God Bless Texas !!

Wheel,,,

surfish1961
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:05:00 PM
Anyone care to do a little research on H.L. Mencken? Mencken was enamored with Friedrich Nietzsche, a self described immoralist. Hardly someone I'd like to use a quote from.
wheelrite
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:12:00 PM
Btw,

When Texas joined the Union.There was and still is a clause that permits Texas to Secede....

wheel,

Thunder.Gerbil
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:37:00 PM
^

Sorry Wheel, but no. That's a common myth.

wtjvj
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:39:00 PM
10. Author: wheelrite Date: 04/17/2009 06:18 PM Reply

Secede Yep...

Texas does’nt need Yankee Welfare Moms...

God Bless Texas !!

Wheel,,,

Texas got plenty of there own, eh.

ducati996
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:39:00 PM
Sucede....Please.....
Thom
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:43:00 PM
^I second.
wheelrite
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:43:00 PM
#14

At least thet're not Yankees !!!

wheel,

Whistlebritches
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:43:00 PM
TG

Sorry to lay this on ya brother...................but not a myth.Learned in 7th grade Texas History my friend.The option to secede still exist today.

BTW......hey douchecati....whats up???

Ron

Whistlebritches
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:48:00 PM
Although the word secede is not in the Texas constitution...........it should be read a little more carefully.Here is the best example I could find.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No such provision is found in the current Texas Constitution[1](adopted in 1876) or the terms of annexation.[2] However, it does state (in Article 1, Section 1) that "Texas is a free and independent State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States..." (note that it does not state "...subject to the President of the United States..." or "...subject to the Congress of the United States..." or "...subject to the collective will of one or more of the other States...")

Neither the Texas Constitution, nor the Constitution of the united States, explicitly or implicitly disallows the secession of Texas (or any other "free and independent State") from the United States. Joining the "Union" was ever and always voluntary, rendering voluntary withdrawal an equally lawful and viable option (regardless of what any self-appointed academic, media, or government "experts"—including Abraham Lincoln himself—may have ever said).

Both the original (1836) and the current (1876) Texas Constitutions also state that "All political power is inherent in the people ... they have at all times the inalienable right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper."

Likewise, each of the united States is "united" with the others explicitly on the principle that "governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed" and "whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends [i.e., protecting life, liberty, and property], it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government" and "when a long train of abuses and usurpations...evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security.

ducati996
Friday, April 17, 2009 4:51:00 PM
#18...not much, WhistleBitch.