I am SteveS's wife and I occasionally read the CB threads but rarely respond because I have no function in my right hand ... but, after reading tey's response to a post my husband made regarding the war on terror, I felt that I had to reply.

tey, I love America and everything it stands for and I'd like to tell you a story about our oldest son. When he was about 8 or 9, he went to visit his grandparents during his summer vacation. While he was there, the summer olympics were taking place. One afternoon, my mother-in-law called and told me that everytime the US won a gold medal, our son stood proudly with his hand over his heart and joined in singing the national anthem, with tears streaming down his cheeks.

tey, THIS is what freedom and patriotism are all about . An eight year old boy being so proud to be an American that he gets choked up like that. Living in America and having the freedom we enjoy is a feeling in your heart and soul that no one can describe or ever take away.

We have four terrific sons, all of whom love America and everything it stands for and I am the proudest mother in the world. I am like Ruggysgirl; don't let a terrorist get between me and my sons, because even at 4'11", I would fight them like a giant.

I'm sorry you don't like the President. I didn't particularly care for Mr. Clinton, but felt the mature thing to do was to support him because he WAS the President and I did so during the years that another of our sons served in the military during the years President Clinton was in office. There ARE times when things don't go our way, but we should act like adults and support our leadership.

I'm certainly no psychiatrist; I'm just a wife and the mother of 4 adult sons, but you sound to me like a very unhappy person. I simply cannot imagine someone not wanting to display the American flag on the Fourth of July or someone who would trash patriotism.

Finally, I want to tell you that TrannyMk is a good friend of ours. If you had a clue as to how he helps people in need, you'd take back the things you said about him. He has a wonderful heart and I love him for that.

Hi Ann!

Thanks for the kind words about me... I love you too!

Ann, Steve, and their boys(actually men)are great people. If you ever get a chance to meet them in person, do it. They are all great Americans!

You go, girl!

I, too, was not exactly enthralled with Mr. Clinton during his tenure in office. I did not use that as an excuse to trash my country or the presidency. I simply held my tongue, and waited until the next election.

If you are so unhappy with the current leadership, wait, there will be another election. Better yet, run for office yourself.

This is not a political forum. If you think that what you have to say can make a diffence, then find a more appropriate place to say it. Call your congressman or congresswoman.

I've jumped in to a board that was not directed at me, so I apologize for that.

Deb

A standing ovation for MrsS and Mrs.Tank! I hope some day to have the honor of meeting you two ladies in person. Until then - Hooray for you both!

Heather

I applaud Mrs.S and all the ladies who have spoken out here!!

This is not a political forum. If you think that what you have to say can make a diffence, then find a more appropriate place to say it. Call your congressman or congresswoman.

Although Mrs. Tank I must say the Misc. forum on CBid is however covered as a Political forum also... So with the first amendment rights for Tey (as long as he's not an illegal alian?) and others. they have a right to voice their opinions as well as anyone of us.

"If you are so unhappy with the current leadership, wait, there will be another election. Better yet, run for office yourself."

Now on this issue I don't think Tey has the balls to even attempt to run for office because from what I've read in his words there isn't a Mexican Origin's with a legal standing to vote nor enough minorities (as he claims) in the United States who would back his beliefs??

he will soon faid away and find another forum to raise his concerns...

Hog

What hog said!!!

k9

We really have some great women on here.

And I think MrsS scared away tey all by herself

i missed the first part of this but good one MrsS.

eodusmc read this post and you'll get an idea

http://www.cigarbid.com/auction/forum/forum.cfm?action=list&forumID=9&messageDisplay=0000000041749 

Better yet eodusmc, do NOT read that post and you'll be better for it.

Very eloquent thread MrsS.

I’ll only say that Tey appears to use inflammatory rhetoric to stir the kettle of bees. His posts are often uninformed and misguided.

MrsS your response to Tey is eloquent but I respectfully disagree with some of your points. I've tried to put together my thoughts (which I often struggle with ;-}. I hope that this comes across as intended...

Freedom and patriotism can mean different things to different people. It doesn’t mean that they are wrong and you are right. To some, questioning the policies of an administration that they disagree with is a patriotic act. You can and should respect the president and still disagree with the policies of his administration. I think that every US president deserves every American’s respect.

Personally, I think that the founding fathers would agree with this statement. I do think that there are appropriate ways to express a citizen’s disagreement with an elected politician’s policy (e.g. write a letter to the president/congressman, etc… expressing in a positive way what and why you agree or disagree with a policy or possibly an open letter to a newspaper, or just try to get someone else elected who you agree with) and in-appropriate ways (e.g. flag burning, vandalism, riots, etc…). I’d also put calling people who disagree with your views an idiot into the in-appropriate category.

What one element of freedom means to me is that I can openly disagree with the policies of this or any administration without the fear of reprisal. When this element of freedom is disintegrated the other freedoms will surely not be far behind. The restriction of this basic freedom was one of the impetuses for the revolutionary war.

I’d also like to add that not displaying the flag is just that. It is not disrespectful and/or unpatriotic. True American patriots don’t wrap themselves in the flag they salute it.

As always this these are just my opinions which do not reflect the beliefs of anyone but me and as such may only be worth the paper that they are printed on.

Well said, Ann, I too know the Smyths and think the world of them!

Buckwheat, you don't have to argue the other side just for the sake of argument! Yes, you should salute the flag, and you should honor it as well!

Goodbye Tey!

Charlie

No need to say goodbye Charlie, I'm still here. I'm just learning to take a more passive and/or pensive approach to posting.

Buckwheat- Very well put.

" I’d also put calling people who disagree with your views an idiot into the in-appropriate category."

I would venture to say he is not an idiot because he disagrees with my views... I think his own words identify him as such

This should be a permanent post on all forums...

"Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish."

Euripides

http://www.critters.org/whathow.html 

Buck

That was a really good article and we should strive to remember how it was worded!

I will strive to be a little less aggressive in my retorts!

Charlie

Buckwheat, Freedom and patriotism means the same thing to all. How they are used or expressed might change but the definition is the same. To one supporting Bush might be patriotic. To another questioning he might be. But it needs to be done in the best interest of the country. Blowing up a building is never patriotic. Finding the truth of something always is. The same is true of freedom. Just my .02 on that. Until Tey started calling names the only problem I had with him was in not backing up his opinion. Not so much what his opinion was.

The funny thing about Tey and adroomi, is I actually agree with them maybe two times out of ten. But the inflamitory nature of their arguments make me NOT want to defend them even on the rare occassions where I agree.

adroomi is probably gone after his foul language festival.

Tey, I do hope you change your game and stick around. Honorably disagree with others and you won't have any problems. You might even win some converts to your way of thinking.

Good luck on the Tey Makeover in progress.

Buckwheat,

I agree, patriotism can mean different things to different people. We each have our own way of expressing grief, anger, or unhappiness. Because someone doesn't appear to be grieving, doesn't mean their heart isn't breaking.

You are right in saying that a person doesn't have to fly the flag to be patriotic. As I said, it's a feeling inside that cannot be described. I think it was because tey came across with what seemed like an arrogant attitude when he spoke of not flying the flag on the Fourth that I got the impression that he was not patriotic or didn't have respect for our country. I feel strongly that those who live in this beautiful country should be respectful of it.

We have some close friends who moved here from Mexico. Their children speak perfect English, but at home and around family, they are encouraged to speak only Spanish in order to preserve their heritage and to not forget their native land. I think it's wonderful that they live here and respect this country, but also have a love for their origins and are reminded to never forget their heritage. IMO, they have the best of both worlds.

Thanks, Buckwheat, for reminding me that even though we don't all see red, green or yellow in the same way, they're all still colors. And don't worry about your words coming across to me in the wrong way. You seem like an intelligent, thoughful person to me.

And, if tey did not mean to have disrespect, it would be nice to have him say so. I think that would make everyone feel a lot better.

Take care,