ZRX1200
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13 years ago
By Pete Williams, Justice Correspondent, NBC News The Boy Scouts of America, one of the nation’s largest private youth organizations, is actively considering an end to its decades-long policy of banning gay scouts or scout leaders, according to scouting officials and outsiders familiar with internal discussions.

If adopted by the organization’s board of directors, it would represent a profound change on an issue that has been highly controversial -- one that even went to the US Supreme Court. The new policy, now under discussion, would eliminate the ban from the national organization’s rules, leaving local sponsoring organizations free to decide for themselves whether to admit gay scouts.

“The chartered organizations that oversee and deliver scouting would accept membership and select leaders consistent with their organization’s mission, principles or religious beliefs,” according to Deron Smith, a spokesman for the Boy Scouts’ national organization.

Individual sponsors and parents “would be able to choose a local unit which best meets the needs of their families,” Smith said.

The discussion of a potential change in policy is nearing its final stages, according to outside scouting supporters. If approved, the change could be announced as early as next week, after the BSA's national board holds a regularly scheduled meeting.

Only seven months ago, the Boy Scouts affirmed a policy of banning gay members, after a nearly two-year examination of the issue by a committee of volunteers convened by national leaders of the Boy Scouts of America, known as the BSA.

In a statement last July affirming the ban, its national executive board called it “the best policy for the organization.”

But since then, a scouting official said, local chapters have been urging a reconsideration. "We're a grassroots organization. This is a response to what's happening at the local level," the official said.

Two corporate CEOs on BSA’s national board, Randall Stephenson of AT&T and James Turley of Ernst & Young, have also said they would work to end the ban. Stephenson is next in line to be the BSA’s national chairman. During the 2012 presidential campaign, both Barack Obama and Mitt Romney said the BSA should admit gay scouts and scout leaders.

Ousted lesbian Cub Scout mom fights back

Jennifer Tyrrell, who was ousted as a den mother for her son's Cub Scout troop because of her sexual orientation, is fighting back. Tyrrell talks to msnbc's Thomas Roberts about her petition to change the Boy Scouts of America's long-standing policy on banning gays and lesbians.

About 50 local United Way groups and several corporations and charities have concluded that the ban violates their non-discrimination requirements and have ceased providing financial aid to the Boy Scouts. An official of The Human Rights Campaign, an advocate for gay rights, said HRC planned to downgrade its non-discrimination ratings for corporations that continue to give the BSA financial support.

“It’s an extremely complex issue,” said one Boy Scouts of America official, who explained that other organizations have threatened to withdraw their financial support if the BSA drops the ban.

While the national scouting organization sets broad policies, more than 290 local councils nationwide govern the day-to-day conduct of the more than 116,000 local organizations. Individual scouting troops are sponsored by religious and civic organizations that represent a diversity of views on the issue of allowing gay scouts and leaders.

“The beliefs of the sponsoring organizations are highly diverse,” the official said.

The policy change now under discussion “would allow the religious, civic or educational organizations that oversee and deliver Scouting to determine how to address this issue,” said the BSA's Smith.

“The Boy Scouts would not, under any circumstances, dictate a position to units, members or parents. Under this proposed policy, the BSA would not require any chartered organization to act in ways inconsistent with that organization’s mission, principles or religious beliefs,” he said.

In 2000, the U.S. Supreme Court concluded that the Boy Scouts had a First Amendment right of free expression when it came to the organization’s belief that homosexual conduct is inconsistent with values stated in the scout oath, requiring scouts to be “morally straight.”

The Scouts have won similar legal battles, with courts finding that the BSA’s right of free association permits it, as a private organization, to reject those it believes do not conform to is values.















I detest Americans of any ilk who don't believe in free association.
MACS
13 years ago
The Girl Scouts don't want 'em and the Boy Scouts are afraid they'll take over!!

Compromise:

Girl Scouts
Boy Scouts
Boys who want to be Girls Scouts
bloody spaniard
13 years ago

By Pete Williams, Justice Correspondent, NBC News The Boy Scouts of America, one of the nation’s largest private youth organizations, is actively considering an end to its decades-long policy of banning gay scouts or scout leaders, according to scouting officials and outsiders familiar with internal discussions.


I detest Americans of any ilk who don't believe in free association.

ZRX1200 wrote:



:-k
Why do I get the feeling that Pete Williams is jumping up and down like a ruptured kangaroo, clapping both hands in glee as he reports this story? Aooooooooooooogah!

:-k
"Free association" wasn't that Robin Williams's method?
DrMaddVibe
13 years ago
Gheys gonna earn THAT rubby badge![frypan]
daveincincy
13 years ago
Scout Master: All right guys! Lay off Canteen Boy, You can hike on back to your tents and hit the hay! Come on! Let’s go! Let’s go! [ Boy scouts are leaving, disappointed, Scout Master holds Canteen Boy’s leg ] Not you Canteen Boy! I wanted to talk to you about something. I see you take a lot of ribbing from the other scouters.

Canteen Boy: Goes with the territory mister Armstrong – it’s sticks and stones!

Scout Master: [ Putting his arm around Canteen Boy’s shoulder ] Attaboy!.. [ Looking at Canteen Boy with lust in his eye ] You know, it seems like the moment you get out of the city, all the problems sort of, fade away… [ Scout Master feels Canteen Boy’s cheek with his nose ] I’m sorry Canteen Boy my - my beard is scratchy isn’t it?

Canteen Boy: [ Very uncomfortable with the situation ] No harm done!

Scout Master: [ Continues to feel Canteen Boy’s cheek ] My beard is scratchy Canteen Boy but it gives good back rubs…

Canteen Boy: Yeah um, yeah I’ll take a rain check on that mister Armstrong.

Scout Master: [ Tears his shirt apart ] Oops! My shirt fell off!

Canteen Boy: That’s a quick fix mister Armstrong just put it back on!

Scout Master: Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! That’s great Canteen Boy! Hey [Holds Canteen Boy back again, puts an hand on his leg and rubs it] Do you like wine?

Canteen Boy: Actually I prefer pure tap water um, right out of the ol' canteen right here!

Scout Master: I’m going to get us a little…. wine…. [ Scout Master leaves ]

Canteen Boy: All right a little drop will not kill me I guess…

[ Canteen Boy hears a howl in the forest ]

Canteen Boy: Ooo-Ooo to you! Hey owl! if you’re so wise why don’t you go to sleep it’s the middle of the night! [ Canteen Boy is amused and proud of his remark. ]

[ Scout Master comes back, wearing a bath robe and holding two glasses of wine. Sits besides Canteen Boy ]

Scout Master: Ahhh… Here’s to the Great Outdoors! [ Scout Master intentionally spills wine over Canteen Boy’s sleeping bag ] Oops! Was that your sleeping bag? [ Canteen Boy’s get out of his wet sleeping bag ] You’d better share mine.. It’s Extra Large!

Canteen Boy: [ Naive about the invitation ] Sure why not, until mine dries off, it won’t take long it’s made of Gore-Tex.

Scout Master: Canteen Boy, would you um.. rub some bug repellent on my chest?

Canteen Boy: It’s February mister Armstrong I think all the bugs went down south to hibernate, I’ll be honest with you!

Scout Master: Humor me Canteen Boy!

[ Canteen Boy nervously applies lotion on Scout Master’s chest for a few seconds ]

Canteen Boy: There you go! No more bugs!

Scout Master: I have to apologize for my hairy chest, it can be a little scratchy…

Canteen Boy: Yeah.. my mom might like it as she’s a big Tom Selleck fan!

Scout Master: Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! You’re very funny Canteen Boy! [ Reaches out and holds Canteen Boy in his arms ] Make me laugh some more!

Canteen Boy: Actually, I left my joke book over in the tent, how about I go get it?

Scout Master: That’s okay Canteen Boy let’s just, lie here and… look at the stars…. [ Scout Master puts his mouth on Canteen Boy’s cheek and neck ] Do you know um… [ Takes Canteen Boy’s finger and suck it ] do you know how.. how to play… "Truth or Dare"…Canteen Boy?

Canteen Boy: Um, refresh me!

Scout Master: You choose between telling a secret… or doing a Dare…

Canteen Boy: All right: "Dare."

[ Scout Master whispers something inaudible at Canteen Boy’s ear ]

Canteen Boy : [ Looking scared ] You know what mister Armstrong, let’s start off with the Truth!

Scout Master: I’ll tell you a Truth canteen Boy! You know what I hate? Underpants!

[ Scout Masters removes his underpants underneath his sleeping bag ]

Canteen Boy: Gee, I think if you worry about bugs, underpants would be your last line of defense!

Scout Master: [ Throwing his underpants away ] Problem solved!

Canteen Boy: Your problem’s solved but I think my problem’s just beginning! [ Scout Master forces Canteen Boy into spoon like position ] Aahhh What the hell is that?

Scout Master: I don’t know, it must have been a bed bug.

Canteen Boy: That was pretty big for a bed bug!

Scout Master: Okay it wasn’t a bed bug!

Canteen Boy: Let’s go back to saying it was a bed bug! Hey you know what, the park ranger just called! He said: "one camper per sleeping bag!" Sorry! Adios Amigos! [ Canteen Boy tries to leave sleeping bag, Scout Master holds him back ]

Scout Master: Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! God you make me laugh Canteen Boy!

[ Scout Masters holds Canteen Boy and falls asleep – the morning after…]

Scout Master: [ Wakes up ] I’m sorry Canteen Boy, I fell asleep before anything happened.

Canteen Boy: No harm done!

Scout Master: Well who’s hungry? I’m gonna go make us a power breakfast! [ Scout Master leaves ]

Canteen Boy: Okay…[ Canteen Boy gets up, whistles to summon snakes and runs away ]

Scout Master: [ Scout Master returns ] Canteen Boy have you ever had a Mimosa? Canteen Boy? [ Snakes "charge" at Scout Master from various location ] Ha! Ha! Ha!.. Canteen Boy you rascal!"
bloody spaniard
13 years ago
HAHAHAHA! You fonny (looking), Dave.
tegulator
13 years ago
What is the issue here? It doesn't seem as if the Scouts are being legally forced to do anything and that this is an internal change, so I'm confused...
DrMaddVibe
13 years ago

I'm confused...

tegulator wrote:




So are the rubby players.

Especially in Georgetown!


EAT MOR CHIKIN'!!!
ZRX1200
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13 years ago
Tegulator did you read my title?


I posed a question and made a statement at the end of the story. Either they've changed their convictions or they are bowing to pressure IMO.
victor809
13 years ago

What is the issue here? It doesn't seem as if the Scouts are being legally forced to do anything and that this is an internal change, so I'm confused...

tegulator wrote:



Oh, some of the shorter bus brethren here will whine about liberals ruining the world and having indoctrinated so many people that the scouts are now forced to only hire child molester scout leaders...

I mean, keeping gays out of the scouts for all these years has worked SO well... [sarcasm]
ZRX1200
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13 years ago
Victor so do you think they had a change in conviction or bowed to pressure?
tegulator
13 years ago

Tegulator did you read my title?


I posed a question and made a statement at the end of the story. Either they've changed their convictions or they are bowing to pressure IMO.

ZRX1200 wrote:



Sure I read the title, but I also read the bit at the end where you said you detest anyone who doesn't like free association (or something to that effect). It seems to me what we have in this case (and in last year's Chick-fil-a protests) is the reverse of when conservatives protested Disney because of the Gay Day that is annually held at Disneyworld.

There isn't any *legal* action being threatened in either of these cases, but the burden of proof is on supporters of the Scout's current policy on gay members to show how alternative lifestyles *necessarily* prevent the person in question from living the "morally straight" life. If this cannot be shown, then it follows that overt homophobia is the prime motivating factor for keeping gays out of Scouts. Sure, private clubs have the right to decide their own qualifications for membership...even if it is for bigoted reasons.
victor809
13 years ago

Victor so do you think they had a change in conviction or bowed to pressure?

ZRX1200 wrote:



What is the difference?
They said what happened. Local leadership didn't want to be bigoted... they decided not to force their local troop leadership to be bigoted if they didn't want to. At most that implies they "bowed to pressure" from their own internal organization.

The real question though, is that if they allow gays to participate openly in the scouts, where will all the child molesters hide? I sense a jump in seminary attendance!
daveincincy
13 years ago
They caved in to the pressure...just like Disney and any other company that decides the negative publicity is just not worth it.
victor809
13 years ago

They caved in to the pressure...just like Disney and any other company that decides the negative publicity is just not worth it.

daveincincy wrote:




....
Just out of curiosity... if the KKK started allowing jewish members, would you say they "Caved to pressure"?
](*,)
ZRX1200
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13 years ago
You're gonna stick with that^? ?


Chic Fil A is a business that was pressured by politicians who threatened to close local restaurants. Apples and burritos hommie.

Now, do you support a private organizations right to free associate?

This has NOTHING TO DO with the benefits or lack thereof with Scouts allowing homosexuals. Free association is vital to our freedoms.
dstieger
13 years ago
What's next? Heathen Scouts? Where will it end?
TMCTLT
13 years ago

They caved in to the pressure...just like Disney and any other company that decides the negative publicity is just not worth it.

daveincincy wrote:




Couldn't have said it better....+1

That's what organizations do now, it costs less to knuckle under (what with legal fees being what they are)
ZRX1200
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13 years ago
16 for 12.

Victor I support the KKKs right to allow whoever they want.
TMCTLT
13 years ago

....
Just out of curiosity... if the KKK started allowing jewish members, would you say they "Caved to pressure"?
](*,)

victor809 wrote:




Come on you can do better than that....those **** hate everyone......
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