RayR
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4 years ago
The first and forgotten insurrectionist secessionists were Northerners. Did you learn that from your history books?
Lincoln would later refute the principles of the Declaration of Independence and lie like Pelosi as he refused to recognize the legality of the South’s actions by calling it an act of rebellion.

The Man Who Literally Wrote the U.S. Constitution Advocated Secession in 1812

Thomas DiLorenzo

Founding father Gouveneur Morris of New York was chairman of the Committee on Style and is credited with literally writing the final draft of the Constitution. Along with the New England Federalists, he advocated secession of New England and New York. The Federalists were so opposed to Jefferson, his and Madison’s trade embargo, and the War of 1812, all of which they believed were harmful to the New England economy, that they plotted to secede.

This proves once and for all that the founding fathers all agreed with Senator Timothy Pickering of Massachusetts, who was George Washington’s secretary of war and secretary of state, that secession was “the” principle of the American Revolution; that of course the union is voluntary; and of course the citizens of each state have a right to secede. (Senator Pickering was the leader of the New England secession movement from 1801-1814).

Case closed.

https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog/the-man-who-literally-wrote-the-u-s-constitution-advocated-secession-in-1812/ 

Sunoverbeach
4 years ago
On s'en fout?
frankj1
4 years ago
RayR
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4 years ago

On s'en fout?

Sunoverbeach wrote:



Spoken like a French Jacobin comrade.
frankj1
4 years ago

Spoken like a French Jacobin comrade.

RayR wrote:


merdre, oui.
corey sellers
4 years ago
You and Lincoln have alot in common.
corey sellers
4 years ago
frankj1
4 years ago
Jefferson, a slave owner, had written a few lines in an original blaming Great Britain for instituting African slavery in the colonies, identifying it as horrendous act against humanity, and included his Anti-Slavery rant in a submitted copy of the Declaration of Independence...it was omitted from the final document that lives to this day.

Several theories have been put forth as to why it was edited out...but:


"Decades later, in his autobiography, Jefferson primarily blamed two Southern states for the clause’s removal, while acknowledging the North’s role as well.

'The clause...reprobating the enslaving the inhabitants of Africa, was struck out in compliance to South Carolina and Georgia, who had never attempted to restrain the importation of slaves, and who on the contrary still wished to continue it. Our Northern brethren also I believe felt a little tender under these censures; for tho' their people have very few slaves themselves, yet they had been pretty considerable carriers of them to others.' "
RayR
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4 years ago
t's true, it's an Extract from Thomas Jefferson’s Notes of Proceedings in the Continental Congress

July 2. [1776]
Congress proceeded the same day to consider the declaration of Independance which had been reported & laid on the table the Friday preceding and on Monday referred to a commee of the whole. the pusillanimous idea that we had friends in England worth keeping terms with, still haunted the minds of many. for this reason those passages which conveyed censures on the people of England were struck out, lest they should give them offence. the clause too, reprobating the enslaving the inhabitants of Africa, was struck out in complaisance to South Carolina & Georgia who had never attempted to restrain the importation of slaves, and who on the contrary still wished to continue it. our Northern brethren also I believe felt a little tender under those censures; for tho’ their people have very few slaves themselves yet they had been pretty considerable carriers of them to others.


He was saying it wasn't just a couple of Southern States who wanted the anti-slavery passage struck out, it was also the Nothern Yankees who ran the slave trade with their financing and their ships.
frankj1
4 years ago

t's true, it's an Extract from Thomas Jefferson’s Notes of Proceedings in the Continental Congress


He was saying it wasn't just a couple of Southern States who wanted the anti-slavery passage struck out, it was also the Nothern Yankees who ran the slave trade with their financing and their ships.

RayR wrote:


so ya softened the one you like and hardened the one you wish was the cause...yet he was a Southern person who owned human beings. So, there's that...

Look ray, no one was innocent, but twisting it to make your opinions seem validated is only self serving, not a clarifying event.

Willingness to back off a great declaration by eliminating entire races of people from being created equal by whatever creator one believed/believes in is hypocrisy as is writing the grand statement while owning humans...you really gonna argue that?

It took the 13th and 14th (and 15th) Amendments to start the fixing process that is ongoing today, as even they were not fully inclusive.
RayR
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4 years ago

so ya softened the one you like and hardened the one you wish was the cause...yet he was a Southern person who owned human beings. So, there's that...

Look ray, no one was innocent, but twisting it to make your opinions seem validated is only self serving, not a clarifying event.

Willingness to back off a great declaration by eliminating entire races of people from being created equal by whatever creator one believed/believes in is hypocrisy as is writing the grand statement while owning humans...you really gonna argue that?

It took the 13th and 14th (and 15th) Amendments to start the fixing process that is ongoing today, as even they were not fully inclusive.

frankj1 wrote:



So...you don't like the truth? You don't like hearing that New Englanders were heavily involved in financing the Southern slave trade?
In 1776 there were 13 slave states, not just Southern persons who owned human beings. I think you're twisting your opinions to serve your own prejudices. No one has ever believed in perfect equality among races, tribes, nationalities, sexes, or religions for all the many thousands of years of HUMAN history and it still exists today. You really gonna argue that? In your Massachusetts, chattel slavery existed through the end of the 18th Century. Even when it was considered no more a nice thing to be doing, some kept it alive by relabeling it as indentured servitude.

Stop with those silly woke pie-in-the-sky views of yours that you use to judge the past through your lens of presentism.


frankj1
4 years ago

So...you don't like the truth? You don't like hearing that New Englanders were heavily involved in financing the Southern slave trade?
In 1776 there were 13 slave states, not just Southern persons who owned human beings. I think you're twisting your opinions to serve your own prejudices. No one has ever believed in perfect equality among races, tribes, nationalities, sexes, or religions for all the many thousands of years of HUMAN history and it still exists today. You really gonna argue that? In your Massachusetts, chattel slavery existed through the end of the 18th Century. Even when it was considered no more a nice thing to be doing, some kept it alive by relabeling it as indentured servitude.

Stop with those silly woke pie-in-the-sky views of yours that you use to judge the past through your lens of presentism.


RayR wrote:


you're mentally ill
corey sellers
4 years ago
RayR
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4 years ago
Frank is full of HATE! He hates Jefferson because he struck out the paragraphs in the Declaration to satisfy 2 Southern colonies and New England slave traders who balked at signing the Declaration with them. Well, sometimes you've got to keep your focus on the main goal and leave other battles for another day. But NO....2 Minutes Hate for Jefferson and ME!

Also Jefferson wasn't inclusive with LGBQ++XYZ/2 people and Drag Queens! HATE! HATE! HATE!

[chef]
Sunoverbeach
4 years ago
OK, I think I'll just respond to you in all characters since you're incapable of reading comprehension. Or maybe it's just reading, period.

¢¥^^€÷. €™℅©==€===€= ¢¶×|π√ €°°®℅[©™=¢==. ¢^°©℅[¢{{|÷ ¢®®°®×|¶∆ ¢€℅℅, ™®©=€× ¢=^, ~¶√×√π\℅€° ¢™®[=¥×. ®[€¶¶`π√ ™©°€{¥=¥=¥{. ¢\`|••π÷¶¶ £¢€^^={{ \®]™]¢¥`π€=€=€=. ©℅€=|×{ ¢™™{¶•÷`√£^™ @%#&$-+";. @&$+$#&& £℅¥{®÷ €℅€=¥×¥÷. £¥^ ¢×•√¢¥`= £®¢¥.

Capisce?
Sunoverbeach
4 years ago
Funny how they say we need to talk when they really mean you need to listen.
frankj1
4 years ago

Haha

corey sellers wrote:


lol?
I think I spelled it backwards.
RayR
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4 years ago

OK, I think I'll just respond to you in all characters since you're incapable of reading comprehension. Or maybe it's just reading, period.

¢¥^^€÷. €™℅©==€===€= ¢¶×|π√ €°°®℅[©™=¢==. ¢^°©℅[¢{{|÷ ¢®®°®×|¶∆ ¢€℅℅, ™®©=€× ¢=^, ~¶√×√π\℅€° ¢™®[=¥×. ®[€¶¶`π√ ™©°€{¥=¥=¥{. ¢\`|••π÷¶¶ £¢€^^={{ \®]™]¢¥`π€=€=€=. ©℅€=|×{ ¢™™{¶•÷`√£^™ @%#&$-+";. @&$+$#&& £℅¥{®÷ €℅€=¥×¥÷. £¥^ ¢×•√¢¥`= £®¢¥.

Capisce?

Sunoverbeach wrote:



I didn't know you spoke REPTILIAN?
Sunoverbeach
4 years ago
Didn't know you read it. Lord knows you don't process English worth a chit
RayR
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4 years ago
If those LGBQ++XYZ/2 types can declare June to be Pride Month, I declare July to be Independence Month, where people speak seditious thoughts about the tyranny of dicktators, bloated centralized government and duhmacracy, all that stuff the progressives don't want you to talk about because they are for all for those things.
Da Judge here speaks the truth that they don't want you to hear. Nationalists will recoil in HORROR!

"In a democracy, faithless to constitutional guarantees, the majority will take whatever it wants from the minority — including its liberty and property."


The Tyranny of the Majority

By Andrew P. Napolitano

July 14, 2022

“Which is better — to be ruled by one tyrant three thousand miles away, or three thousand tyrants one mile away?”
— Rev. Mather Blyes (1706-1788)

Does it really matter if the instrument curtailing liberty is a monarch or a popularly elected legislature? This conundrum, along with the witty version of it put to a Boston crowd in 1775 by the little-known colonial-era preacher with the famous uncle — Cotton Mather — addresses the age-old question of whether liberty can long survive in a democracy.

Blyes was a loyalist, who, along with about one-third of the American adult white male population in 1776, opposed the American Revolution and favored continued governance by Great Britain.

He didn’t fight for the king or agitate against George Washington’s troops; he merely warned of the dangers of too much democracy.

No liberty-minded thinker I know of seriously argues today in favor of a hereditary monarchy, but many of us are fearful of an out-of-control democracy, which is what we have in America today. I say “democracy” because there remain in our federal structure a few safeguards against runaway federal tyranny, such as the equal state representation in the Senate, the Electoral College, the state control of federal elections, and life-tenured federal judges and justices.

Of course, the Senate as originally crafted did not consist of popularly elected senators. Rather, they were appointed by state legislatures to represent the sovereign states as states, not the people in them. Part of James Madison’s genius was the construction of the federal government as a three-sided table. The first side stood for the people — the House of Representatives. The second side stood for the sovereign states that created the federal government — the Senate. And the third side stood for the nation-state — the presidency. The judiciary, whose prominent role today was unthinkable in 1789, was not part of this mix.

In his famous Bank Speech, Madison argued eloquently against legislation chartering a national bank because the authority to create a bank was not only not present in the Constitution but also was retained by the states and reserved to them by the Tenth Amendment.

In that speech, he warned that the creeping expansion of the federal government would trample the powers of the states and also the unenumerated rights of the people that the Ninth Amendment — his pride and joy because it protected natural rights — prohibited the government from denying or disparaging.

More...

https://www.lewrockwell.com/2022/07/andrew-p-napolitano/844631-2/ 

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