I have read a lot of mixed reviews on these and it appears it all depends [like usual] on the luck of the draw.
Feel free to add your experiences! Oh yes! I got the Gordo.

Since this is such popular thread I will answer myself!
Yes! buy them they're a wonderful smoke Get the Maduro's you won't be sorry. Maybe with the Gordo's you might even get the inch! I think you will be happy with your purchase.

Hey I really appreciate your response. and it was what I hoped to hear in a cigar forum! what a great place to learn about cigars! would you like to know what my name means?

Glad we could help out.

I like Gurkha thirds, they're the same cigar used in his majesty's reserve and are also relabeled Cuban rejects.

I don't buy into the idea that there's always plentiful seconds, overruns, mistakes etc. If it was an occasional offering, thats one thing.

IMO seconds are rolled as seconds from the start, and I've never had one that wasn't a dog rocket.

My feeling exactly and that's why I've never tried them. But they sell well, so there's got to be plenty of happy customers.

No. 5 you do make a lot of sense. Especially when some of the sizes don't even exist [in the firsts] like in some of the Alec Bradley 90+ smokes. But I have had some superb Alec Bradley 2nds.

I also agree that many of the "seconds" are actually made from the start to be "seconds" the same way that the clothing stores make special clothes to sell at the outlet malls

That being said, I have enjoyed the bundle of Nicaraguan 90+ s I picked up a while back. The size was a bit odd and they are soft, not packed tight with tobacco but still very flavorful and enjoyable and worth what I paid.

With them being rolled as seconds do they change the vitola size so band swapping won't take place somewhere down the line and the seconds be misrepresented? Trying to figure out a reason why seconds are a different size from regular production.

Could this be the deceptive part of the cigar industry ? I remember buying some overruns a few years ago and a few weeks ago I see they are still selling them. When does an overrun become regular production ?

I just received my E.P. Carrillo 2nds and without a doubt they are the regular Monumentos [presidente] 7.3 x 56
I tried one out of the bundle and they are actually quite exceptional. Med to full and a joy. Just a slight construction problem that seems to correct itself. I can see the coloration is slightly different from gar to gar. The aroma is wonderful.
They measure the correct size. so go figure!

🍺

Never tried a Carillo. I may have to now. Thanks!

Good day Monkeyboy.....we used to have smoking monkeys at our zoo when i was a kid. Any relation?

Seconds/factory overruns - should be same tobacco but imperfect color matching on wrappers, etc. so they don't look pretty next to each other in a box so they get culled. If they have good quality control they actually get a lot of these. Like Scratch and dent appliances. And it wouldn't surprise me if they purposely create more of these if it makes them money on volume......as long as they don't hurt the main brand.

Sometimes you get apprentice cigars where the new rollers and 3rd string try their hand at making a cigar.....those are often imperfectly rolled and don't have the same tobacco. The less specific they get on telling you what the second is a second of, the more I wonder.

And yes there is no industry standard in terminology so who knows what you get till you try it.

Now to share my little secret.......I am VERY impressed with overrun bundles of Torano Exodus 50 year Churchill maduros. My all-occasion Nicaraguan chocolate sticks. Medium body but rich flavor. It smokes like a chimney, burns and gets going again 10 minutes after you set it down, and never needs to be touched up. The only time I realized why they might be seconds is when I took the cello off of a handful of them and set them next to each other.....inconsistent wrapper color within and between cigars........big deal. For taste and performance, I consider this the cigar to beat when I try other cigars. I easily pay 2-3 times as much for a comparable quality with a band so I am always in search of something to be much better when I am paying more. Happens less than I would like. I hope new owner General does not screw it up. If I wasn't always wanting to try something new, I would hoard these. Must be the maduro though...i have tried the natural, eh.

On the other hand, I am totally unimpressed with Prensado (cigar of the year???), Tempus and Black Market seconds.....though I never had a real one of those and maybe I wouldn't like the top shelf versions either? I thought I was done looking for the cheap but good cigars (so much disappointment) but that Carillo may need to be taken on a spin.

But I can't smoke the same cigar for long before I hanker for something different. Then I go for Fuente, Crowned Heads, La Aurora, My Father, Camacho, Gran Habano, Oliva, Tatuaje and now exploring a wide assortment of new-to-me brands. So far, not a fan of Gurkha or Rocky Patel and I have had mixed luck with Drew Estate and Alec Bradley. I stay away from the non cuban legacy brands except some NC Montes. I am a sucker for boutique and small batch and have tried a lot of locally rolled but am envious of Miami in that regard. I only say all this so you can decide if my advice is of any value to you as a fellow noob on this forum.

DISCLAIMER: I am not as cigar savvy as a lot of folks on this forum, who are more experienced than I. I am neither novice nor expert - somewhere in between.

Very interesting Tamapaton! I think I lucked out on these but I wouldn't have been happy if I had gotten the "New Wave's" since I've heard they were kinda weak on the strength and Flavor.
Many have been burned by 2nds and I guess I'm a sucker for a deal, but only for so long.

Tampatom, probably distant cousins. Most of my smoking zoo relations hail from Audubon Zoo in New Orleans, pre-K 😉

My favorite cheap smoke right now are the Perdomo Fresh-rolled, but them I'm a fan of a lot of Perdomo blends. Never tried a second, but based on severe's ezpweience I may look intk the Carillos. Hell, I may look into the firsts.

I've been eying the Toranos as well. What would you recommend in the full category for them?

I forgot Perdomo. I liked the Perdomo habano.......had it a year in my humidor and was so good i had to buy more. Fuller than Lot 22 (which i like in the short torp format). You might like the habano but no big bargain on those.

The 50 year maduro Torano is supposed to be med to full but I think its more medium in strength but pretty med/full in flavor. Fuller Torano? Another I like and picked up are Charlie Torano Captiva on cbid for real good price. They kept coming up and i kept lowering my max bid till I got what I needed and then more. Shhhhh. They are definitely on the full side and pretty nice. Charlie spends time on the island and since i have two houses there I thought I could relate to his inspiration for the blend. The only reason I am letting you in on this is that I already bought two boxes and have enough. I am hoping to put a little age on these. These were blended by Charlie before the General buyout and they are not listed on their website and may not be in current production? Unannounced Closeout??? Maybe they didn't get rights to blend.........

Your secret is safe with me *quietly links over to brand list*

Captiva is not currently on live bid......but it has been in rotation.

I got the maduro churchills and they SUCKED!!!!!![ram27bat]