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KingoftheCove
Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter

6 years ago

Very good read imho...

Since we are mostly supposed to be kicking back.......thought I’d share in case some of you haven’t seen this one

https://www.aier.org/article/we-were-wrong-so-sorry-that-we-ruined-your-life/

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Mrs. dpnewell
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

Good read. Thanks.

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

he makes an important point: accurate data should drive these decisions...he acknowledges that a key component to obtain accurate data was/is/will be conducting massive testing, which is a time consuming process, at this point...

too bad we didn't have the foresight to develop the 5 minute, or even the 15 minute test earlier, let alone a trustworthy one...

meanwhile the virus is spreading rapidly and people are dying...

Granted: social distancing is a bludgeon to our way of life; but what was the right thing, an acceptable alternative, that could've controlled the spread?

Edited by user 6 years ago | Reason: Not specified

Pudding Mittens
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

Granted: social distancing is a bludgeon to our way of life; but what was the right thing, an acceptable alternative, that could've controlled the spread?

delta1 wrote:

South Korea mass-tested everyone they possibly could, then isolated the infected people, but let everyone else go on with their lives and business. It's been the approach recommended by several experts as a way to handle the problem yet not destroy your economy. It seems to have worked well for South Korea.

They did other stuff like invasive mass cell phone tracking of infected individuals to identify where they were going and who they were with, which probably wouldn't fly here, but the rest would. However, early on we didn't have mass-testing ability like they did.
.

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

and that is the key to accurate data collection, mass test in as short a time possible as close to the beginning as possible...

can we do it in the USA , with a population of 7 times SK, and one that is much less socially compliant, a society that loves liberty and freedom and questions its government... resists govt. intrusion into their lives

a population with many who questioned the reality of the current pandemic months after the infection was made known....claims that it was a partisan and media driven hoax...

would they submit to enforced mass testing?

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

delta1 wrote:

probably something like 98.2% of Americans gladly ceded freedoms to Washington and Governors and Mayors.
Fear will coerce citizens to trade for safety, what we've learned this time though is the HOPE of safety seems to be enough.

In no way am I disparaging anyone...I've been following what seems like the solid advice as well...but we haven't even been promised a cure, a prevention, a path to avoidance...

The key will be to not leave any on the table for the powers when this is all over.

Mrs. dpnewell
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

Frank, either your numbers are way off, or I just happen to know a whole bunch of the 1.8%. Totalitarian moves are totalitarian moves, no matter which party does it. Right now I am not too happy with Trump, and extremely unhappy with our "shut the state down till April 30th", totalitarian governor. What really disappoints me, are those who claim to be conservative, but "would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety". If I recall, Ben Franklin said such folk "deserve neither liberty nor safety".

David

Speyside
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

Dave, I struggle with this daily. The right thing to do is to never do anything to freedom other than fight for it. Freedom is in Americas DNA. Every time we cede to a slippery slope like this we end up losing freedom. Yet...

Americans are dying. We need to do everything possible to beat the enemy, COVID 19. Dr Anthony Faucci is an honest man who the best in his field. He said today best case is about 100,000 Americans will die of this. Worst case over 2,000,000 Americans will die.

So I ask you. What is appropriate? I ask this in all seriousness.

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

and to reinforce that point Spey, faced with all that, a couple of months after the pandemic was known to be here, we still do not not have a consensus that the best thing to do was to do mass testing as quickly as possible to gather data to effectively "control" the spread, by IDing and quarantining infected peeps and figuring out the areas where the virus lives.....

my personal opinion is that we should have, but were not ready to do it for whatever reason, so we wasted time and an opportunity...

then, we had to switch our efforts to "contain"...my personal opinion is that this is a good idea, but that opinion is driven by my proximity to a densely populated metropolitan area flowing with international travelers...a place where the risk of interacting with a carrier is vastly greater than someone who lives in a rural area, where the closest known carrier is several hundred miles away...seems there are still many peeps who don't think that staying home applies to them, posing a risk to those who stay at home...

but that was what Italy thought, so they only closed off the northern part of the country...didn't take long to realize that was a fatal mistake...so there is actual data that shows that shutting down the society can slow the spread and save lives

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#10

Mrs. dpnewell wrote:

I made up the number, but actually did read something that claimed over 90% agreed with the government's actions...don't recall if it was MA or national polls though.

Like you, I never like either side pulling this stuff, but I don't know what our response should be...like spey says. I know I do not want to get this virus. I'd probably still do my best to avoid crossing paths with other humans until the all clear signs light up. It's not dumb to stay away from exposure.

We simply have no idea what was held back and for how long, or even why. But no part of me questions the danger out there.

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#11

delta1 wrote:

and those folks jammed train cars and headed south!

our local version has New Yorkers fleeing to their Cape Cod vacation homes, traveling through Rhode Island.

Edited by user 6 years ago | Reason: Not specified

Mrs. dpnewell
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#12

That's a tough question, Spey. Personally, I always lean heavily toward freedom. The ideal solution would be to test everyone, quarantine the infected, and allow the rest of use to live our damn lives.

I believe that this virus has already blown through this section of NC back in February, and I'm not the only one. A strange virus came though here that had all the symptoms of COVID19. The 2nd week of February, my wife came down with something. Low grade fever, chills and chest congestion. Lasted 2 1/2 weeks. She said it was unlike anything she ever experienced. The entire illnesses was in her chest and never went to her head. I've read hundreds of local social media posts that reported the same symptoms. It went through all our schools, and overwhelmed our doctor offices and clinics. Those who where tested said that the tests came back negative for the seasonal flu. I was "off" and tired for a couple weeks, but I never showed any symptoms. There was talk about a test that would show anti-bodies to the virus, telling you if you already had it. I would be more then willing to take that test. If we already had it, then why should we have to self quarantine for the next 30 days?

If we destroy our economy over this, and turn ourselves into a 3rd world country, how many millions will die from starvation, unsanitary conditions and rampant disease?

Again, I don't have the answers, just thinking out loud.

David

Edited by user 6 years ago | Reason: Not specified

Speyside
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#13

Dave, I think a group of people I know including myself had it in December. We had all of the symptoms and tested negative for the flu. It doesn't fit known timelines, but I don't trust the China timeline accuracy at all

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#14

I believe the actions are necessary and just don't even hear Trump anymore...but the power grab is an eternal question.
Still have faith in Fauci despite insane right wing nonsense.

anyhoo, I've had a chest cough for 3 weeks, About 10 days ago had 12 hours of flu-like symptoms, light headed, chills, temp only wavered between 99.8 and 100.4 though.
Next morning back to 98.6 and never been above since.

Still coughing out crap every day, no pain from breathing, can inhale fully, but when I exhale beyond normal I can hear and feel the rumble of stuff in my lungs. Never walk but walked 2.5 miles yesterday and 2 miles the day before with no issues.

Emailed my pc tonight with this info.

Other than that, I feel absolutely fine. The Lovely Caren has had a cough alternating between wet and dry since the first of the year! Clear chest xray late Feb, was told no pneumonia and that she has a long lasting virus going around...

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#15

I'm old and have a few under-lying conditions (diabetes, high blood pressure, mild asthma) that put me in the high risk population, plus I live with the love of my life and babysit my daughter's two toddler girls...I can't take any chances...

Mrs. dpnewell
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#16

Spey, I agree with the not trusting China. My, point is the same as the article. We are having a knee jerk reaction to this without facts. If millions, like you and I have already had this virus and recovered, and I did say "if", then we should not be risking our economy over this. The first thing our President and Congress should have done, is to mandate testing for everyone, to determine who actually had the disease, and how many have already had it and recovered. Once we have those facts, we can take a rational approach to a solution, instead of a knee jerk reaction.

David

izonfire
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#17

I just hope you posted this safely from your fortified bunker...

Mrs. dpnewell
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#18

Well Frank, I am thrilled that you and Caren are doing better. Wouldn't it be great, if you both already had COVID19 and recovered? But without the proper testing, there is no way to know for sure. Testing should have been top priority, not a 2 trillion dollar give away.

David

izonfire
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#19

delta1 wrote:

Yeah, you better keep yourself safe Delta.
You're the only Japanese Mexican American I know.
You're our unicorn...

frankj1
Herf-A-Holic

6 years ago

#20

Mrs. dpnewell wrote:

not arguing. typically we have method differences but similar values.

also not so sure having and recovering assures that one is no longer vulnerable. I haven't seen anything either way on that question.

sharing a shake my head moment...notice goes out to all condo owners in my mother's building: "due to the need for social distancing, one person in the elevator at a time please".

so my mother (100 y.o.) tells me she and her in-home care person can't go down to get the mail together.
Tried to explain the spirit of the request, asked her if she thought they would both be safer going one at a time despite the fact they have been in the condo together for a few weeks. She actually got the point, but said she sees married couples separating at the elevator!

I guess it's all in the wording.

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