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DrafterX Offline
#51 Posted: Wed, Dec 9 2015, 11:46 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
Tony votes..?? Huh
tonygraz Offline
#52 Posted: Wed, Dec 9 2015, 6:21 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
Only missed one election so far.
tonygraz Offline
#53 Posted: Wed, Dec 9 2015, 6:22 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
Here's a gun solution from many years ago that sounds somewhat familiar: http://americannewsx.com/politics/watch-the-gop-has-finally-brought-archie-bunkers-vision-for-america-to-life-video/
TMCTLT Offline
#54 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 6:32 AM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
tonygraz wrote:
Are you really equating national origin with religion ?



Why do you hate your country so much that your willing to chance the safety and security of your fellow countrymen so the offenders can feel Welcome here?????? Do you routinely let complete strangers you know NOTHING about into your own home? I'll bet not....and for good reason, now all you need do is extend that thought process into " The Big Picture "

Is this what you want for your future generations???

https://www.rt.com/news/islam-radicalization-terrorism-europe-826/
DrafterX Offline
#55 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 9:33 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
tonygraz wrote:
Here's a gun solution from many years ago that sounds somewhat familiar: http://americannewsx.com/politics/watch-the-gop-has-finally-brought-archie-bunkers-vision-for-america-to-life-video/



He has a point... Think
tonygraz Offline
#56 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 11:21 AM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
TMCTLT wrote:
Why do you hate your country so much that your willing to chance the safety and security of your fellow countrymen so the offenders can feel Welcome here?????? Do you routinely let complete strangers you know NOTHING about into your own home? I'll bet not....and for good reason, now all you need do is extend that thought process into " The Big Picture "

Is this what you want for your future generations???

https://www.rt.com/news/islam-radicalization-terrorism-europe-826/


Where were you when the Indians first encountered immigrants ?
TMCTLT Offline
#57 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 11:24 AM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
tonygraz wrote:
Where were you when the Indians first encountered immigrants ?




Why do YOU live in the past????? and could you be a bit more clear? Which Indians and which immigrants?

And to honestly answer your stupid question....none of us were here and likely Do Not know the whole factual story and never will. But THAT was THEN and THIS is NOW
cacman Offline
#58 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 11:27 AM EST
Joined: 07-03-2010
Posts: 12,216
tonygraz wrote:
Here's a gun solution from many years ago that sounds somewhat familiar: http://americannewsx.com/politics/watch-the-gop-has-finally-brought-archie-bunkers-vision-for-america-to-life-video/

Meathead
gummy jones Offline
#59 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 11:42 AM EST
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
tonygraz wrote:
Where were you when the Indians first encountered immigrants ?



probably the same place he was when the indians were slaughtering each other or every other nation was being settled by conquest (and they literally all were)
tonygraz Offline
#60 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 1:58 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
cacman wrote:
Meathead


Archie !
tonygraz Offline
#61 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 2:00 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
TMCTLT wrote:
Why do YOU live in the past????? and could you be a bit more clear? Which Indians and which immigrants?

And to honestly answer your stupid question....none of us were here and likely Do Not know the whole factual story and never will. But THAT was THEN and THIS is NOW


There is no provision to draw in crayon here, and I doubt that would even help with you.
TMCTLT Offline
#62 Posted: Thu, Dec 10 2015, 5:14 PM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
tonygraz wrote:
There is no provision to draw in crayon here, and I doubt that would even help with you.




Yeah... and that's unfortunate....for if they did....you'd be having so much fun doing pictures by number you wouldn't have time to post your crapola...
Brewha Offline
#63 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 7:28 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
I grow more and more concerned with what appears to be a lack of understanding and sincere disregard by gun owners for the inherent danger of guns.

Some of the most intelligent people I know who happen to be enthusiasts not only fail to see any danger in stock piling weapons and ammunition, but feel the danger lies in slowing the proliferation of guns. As though guns were not an obvious liability.

Now don't get me wrong. I don't have a dog in this fight. But with a high percentage of gun owners and their families getting shot by there own "protection" I would have thought people would be a bit more realistic about the danger.

People tell me marginally rational things;
"If all the passengers had guns, there would be no hijackings"
"Gun free zone invite violence, people should be encouraged to be armed everywhere"
"My guns are safe. They would never get into another persons hands"

If a back lash in gun laws is comming, it will be because of this cavalier attitude......
gummy jones Offline
#64 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 7:55 PM EST
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
Brewha wrote:
I grow more and more concerned with what appears to be a lack of understanding and sincere disregard by gun owners for the inherent danger of guns.

Some of the most intelligent people I know who happen to be enthusiasts not only fail to see any danger in stock piling weapons and ammunition, but feel the danger lies in slowing the proliferation of guns. As though guns were not an obvious liability.

Now don't get me wrong. I don't have a dog in this fight. But with a high percentage of gun owners and their families getting shot by there own "protection" I would have thought people would be a bit more realistic about the danger.

People tell me marginally rational things;
"If all the passengers had guns, there would be no hijackings"
"Gun free zone invite violence, people should be encouraged to be armed everywhere"
"My guns are safe. They would never get into another persons hands"

If a back lash in gun laws is comming, it will be because of this cavalier attitude......


Some seem to disregard the inherent danger of people. If only a, b or c excuse didn't exist then joe, sue or Sally wouldn't have done x, y or z. Yet, since the dawn of time people have raped, murdered and pillaged by whatever means possible.

Would be interested to see your "high percentage getting shot by their own protection" because I was under the impression that the overwhelming majority (and I mean the remaining percentage is statistically insignificant) of gun owners commit no violent crimes and are not involved in any gun violence.
Brewha Offline
#65 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 8:49 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
gummy jones wrote:
Some seem to disregard the inherent danger of people. If only a, b or c excuse didn't exist then joe, sue or Sally wouldn't have done x, y or z. Yet, since the dawn of time people have raped, murdered and pillaged by whatever means possible.

Would be interested to see your "high percentage getting shot by their own protection" because I was under the impression that the overwhelming majority (and I mean the remaining percentage is statistically insignificant) of gun owners commit no violent crimes and are not involved in any gun violence.


Oh, I'm all for self protection. And yes, there is a thread of evil in all of us.

But do you really feel that we are all safer if we all arm ourselves?
Right now, bars are "gun free zones". Should we all feel safer knowing that most people are armed in the saloons?

My point is that there are limits. And that while many honorably desire to protect, is the common bearing of arms the safest way.

I see no need for a marshal society. But maybe we are not the quality society that Australia is.....
gummy jones Offline
#66 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 9:06 PM EST
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
Brewha wrote:
Oh, I'm all for self protection. And yes, there is a thread of evil in all of us.

But do you really feel that we are all safer if we all arm ourselves?
Right now, bars are "gun free zones". Should we all feel safer knowing that most people are armed in the saloons?

My point is that there are limits. And that while many honorably desire to protect, is the common bearing of arms the safest way.

I see no need for a marshal society. But maybe we are not the quality society that Australia is.....


Bars in my state aren't gun free zones
They aren't gun free zones in the state I used to live in either

Now I am not saying alcohol and guns are a good combination, but maybe that isn't the best example

To answer your first question, I don't think we can or will ever be truly safe. This thought some have that if only there were less guns we would be safe is naive at best and history has proven that century after century. That being said, I do not find much value in trading liberty and the ability to provide myself and my family a shred of protection for a false sense of security. The founding fathers seemed to have seen value in that as well.

Should everyone have a gun? Everyone who wants one, assuming they are not prohibited as already defined by the ATF (felons, drug addicts, mentally I'll, etc), in a society where we are all created equal should be afforded the right to protect themselves. Not just the rich and famous or politically connected. All of these professional gun grabbers have armed security but they don't value and/or trust us peasants the same. Heck, bloomburg has a mansion and property on one of the Caribbean islands where guns are forbidden yet he has constant armed guards all around his compound and person.

But the beauty of this country is no one is forced to believe or practice as I do so ymmv. Herfing
Covfireman Offline
#67 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 9:27 PM EST
Joined: 09-03-2015
Posts: 809
Brewha wrote:
Oh, I'm all for self protection. And yes, there is a thread of evil in all of us.

But do you really feel that we are all safer if we all arm ourselves?
Right now, bars are "gun free zones". Should we all feel safer knowing that most people are armed in the saloons?

My point is that there are limits. And that while many honorably desire to protect, is the common bearing of arms the safest way.

I see no need for a marshal society. But maybe we are not the quality society that Australia is.....



I feel safer if I am armed and no one else is.

I always feel safer around drunk people with guns they can't shoot straight . I have no worry of them shooting me .


“A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent on others for essential, particularly for military, supplies.” George Washington. He was a founding father .

Australians unarmed themselves because the come from criminal stock . Americans are differnt we come from patriotic stock.once again you're wrong .

Now make some stats up to support your position. That's what you do 97.5436% of the time
Brewha Offline
#68 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 9:49 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
I think we all can admit that having a marshal philosophy about feeling safe is a sad commentary.

Again, I am troubled by gun owners not acknowledging the risk of fire arms. They are a balanced risk and not a panacea, while many represent they are.
Brewha Offline
#69 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 9:59 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
Covfireman wrote:
I feel safer if I am armed and no one else is.

I always feel safer around drunk people with guns they can't shoot straight . I have no worry of them shooting me .


“A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent on others for essential, particularly for military, supplies.” George Washington. He was a founding father .

Australians unarmed themselves because the come from criminal stock . Americans are differnt we come from patriotic stock.once again you're wrong .

Now make some stats up to support your position. That's what you do 97.5436% of the time


My position is one of concern.

I'm not trying to take away your precious toys that abate your fears and make you feel safe. As if anyone would ever be safe...lol.

Bottom line, if you feel safe, who care if others are at risk. Right?

Now I suppose you'll tell me that every man with a gun makes us safer, yes?
gummy jones Offline
#70 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 10:02 PM EST
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
i don't know that firearms are a panacea for our country's ailments run much deeper than inanimate objects.

i don't think firearms have inherent risk except in the hands of evil or deranged people.

freedom is certainly a dangerous thing, especially in an increasingly immoral and self centered society that is hell bent on moral relativism.

as a Christian, father, hard working taxpayer, etc i am troubled by the violence, drugs, despair, etc in our society but am not so naive as to lay the blame on a tool that has been freely present in our country since its creation. yes something has changed but its not the firearms.
gummy jones Offline
#71 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 10:03 PM EST
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
Brewha wrote:

Bottom line, if you feel safe, who care if others are at risk. Right?



i would direct your very quote back at you. you obviously feel safe and that you have no need for a firearm but many may not live in your neighborhood, have your strength, have your wealth, be of the same sex, etc. shouldn't you allot them the same respect and consideration that you are requesting?
Brewha Offline
#72 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 10:37 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,201
Why Mr. Gummy Jones, that is a lucid and well though out response. And you have my propers.

I agree with the need of many to arm themselves - sad but true. I voice concern over people apparently not admitting and accordantly respecting the sewn in liability. If my daughter was in danger, I would arm her. Sometime, it is all one can do. But I respect the risk of her carrying a gun. You see, I see it is a risk in itself.

Again, my concern is with the casual and sometimes less then responceable attitues of the arms collectors I know. People just don't seem to get that being dangerous makes you dangerous. And that your tools are easily stolen.

My daughter in laws brother carries a Glock. Because he can. Keeps it in his waist. And I worry about him. He has a CCL, but a cop almost shot him once....
tonygraz Offline
#73 Posted: Mon, Dec 14 2015, 11:16 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
There seems to be more guns around now than ever before. Sales have skyrocketed lately. How many gun owners are truly responsible? How many children are injured and killed because they play with a gun found in the house ? Shouldn't there be stronger rules to ensure that those buying guns will be responsible and not pose a danger to others ?
DrafterX Offline
#74 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 8:49 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
yep... more laws will stop the bad guys for sure... Mellow
TMCTLT Offline
#75 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 9:40 AM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
tonygraz wrote:
There seems to be more guns around now than ever before. Sales have skyrocketed lately. How many gun owners are truly responsible? How many children are injured and killed because they play with a gun found in the house ? Shouldn't there be stronger rules to ensure that those buying guns will be responsible and not pose a danger to others ?




This is NOT a fluke and everyone who lives in a reality based world Knows WHY!!!!! This admin. has taken every opportunity to make it more difficult for law abiding citizens to purchase arms while knowing full well THEY are NOT the problem
This POTUS will go down in history as our Nations Top Gun Salesperson and has no one to blame but himself and other two faced Dems who think they're the only ones responsible enough to own one!!!
Why don't folks like yourself go on and on about changing the laws that allow children to die year in year out because their parents don't properly load them into their car seat????
teedubbya Offline
#76 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 9:43 AM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
It's actually easier for me to get a gun then it was ten years ago and now I can carry it with me virtually everywhere.
DrafterX Offline
#77 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 9:47 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
It would prolly be more effective if you physically carried it everywhere.... Mellow
teedubbya Offline
#78 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 9:49 AM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
I never really leave the house.
DrafterX Offline
#79 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 10:03 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
Ram has a pic of his bat... ram27bat
frankj1 Offline
#80 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 1:36 PM EST
Joined: 02-08-2007
Posts: 44,223
teedubbya wrote:
It's actually easier for me to get a gun then it was ten years ago and now I can carry it with me virtually everywhere.

Bill Gates calls reality "non-virtual".
tonygraz Offline
#81 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:27 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
teedubbya wrote:
I never really leave the house.

Did it ever fall in the toilet ?
tonygraz Offline
#82 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:29 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
In 32 states it is surprisingly very easy to get a permit to carry.
DrafterX Offline
#83 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:31 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
Not for felons... Not talking
dstieger Offline
#84 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:35 PM EST
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
At least they can fly
DrafterX Offline
#85 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:38 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
until they turn Muslim anyway... Mellow
dstieger Offline
#86 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:39 PM EST
Joined: 06-22-2007
Posts: 10,889
so if we get felons to turn Muslim we can just deport them? You might be on to something
tailgater Offline
#87 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:45 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
dstieger wrote:
so if we get felons to turn Muslim we can just deport them? You might be on to something


Tomato Tomahto
tailgater Offline
#88 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 2:46 PM EST
Joined: 06-01-2000
Posts: 26,185
frankj1 wrote:
Bill Gates calls reality "non-virtual".


I thought it was simply implied?
TMCTLT Offline
#89 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 5:09 PM EST
Joined: 11-22-2007
Posts: 19,733
tonygraz wrote:
In 32 states it is surprisingly very easy to get a permit to carry.



As it should be unless /until deemed unfit to hold it!!!!

I do however believe anyone legally purchasing a gun for someone they know cannot / should not have one should face very serious charges. ( and IF that gun was used in the commission of a crime....they do equal time!!!! )
DrafterX Offline
#90 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 5:23 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
More laws..?? Huh
victor809 Offline
#91 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 6:01 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
I'm pretty sure restricting someone from buying a gun for someone else who cannot have a gun is infringing on the people's right to bear arms... and therefore violating the 2nd amendment.

Hell, I'm pretty sure the 2nd amendment doesn't make any mention of restricting felons or mentally ill from having guns (they still qualify as people). In fact, at the time the 2nd amendment was written, the only groups that didn't count as "people" were blacks and women.... I guess black men can have 3/5ths of a gun, I think that was their value as a person at the time it was written. Women don't get guns at all.

But being extra magnanimous, I'm willing to go that extra mile. Blacks and women, along with all felons and mentally ill, should qualify when we say "right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" I'm like extra conservative for saying that.
tonygraz Offline
#92 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 7:48 PM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
C'mon Victor, you forgot the first part of the sentence, which grants the right in order to have a "well regulated militia".
teedubbya Offline
#93 Posted: Tue, Dec 15 2015, 7:59 PM EST
Joined: 08-14-2003
Posts: 95,637
That just means free Metamucil for all!
DrafterX Offline
#94 Posted: Wed, Dec 16 2015, 8:05 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
Don't count on it... ever get your Obama-phone..?? Not talking
gummy jones Offline
#95 Posted: Wed, Dec 16 2015, 8:29 AM EST
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
i want an obama watch phone
less bulky
DrafterX Offline
#96 Posted: Wed, Dec 16 2015, 8:39 AM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,559
I heard Hillary will give those away if she's elected... You'll have to buy a data plan thru Clinton.net tho.. Mellow
gummy jones Offline
#97 Posted: Wed, Dec 16 2015, 9:15 AM EST
Joined: 07-06-2015
Posts: 7,969
DrafterX wrote:
I heard Hillary will give those away if she's elected... You'll have to buy a data plan thru Clinton.net tho.. Mellow


and i heard they dont backup their servers very well so be careful
cacman Offline
#98 Posted: Wed, Dec 16 2015, 9:23 AM EST
Joined: 07-03-2010
Posts: 12,216
dstieger wrote:
so if we get felons to turn Muslim

You would be surprised how often this actually happens in the joint.
tonygraz Offline
#99 Posted: Wed, Dec 16 2015, 10:04 AM EST
Joined: 08-11-2008
Posts: 20,280
But Carson says turning gay is what happens - gay muslims ?
danmdevries Offline
#100 Posted: Wed, Dec 16 2015, 10:09 AM EST
Joined: 02-11-2014
Posts: 17,426
I lost all my guns in a tragic boating accident. Who knew a kayak couldn't hold my safe.

Guess I should buy more before the man decides I can't have em.
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