I actually have no problem with that and have seen it argued successfully... cops randomly drawing blood from non criminals who are not suspected of a crime and who have not given consent - never seen that one argued, let alone successfully, and have no reason to believe i ever will.... everyone except this cop, his boss, and you have given blanket condemnation to the actions of this officer...

late to the party...

are the cops trying to gather evidence that their unconscious brother/victim wasn't drunk, as opposed to properly investigating what occurred?

Lots of words tossed about. Would I receive the same effort if I had been the victim?

This happened back in July. There is no doubt in my mind that many of the facts we know now weren't known as this was unfolding. I'm guessing that when the officer tried to collect the blood no one knew who was the suspect and who was the victim. I'm sure that at the time of the incident they were investigating per protocol.

More importantly why would bond want the beretta over the walther. That's upsetting.

I have lol.

Cut and paste

Paul Cassell, a criminal law professor at the University of Utah's S.J. Quinney College of Law, wrote in an opinion piece for The Salt Lake Tribune that state law doesn't permit a blood draw in this situation — especially since the blood was being sought to prove the patient was not under the influence.

Wubbels' attorney, Karra Porter, said the state's implied-consent law "has no relevance in this case whatsoever under anyone's interpretation. ... The officer here admitted on the video and to another officer on the scene that he knew there was no probable cause for a warrant."

I know Anthony... there are lots and lots of stories out there with only small amounts of the available info... and no one has all the info....

Ultimately this cop and his boss are pieces of sh*t who are both currently suspended and who will both be without jobs by the end of the month.... i have no sympathy for them...

Implied consent isn't a factor. SCOTUS had made that clear in terms of blood tests since it's considered an invasive procedure. If that's his argument then he's wrong.

But that's not even the issue. This issue is whether or not he believed he had probable cause to arrest the nurse for obstructing him.

Even if that were the case I'm sure the judge would have dismissed charges but not before telling her to worry about being a nurse, leave police work to the police and let the court decide what evidence is admissible and what evidence is not.

Did you read the law professors editorial?

The cop was trying to use implied consent.

The nurse was in the right. This cop needs to go.

It was the nurse's lawyer who said the the officer was using implied consent.

Just read it. But, his opinion doesn't address a few things. He says no exigent circumstances existed, yet he doesn't give a reason. Even if he wrongly thought implied consent was relevant if exigent circumstances existed it's still admissible.

SCOTUS has also ruled that officers acting on good faith based on information provided to them by other officiers generally can't be held accountable for mistakes.

Like I have said numerous times there are waaaay too many unanswered variables to reach an informed conclusion.

Might not be the supervisor but read something suggesting it was based on the words of the DA who ordered the criminal investigation (i think)...

So, would prying open the victims trunk (I know it was a truck but I'm pursuing the search and seizure thing) without consent be cool..?? Or would it happen and let the judge decide if it was cool or not..??

Are you saying you were passed out and they put you behind the wheel..?? Or did you get ruffied and attempt to drive home..??

#128 drafterx

What I am saying is....

Once you are RUFFIED ...by FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS ( who force early released excon felons to perform the actual act) ....
And that let you drive a vehicle...either watch you get in it or even help you get to your car???

They are GUILTY OF SEVERAL FELONY CRIMES AS WELL AS GROSS NEGLIGENCE AND ENDANGERING THE PUBLIC....

P.S. drafter...when you are ILLEGALLY RUFFIED...you lose all common sense, lose all memory of anything, lose control of all bodily functions and are in no shape to drive a car.

same happens if you are legally ruffied too
tis the way of the ruffie

see?

The accident had already happened. There was no one in danger of being injured, so that argument would be invalid.
Dave (A.K.A. Homebrew)

this an an example of bad cases making bad rules...banning conversations with police in patient areas and allowing only nursing supervisors to speak to police officers can/will have negative consequences...

think about all the interactions between nurses and police and split-second decisions that have to be made in the ER...

It's an evidence thing...many cases where the blood of a victim or a suspect in a serious crime has tremendous evidentiary value...it is a lot quicker and more efficient to have some officers trained to draw blood rather than having to wait for an EMT or nurse and paying for that service...

...as standard practice, in many large city department jails, there are trained blood drawers because many DUI suspects want blood tests instead of breathalyzer or urine...seems to be a myth that it'll take awhile to get the blood sample and BAC will diminish over time, so perps opt for that...

Looks like the FBI is now involved. This cop was a complete moron from what I've been reading.

He's got to go.

That policy leads to exactly what happened. The policy itself creates and adversarial climate.

The more I read the less defendable this guys actions were. Gots to go.

Utah officer fired for handcuffing, dragging screaming nurse out of hospital
http://abcnews.go.com/US/utah-officer-fired-handcuffing-dragging-screaming-nurse-hospital/story?id=50407897


The Salt Lake City police officer featured in a widely viewed video aggressively handcuffing a hospital nurse who refused his request to draw blood from an unconscious patient without a warrant was fired on Tuesday.

The Salt Lake City Police Department said it fired Det. Jeff Payne after an internal investigation found he violated department policy when he arrested University of Utah Hospital nurse Alex Wubbels on July 26.

"I have lost faith and confidence in your ability to continue to serve as a member of the Salt Lake City Police Department," Salt Lake Police Chief Mike Brown wrote in a letter notifying Payne of the termination.

"I am deeply troubled by your lack of sound, professional judgment and your discourteous, disrespectful and unwarranted behavior, which unnecessarily escalated a situation that could and should have been resolved in a manner far different from the course of action you chose to pursue," Brown continued, according to a copy of the letter obtained by the Deseret News Tuesday.

Payne’s supervisor, James Tracy, was demoted two ranks from lieutenant to the rank of police officer over his role in the arrest. Brown said Tracy made an impulsive decision when he ordered Payne to arrest Wubbels without "fully understanding the nature of the situation and, as such, violated policy," according to his disciplinary letter, which was also obtained by the Deseret News.

The incident sparked a national conversation about the use of police force and prompted Salt Lake City Mayor Jackie Biskupski and Brown to personally apologize to Wubbels.

Payne’s attorney, Greg Skordas, said his client plans to appeal the firing, which he called unfair and over the top, according to The Associated Press. Skordas said Payne would still be employed if the body camera footage hadn't generated so much attention and blown the events out of proportion, the AP reported.

Wubbels recounted her experience in a September interview with ABC News.

She said the situation escalated as she tried to explain why she wouldn't allow the patient's blood to be drawn unless he was under arrest or if there was a police warrant.

Moreover, when Wubbels defended the hospital's policy, buttressed by a 2016 Supreme Court ruling citing that warrantless blood draws are a direct violation of the Fourth Amendment, she was rebuffed.

"I either go away with blood in vials or body in tow. That's my only choices. I'm going to follow my boss's instructions," Payne is heard saying in the bodycam video.

"I just said, 'Look, I'm sorry, we can't let you do this at this time,'" Wubbels told ABC News in an interview where she was joined by her attorney Karra Porter. "And [Payne] just got up and said, 'You're not sorry!'

"Right then he was on this war path," she added.

In the video, which Wubbels said her attorneys received through a public records request, Payne is heard declaring, "We're done!" and Wubbels wails as she's dragged outside of the hospital in handcuffs.

"I think I was able to keep my cool pretty well, because I knew I was in a tough situation," she said, noting that she continued to refer to the officer as "sir" even as he dragged her out of the hospital.

Utah nurse arrested by police reaches $500K settlement
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/358121-utah-nurse-arrested-by-police-reaches-500k-settlement