OK, so I was sitting here thinking about Kerry. What is it about one tour (4.5 months, he didn't really complete one tour) of Vietnam that makes him or anyone else think he is ready to lead a nation?

The reason I ask is because he makes such a big deal about it when so many others did so much more. Perhaps they are all qualified to lead our nation, too.

I just had to vent. I will leave now and let everyone else deal with it. 🙂

i agree with you that 4 or 5 months do not a leader make.

i ask you does being an awol officer who has been stripped of his wings make him a capable leader?

It has NEVER been proven that OUR Honorable President George W. Bush was awol and he was NEVER stripped of his wings. That is only a Silly (Rickamaven) Old mans wishful thinking. Lets not forget Mr. Rick (I got two article fifteens that I am ever so proud of)amaven made that erroneous statement.

JonR

Rick, Blood asked Hog to stop beating this dead horse (meaning posting rebuttals to your lies and innuendos) on another thread. Why dont you let him, and stop riding this into the ground? Bush has a DD214 which says he was honorably discharged (meaning that as far as the government is concerned he MET his obligations), what someone did as a teenager thirty to thirty-five years ago has little or NO bearing on what kind of a leader they are today. If you think Bush was AWOL, I'll say that if Kerry took the three-and-your out Purple-heart deal and the first one was for a self-inflicted wound, he is no better than a deserter! I don't care, I think his actions when he came home are MUCH more reprehensible. But why don't you spend some energy trying to convince the Kerry campaign to run on the issues and drop the ancient history lessons?

"We know that dictators are quick to choose aggression, while free nations strive to resolve differences in peace."

Dubya seems not to mind inviting the comparison, address to U.N. General Assembly, Sep. 21, 2004

quick to choose agression? Is that what you are implying? How quick is TWELVE YEARS of failure to co,ply with the terms of the original cease-fire? Forget the WMD, I think we waited too long there, those weapons are probably on their long circuitous way here, but time will tell. Forget mass murder, that didn't DIRECTLY affect us. But what DID affect us, was the perception, that you could agree to anything to obtain a cease-fire with the US, and then forget about complying with it! You think the rest of the world thinks we were rash and irresponsible? WHO? the French? Russians? Germany? They were all trading with Iraq in violation of UN sanctions! Who are they that we should CARE what they think? The UN? THEY had the whole "Food for Oil" program so riddled with graft that they werre simply taking a cut of the illicit profits. Of COURSE they were PO'ed we upset their little money-machine! And they will continue to be PO'ed because they want to divert attention away from their own culpability! Accept the fact that your own country is NOT the bad guys!

JonR

first i never said i had 2. as i recall i had more then that.

second, being removed from flight status because you failed to complete a physical, is the same as having your wings taken away. he can't fly, can he.

Rick

I have watched you go on and on about having wings taken away, and no President Bush did not have his wings taken away, if he had gone to the physical, at a later date, he would have been given flite status again, learn of what you speak! GWB never had his wings taken away!

Charlie

"Dubya seems not to mind inviting the comparison, address to U.N. General Assembly, Sep. 21, 2004"

I'll say this slowly so it sinks in F * * K The U.N.

for 12 long years of sanctions that NEVER worked the UN did not want to do N O T H I N G against Saddams regime.. why? read up on the Oil For Food Program and other Blood Money Embezzlements these Nations and the UN did against these sanctions and the rest of the world... Clintons Regime Included!!!!

Again say it slow but loud F * * K the U.N.

Hog

rickamaven,

Is that what your retort is? Wow, why don't you create some forged documents and send them to CBS?

Sorry, I couldn't help myself. 🙂

Charlie

he can't fly now, can he.

RussellKaufmann

which retort?

Rick,

If you really have that much trouble following the thread, it is time for you to leave. 🙂

"i ask you does being an awol officer who has been stripped of his wings make him a capable leader?"

These are accusations without merit. This was your response to my point that Kerry's less than full tour of Vietnam sure isn't sufficient to lead a country. BTW, I think W has show very clearly that he is capable of leading a country in trying times.

Now before you go on a tirade about military records, you might want to keep in mind that records get lost all of the time and some commanders are so anti-paperwork that the only papers that do get done are promotions, awards, transfers, and discharges.

Having been in the military, I can't even count how many errors there were in my records. I once took 30 days of leave and it never showed up. I took 30 days more the next year and it didn't count against my accumulated leave either. I went to the pay office to point out the errors and the clerk told me it was too much paperwork to fix it and he could only fix it if I could prove I was on leave.

As to your other comments about his wings being taken, well that is crap, too. Failing a physical could lead to losing active flight status, missing a physical would not. I used to get scheduled for tasks all the time (yes, they were orders), but would be re-tasked based on another need (also an order). By no means was I violating an order by not completing the first task. Just because there isn't a record of W's physical doesn't mean a damned thing.

RussellKaufmann

"Having been in the military, I can't even count how many errors there were in my records. I once took 30 days of leave and it never showed up. I took 30 days more the next year and it didn't count against my accumulated leave either. I went to the pay office to point out the errors and the clerk told me it was too much paperwork to fix it and he could only fix it if I could prove I was on leave."

i handled records in the air force and i would have told you to be quiet and take the extra money.

"Just because there isn't a record of W's physical doesn't mean a damned thing." i repeat, he is not allowed to fly. all that money wasted teaching him to fly went for naught and you worry about a few bucks you got overpaid because of leave time not charged to you.

Yo Rick:

Your statement:

"Having been in the military, I can't even count how many errors there were in my records."

LMAO

Why you old geezer, don't you remember telling us how you would screw up the records of Officers that you served under and didn't like, even if it meant harming their wives and childrens benifits.

Our Honorable President George W. Bush "never" had his wings taken away and still can pilot an airplane anytime he wants.

The closest you ever came to piloting an airplane is when you fill your hummingbird feeder.

I have to give the Army credit, they knew what they were doing when they turned down your application for Officer Candidate Sschool.

JonR

How do we know that he didn't take it the next day/week/time available?

You know what, it doesn't even matter. W has shown that he has what it takes leading our country through troublesome times. His belt may not go through all of the loops, but he gets the job done.

What I don't want is somebody (don't give a crap what party) that doesn't support the troops even when it comes to body armor. I don't want somebody that tries to cut intelligence dollars and doesn't even go to the freaking meetings. I want somebody that will stand up and do what they can to help. If Kerry had a plan to fight terrorism that makes sense, I would support him. If Kerry had a plan, that makes sense, to get our allies more involved, I would support him.

Would I support him over W? No, because, again, W has proven himself.