https://www.prageru.com/courses/economics/government-cant-fix-healthcare 

The Senator from Ohio makes some valid points. Please ignore the source for a minute, and listen to what he says. Then, if you can... refute it. The message... not the messenger.

Only if the Presidency, House and Senate majorities are meaningless.

Until they repeal it... their posturing was completely meaningless. Pandering f***s.

Dammit MACS. You really need to stop watching that sh#t... it'll rot your brain. I think that stuff actually inhibits a person's ability to critically think.

Problem 1 - "Why is the government so bad at healthcare?". The entire video... from the beginning starts with this as some sort of assumed truth. But does not prove it.

Their statements about it's access/cost/waste etc make assumptions that are not proven. With the amount spent by the government, can you prove that there are ways to provide more coverage, more access etc? That isn't proven.

They beg the question that government healthcare is bad, and then wedge an explanation into it about it being a 3rd party payer. The video is set up to phrase the argument around the "3rd party payer" while not making you look at the first assumption. "Oh! you can't argue it isn't a 3rd party payer!!!". It's dumb.

Then we get to the more interesting issue around health care and health insurance. The video assumes purchase of healthcare is as simple as buying a tv. That's dumb. It simply isn't. There are enormously important factors which differentiate health insurance purchases.
1 - People are optimists. There are studies done which show people have an irrational optimism about their own "odds" when looking at things like risky behavior. This would clearly impact their healthcare purchases. This in itself wouldn't be a problem, but there's a second issue with healthcare
2 - Doctors. People get fixed up, treated, medicated, whatever. Drs have been doing this since Hippocrates (I believe a sliding cost structure was actually built into Dr's books at that time). You're sick and can't afford treatment because you bought a cut-rate insurance plan? No problem, we'll treat you and charge $50 for a tongue depressor when MACS comes in to get his treatment.
3 - Bankruptcy.. Guess what happens when someone gets treated and can't pay? Yeah. They declare bankruptcy and don't pay.

Combine those issues and you simply cannot expect the free market to operate properly in this situation. People are unfortunately not willing to live (or not live) with their poor decisions. If you could show me a world where people only went and received medical treatments which they either insured themselves for, or have the income to afford... well then I would agree with your little prager video. But the real world doesn't operate like that.

So... is the solution Obamacare? No. I think Obamacare is stupid, as once you've gone and mandated everyone be insured, you sort of remove the entire point of "insurance".... the government has ensured everyone will get treated for certain medical activities, why would you add a layer of fake insurance in between, that just adds costs. I've always felt the solution was to let people die in the streets. But that seems to be unpopular.

I don't know what a popular and smart solution would be. But I know that thinking the problem can be solved in a 3 minute video is bad.

I don't wholly disagree with you. Shocking, I know... the part where people don't want to be responsible for their poor decisions is spot on. And with gov't provided health care, they don't have to.

The gov't is, ALWAYS, a 3rd party payer. They're paying a bill with your money for services they're not receiving, so they don't give a flying f*** what it costs... they just increase taxes (again).

Why is it so hard for people to understand the more gov't gets involved, the worse things become? Let the f***ing market dictate. It's the same issue with student loans. It's easier to borrow so the price goes up. For what? 4th or 5th rate professors who push their own ideals? F*** the gov't six ways to Sunday.

Let people die in the street. Especially the poor, drug addled, non-contributing to society douche bags who do nothing but take, take, take... all while providing their fellow man nothing but burden. F***-em.

The TV analogy was spot on. You know if you want LED, Smart, HDTV, 1080p, etc... same with healthcare... you know what you want, what you can afford, what you can live without... and you're right... mandating it removes the entire point. And... since you must buy it - increases the price.

The tv analogy simply isn't accurate tho.
You're going to buy something with a price you want and a coverage you expect you will need.

You will likely need more coverage than you expect (people being incorrectly optimistic). Then what happens? Do you forgo the treatment you cannot afford and did not insure yourself for? Unfortunately no. You get treated anyway (you get the 70" tv even though you only bought a 50"). You get charged for the services. You go bankrupt and pay 10% of it. And the hospital charges me a ridiculous amount for treatment to make up the cost.

We are paying regardless for the people who cannot pay. You just don't see it the way it was before Obamacare.

Yeah, people who have catastrophic illnesses get financially screwed... why is that my problem, again? They didn't buy what they needed, or didn't buy coverage at all... not my problem.

Insurance is gambling. You bet you won't need it... if you're wrong, you lose. Unlike casino gambling, the vast majority of people who did not buy health insurance were correct... they didn't need it.

The insurance companies wrote Obamacare. Who do you think it benefits? The taxpayer? Or the insurance companies?

Rhetorical, of course.

Not my point MACS (or only half my point)
It wouldn't be your problem if the world worked perfectly and those people died at home never to bother those of us who were able to afford or chose to afford sufficient insurance.

But they dont.

They get treated, because doctors have this annoying code that screws with the free market. Then I get charged for it. We were paying for the annoying sick poor before Obamacare came along. The cost gets folded into anything charged to people who can pay, or their insurance companies. Then the insurance company turns around and raises premiums to whoever is paying those.

Even if you don't see it in the form of a tax or whatever, you were still paying it.

I agree the insurance companies are profiting off Obamacare. See my point A few posts above. They are profiting because they're being paid to be a middleman in a system which no longer needs a middleman (if everyone is ultimately covered)... it's why I don't think Obamacare is a good idea. But that doesn't mean insurance is like tv's.

Partially correct... we were paying for them when they went. Which was rarely, because they don't have insurance. Most people without, do not go... they weather the storm because they don't have insurance, and can't afford it.

Now they DO have insurance, which we pay for, so they're going for runny f***ing noses and sprained ankles because they're covered... and WE pay for ALL OF THEM, instead of the catastrophes.

they used to go to the ER for runny noses when not covered cuz they had no primary care physician...and we'd pay.
Many ER's actually started to show a profit when treating actual emergencies.

Come on macs... cost structure for a Dr check up is significantly lower than an er visit... a strong argument could be made that a reduction in ER visits can easily make up for an increase in Drs office checkups.

I'm not even arguing for Obamacare. I'm just trying to tell you that the healthcare market is not as simple as a 3 minute Prager video wants you to believe.

Because they charge more, more people are going... and once again, the gov't pays with taxpayer money, and doesn't care that the doctor charges $3500 for a 5 minute visit and a prescription for antibiotics.

Is that actually happening or is that what you imagine is happening?

No it isn't.

So now the Republicans want to vote on repeal. Can you hear the careers going down the drain?

That's what a lot of folks want. They want it repealed, and not replaced.

🤔
So, I should send more peoples to the ER..?? 😕

but they voted for the guy saying better coverage for less money

they just wanted Obama stuff un-done... 😟

Shhh... don't pay attention to what people did Frank. Just what they say.