Electric vehicles - what does the future hold? · Page 40

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MACS
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#781

Yeah... $3 more a gallon than here in Jax.

It's $3.28 at Costco or Sam's right now.

Brewha
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#782

I rarely buy something based on anything other than personal need...and definitely not to make a political statement. After much research and deliberation, I've concluded that an EV will NOT be the best car for my needs, at this time. If I was still working and doing a daily 2 hour commute, I would've bought one by now. Have you seen the price of gas? $6.39/gal premium here in Corona...yikes

But a daily commute is not my primary reason for a car. Now I like to go on long road trips, often off the beaten path. Having to rely on charging stations that are rarely off the beaten path, that are susceptible to vandalism and lack of maintenance, that may be beyond the driving range of my car, forcing me to re-route in order to re-charge, along with having to stop every 3-4 hours for 30-120 minutes to recharge will take the pleasure out of pleasure trips. I'll stay with ICE cars until the EV battery technology and recharging infrastructure improves to be comparable to refilling with gasoline.

Although I may rightly be accused of being a tree hugger who cares about the environment and the condition of the home we leave for future generations, especially our kids and their kids, I am not so committed to those causes that I believe my personal life style choices make any difference. But I will continue to support and advocate for general measures to care for our planet. Even so...I'll have a double thick ribeye steak, please.

delta1 wrote:

Agreed - not the right solution for everyone - today.

But is a few years, you too could be be paying only 20 cents on the dollar for e-gas.

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#783

I hope you're right, Brew...

HockeyDad
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#784

(Brewha doesn’t know how high electricity rates are in California!)

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#785

will def crunch the numbers for cost comparison if I consider buying an electric vehicle...

Pretty sure we'll still be in CA...our home solar panel system produces more electricity than we use, providing an annual credit/surplus for which the state doesn't reimburse...I'm pretty sure that will still be the case in a couple/few years, so using our surplus electricity to charge an EV for little cost could be a tipping point...have to see what remote charging fees will be, and whether those rates are tethered to time of day (tiered pricing), making overnight charging much cheaper...

Brewha
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#786

Wow! Charging free at home (you reading this HD?) - you have my envy!

No monthly gas bill or oil changes turns into some real coin. Especially year over year.
I’d keep my eye on the numbers. And you can see the Tesla charger locations on line (all the EVs are moving to their chargers).

I will tell you after a year of ownership, I’ll never go back to gas.

Edited by user 2 years ago | Reason: Not specified

DrMaddVibe
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#787

New $4B Panasonic electric vehicle (EV) battery factory in Kansas requires so much power that the facility will need its own COAL plant to run

A coal-fired power plant in Kansas that was slated for closure will remain open after all to provide needed power for, wait for it: a new electric vehicle (EV) battery factory producing "clean" energy storage products.

In accordance with the Biden regime's ongoing efforts to force all Americans into an EV, Panasonic has built a $4 billion EV battery factory in the small Kansas City exurb of De Soto.

Local media reports state that the factory will require anywhere from 200 to 250 megawatts of electricity to function. This is roughly the amount of power needed to keep the lights on in a small city.

On track to receive a whopping $6.8 billion from fake president Joe Biden's Inflation Reduction Act, Panasonic is proving once again that in order to create "clean" energy, you have to burn a lot of "dirty" energy, rendering it a pointless endeavor.

The amount of energy the new Panasonic EV battery facility needs is so high, in fact, that a representative from Evergy, the public utility serving the factory, testified before the Kansas City Corporation Commission that there are serious "near-term challenges from a resource adequacy perspective."

Put another way, the Panasonic EV battery factory in De Soto is an energy hog of epic proportions. As such, Evergy says it will have to continue burning coal at a nearby power plant in Lawrence that was previously slated to eventually transition to natural gas production.

Environmentalists furious that coal plant will have to remain open to produce Panasonic's EV batteries

As we have been telling you, there is nothing "clean" about producing "green" energy products like EV batteries. In fact, it actually takes a much greater toll on the environment to produce EV batteries and other EV components than it does to continue building and using traditional gas-powered vehicles.

"A 15-pound lithium-ion battery holds about the same amount of energy as a pound of oil. To make that battery requires 7,000 pounds of rock and dirt to get the minerals that go into that battery," reports Cowboy State Daily. "The average EV battery weighs around 1,000 pounds."

"All of that mining and factory processing produces a lot more carbon dioxide emissions than a gas-powered car, so EVs have to be driven around 50,000 to 60,000 miles before there's a net reduction in carbon dioxide emissions."

In other words, as increasingly more EV battery and other EV product factories get built across the U.S. to accommodate the Biden regime's "green" pipe dream, the environment will become more and more destroyed, which has left many environmentalists feeling betrayed as they recoil in fury.

Testifying before federal lawmakers and members of the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission in Washington, D.C., recently was American Coal Council CEO Emily Arthun, who spelled it all out with clarity.

"I met with senators and representatives who understand that we're going to need coal for far longer than people are talking about," Arthun said, explaining that the "green" energy industry requires massive amounts of "dirty" energy to stay afloat.

"People are starting to understand that energy needs are increasing, and these premature [coal-fired power plant] closures are a liability."

Rep. Cyrus Western (R-Wyo.) said much the same to Cowboy State Daily, stating that "kilowatts don't just fall out of the sky."

"That electricity has got to come from somewhere," he said. "It's not going to come from solar farms and wind turbines."

EVs like those sold by Tesla are a scam. Learn more at GreenTyranny.com.

https://www.naturalnews.com/2023-09-26-panasonic-ev-factory-kansas-power-coal-plant.html

Meanwhile over at the Big 3...the unions are fighting for 32 hr work weeks, 40% more pay all while management is trying to kill off ICE's like Fuehrer Biden and the DNC are enabling them. This while the public demand has soured on EV ownership. What....could...go...wrong....

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#788

this article says EV sales for the first half of 2023 is up 47% over last year, so demand is not dropping, in most of the world...figures are attributed to Kelley Blue Book

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/27072023/inside-clean-energy-ev-supply-demand-lower-prices/#:~:text=In%20the%20first%20half%20of,and%203.1%20percent%20in%202021 .

Edited by user 2 years ago | Reason: Not specified

HockeyDad
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#789

Yup, dealerships can’t even keep EVs in stock. People are just stampeding to get EVs because of the free green electricity.

Gene363
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#790

Yup, dealerships can’t even keep EVs in stock. People are just stampeding to get EVs because of the free green electricity.

HockeyDad wrote:

Rimshot!

Do any dealers have anything in actual stock? Most of them have customers on waiting lists and manufacturers have lots full of new cars waiting for critical parts before they can be delivered.

The escape pod: https://cigarbid.freeforums.net

DrMaddVibe
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#791

delta1 wrote:

Uh oh...

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/tesla-delivers-435059-vehicles-q3-missing-estimates-blames-planned-downtime [/i][/color]

Look out below!

Brewha
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#792

Uh oh...

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/tesla-delivers-435059-vehicles-q3-missing-estimates-blames-planned-downtime [/i][/color]

Look out below!

DrMaddVibe wrote:

Tesla is retooling for the Cybertruck production and the new upgrade of the Model 3.

The Cybertruck set the record for the most pre-ordered vehicle in history - Almost two million reservations.

And the Tesla Model Y is the highest selling vehicle the world - beating out gas Toyotas.

So the "look out below" is the Big Three crapping their pants......

DrMaddVibe
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#793

Brewha wrote:

Only you would care about people crapping their pants losing billions of dollars.

Ya know what you don't see tooling down the road? Ferrari 250 GTO's.

Good luck with your trendy little fart car. Is it true it can go 6 covid vaccinations an hour? I bet all the little Kardashians can't wait to be seen in the mall parking lots whispering down the lane off to the grocery store.

Brewha
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#794

Tesla, Kia and even Porsche with their EVs have highlighted that the American big three are the portraits of complacency. They could be a decade ahead, but they are a decade behind.

GM just continues to make bad decisions. Making the Bolt an economy car wanna be, stuffing electric motors in legacy designs, and a 3 ton Hummer EV. Ford does better, but Dodge is still “thinking” about EVs. They just don’t like new technology.

Btw, Ferrari sucks.

Oh, and you just enjoy your Fred Flintstone mobile.
Yabba dabba do!!

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#795

fossil fuel and Big Three American auto industry propaganda machines are relying on their willingly uninformed base of supporters to keep swallowing their misinformation, disinformation and distortions to provide them cover so they can maintain the status quo as long as possible while they keep their coffers filled...

meanwhile a peek behind the curtain reveals internal documents acknowledging their role in environmental destruction and the need to take risk management action while continuing the public subterfuge campaign...here's one example:

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2023/01/harvard-led-analysis-finds-exxonmobil-internal-research-accurately-predicted-climate-change/#:~:text=The%20researchers%20report%20that%20Exxon,would%20lead%20to%20dangerous%20warming .

dkeage
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#796

How do they get the electricity?

delta1
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#797

mostly using fossil fuels...of which the exhaust is cleaner than that produced by ICEs

the environmental savings are from the unused/unburned fuel of the EVs vs ICE vehicles that have long life spans producing exhausts

Edited by user 2 years ago | Reason: Not specified

DrMaddVibe
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#798

"Midnight Massacre": Tesla Slashes Model 3, Model Y Prices Yet Again

If ever there was a shred of doubt about Elon Musk's intentions to move more volume at lower prices for Tesla this year, those thoughts should officially be put to bed.

Tesla shares are dipping slightly lower on Friday morning after it was reported late Thursday night that Tesla would be making even more price cuts to its Model 3 and Model Y vehicles.

The new cuts to model prices are as follows:

Model 3 Now $38,990 From $40,240

Model 3 Performance Now $50,990 From $53,240

Model 3 Long Range Price Cut To $45,990 From $47,240

Model Y Long Range Now $48,490 From $50,490

Model Y Performance Now $52,490 From $54,490

So far, the price cuts have been a winning formula for Tesla, allowing the automaker to remain at the tip of the demand spear in a global EV race that is now beyond super-saturated with competition.

The price cuts come just days after Tesla missed its modest Q3 delivery estimates. In Q3, the company delivered 435,059 vehicles and produced 430,488 vehicles, missing consensus delivery estimates of 456,722.

The quarter marked the first sequential drop in total deliveries since Q2 2022. Prior to that, the last sequential drop in total deliveries occurred in early 2020, as the chart below shows.

The company acknowledged the miss and chalked it up to downtime, stating in its press release the "sequential decline in volumes was caused by planned downtimes for factory upgrades, as discussed on the most recent earnings call."

CEO Elon Musk had said on the company's last conference call that it would “continue to target 1.8 million vehicle deliveries this year.” However, he also warned about production numbers dwindling due to "summer shutdowns for a lot of factory upgrades.”

Analyst Gordon Johnson of GLJ Research called the price cuts a "Midnight Price Cut Massacre" in a note out Friday morning, and suggested that the Q3 miss was not due to line upgrades, but rather due to lack of demand.

"Tesla is already resorting to margin-destroying price cuts just five days into the fourth quarter of 2023," he wrote. "Despite selling only 4,500 more cars than it produced in the third quarter and entering the fourth with a record inventory of 106,000 cars, it's clear that Tesla's issues rest mainly with lackluster demand."

"This means to hit its goal of 1.8mn cars produced in 2023, Tesla may have to sell those cars at negative net income margins," he continued.

Recall, back in mid-September, Goldman had both predicted that the company could lower prices further and questioned whether or not the constant price cuts from the EV leader could take its toll on the company's bottom line. As a result, they lowered estimates.

Analyst Mark Delaney wrote in a note in September: “We believe that Tesla could further lower prices in 2024 to support higher volumes, which we believe will mitigate the EPS benefit from cost reductions.”

The note continued: “We lower our 2023 and 2024 EPS estimates for Tesla, mostly on lower ASPs and, in turn, auto gross margin ex-credit assumptions (driven by lower prices for S/X and, to a lesser extent, Model Y, and partly offset by higher Model 3 ASP assumptions)."

Goldman called the company's price cuts into question, noting they could have a negative effect on Tesla's bottom line, Teslarati reported:

“Tesla materially reduced S/X pricing on 9/1 by 15-19%, and reduced Model Y pricing in China in mid-August (and has been discounting inventory on hand in other markets like the US this quarter). However, Tesla raised pricing on the Model 3 with the refreshed version (Highland) that is now being sold in Europe and China.”

But it wasn't all criticism over price cuts. Canadian VC and self-labeled "SPAC Jesus" Chamath Palihapitiya was out over Labor Day weekend praising the speed and aggressiveness of Tesla's price cuts, which ultimately do seem to be moving metal.

"Some companies cut prices, but most keep prices flat or increase them," he added. "Some companies improve products quickly. But no one has actually given you more for less on such a big ticket purchase so frequently."

Recall, we also noted in August that Tesla had cut the price of its Model S Plaid in China by 19%.

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/midnight-price-cut-massacre-tesla-slashes-model-3-model-y-prices-yet-again

Imagine about now Masky McFart Car is wondering how much money he spent vs what he could get the same for now? Rah Rah Rah. New models are supposed to come with pom-pom's and a $25 Starbucks gift card.

Brewha
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#799

And you don't see the big three dropping prices - in fact the dealer network still practices date rate on pricing.

As Tesla production continues to ramp up, the cost per unit is dropping. And with the giga-press method coming online, cost will drop further. This does not bode well for the big three.

Oh, and DMV - "my car is much better than yours"
Yabba Dabba Doo!

Brewha
Herf-A-Holic

2 years ago

#800

delta1 wrote:

True enough - note that our local anti-EV shrill (DMV) see price cuts as a bad thing.......

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