I think rather than the negativity of when we fail, we should speculate ideas on how to dig our way out of this mess. If you were on a sinking ship would you sit there and say dang this captain steered us wrong? or would you consider your options, do you try and save the ship or what can I do to insure my safety? Personally, I think these are the questions that must be addressed.

raymallen wrote:

I think that was a quote from some Roman.

HockeyDad wrote:

We're in a new age brother, the argument doesn't fly anymore. The only people that depended on the Roman economy at that time were the Romans, the entire world runs on our economy now. You think China would let us go under? by the way the U.S. owns almost half of it's own debt, you think we will let ourselves go under?

raymallen wrote:

But as far as default, we're the largest economy, we are the country to big to fail.

raymallen wrote:

To put things more in perspective, here's a handy reference of other empires and dynasties that were 'too big to fail'...several even lasted more than 1000 years. They have one important thing in common...they are all history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_empires 

DadZilla3 wrote:

I never said everything was okay, I only suggested we have not defaulted (which is a factual statement). Our deficit is about 1.3 trillion at the moment and our GDP is hovering around the 14.5 trillion area. America holds a significant portion of our bonds, so to say American will go bankrupt is just unreasonable. I admire your passion, but we need to look at the numbers first before we jump to conclusions.

raymallen wrote:

Have you looked at the projections OwedumbaCare is adding?

Not to mention the other wars he's started since taking office!

Please.

You think we're the center of the world...I believe the English had a saying that the sun never sets on it's empire...how'd that work out for them again?

We're in a world of hurt. For the first time in our history MY kids and grandkids are slaves to a debt they had NO part of. Kicking the can down the road because we can print our own money only devalues the currency. That's the ONLY thing we have in our favor. That just buys time. Too bad we have a corrupt Federal Reserve at the helm...answerable to NOBODY.


NOBODY is cutting a damn thing and entitlements are at all time highs. Look to Greece and Spain...our day of reckoning is coming.

DrMaddVibe wrote:

If we crumble, everyone crumbles. So many economies (including China) rely on us. If we start at square one again, we're not alone.

raymallen wrote:

If we crumble, everyone crumbles. So many economies (including China) rely on us. If we start at square one again, we're not alone.

raymallen wrote:

Ever watch the Mad Max movies and ask yourself..."What caused those wars?"

One day you'll have to look at the headlines and read between the lines. Travel abroad and see for yourself. The United States...America...we're not the good guys. We had a good run. We wasted the goodwill somewhere after WWII and The Korean War. Sorry if that damages your viewpoint but it's the truth!

I didn't want to think we were colonizing anyone, but we're putting bases and listening stations all over the world in countries that make you go "Huh?". Our involvement in destabilizing the Middle East is a joke and what we're ramping up in Africa right now should send shivers down anyone's spine. We're meddling in freely elected nations and blurring everything..all paid for on the taxpayer's dime. Speaking of which...let's be honest for a second while we're at it...can we both admit that the rich will be able to exploit every single loophole to hang on to their phat cash?

I don't want us to crumble. I take no personal liability in it and mourn for our children and for the nation moving forward but we're screwed, glued and tattooed and we're going to go down. I'm not really sure what economics classes you went to where the mountain of debt we have versus what we manufacture and export and sell is slanted towards debt is sold as a positive. Forget the fact that nations that would love to put their boot on our throat and see us crumble delight in our demise. Look at the monetizing of the debt. Quantitive Easing is what it's called. It's devaluing our money's worth and the ability to dig ourselves out quicker. Only when factions like the Tea Party band together and form a voice does Washington DC take notice. Look at what they did too? Painted them as kooks...violent thugs...angry mobs...when the facts don't bear that out...why? BECAUSE WE THREATENED THEIR POWER BASE AND AUTHORITY! We overturned their apple cart and voted bums out. We need to vote them all out every damn cycle! They're the problem.

You mentioned something earlier that piqued my interest. You said government plays a role. Please define that for me if you would.

DrMaddVibe wrote:

Now that's a response I can appreciate from a true American!

To answer your question about the role of government. I'm a finance student, (a damn good one in my opinion) I have have met with many people involved in the industry including some very powerful banks. I may be just assuming here, but from what I gather you prefer a complete free market society. If this were the case, you would see one bank run the whole show, because they know the information you will never have, and in all reality one firm can run a more efficient business than 10. With out every one having the same knowledge there is no efficiency in the market (the market has never been entirely efficient). Perhaps we should completely throw away our legal system with the government?

And in response to the rich "exploiting". the top income earners pay most of the taxes, in a "fair" society shouldn't every one pay the exact same dollar amount?

raymallen wrote:

You can truely NOT PARTICIPATE IN BUYING A PRODUCT OR SERVICE!


You CANNOT choose to not participate in our govt.

ZRX1200 wrote: