KingoftheCove
6 years ago
Cheating?!
In baseball??
I don’t believe it!
MACS
6 years ago
Coach and GM got canned by the owner. MLB also suspended them for a year for their sign stealing.

Had to be pretty bad for a punishment like that.
ZRX1200
6 years ago
The New England Patriots of baseball......


Oh wait......Red Sox got busted too.
frankj1
6 years ago
Red Sox was new cheating...common denominator? Manager Cora.
In light of the one year suspensions without pay (and then fired) for Houston's manager and GM, Cora could get the Pete Rose treatment!


old cheating pre-Cora by Sox was in the way they relayed the info, not in the way they stole signs, which is an ancient and honorable tradition.
dkeage
6 years ago
Ahhh. What a time to be a Houston sports fan... [frypan]
MACS
6 years ago

Ahhh. What a time to be a Houston sports fan... [frypan]

dkeage wrote:



You're certainly welcome aboard the Niner bandwagon. Seats are filling up fast.
streetrod
6 years ago
As far as I Am concerned, they deserved it.
The NFL should grow a set & use this as a model on how to handle cheaters.
DrMaddVibe
6 years ago

As far as I Am concerned, they deserved it.
The NFL should grow a set & use this as a model on how to handle cheaters.

streetrod wrote:




so...does that make the Dodgers a 2 time world champion???
USNGunner
6 years ago

Tim Flannery and Lunatic Fringe
·

They are fining teams who try to steal signs ...hahahaha..got out just in time .

Ok...I feel a need to speak out, normal is changing, and today's norm is not the norm.

For 26 years I was in the big leagues , 10 as a player, 16 as a 3rd base coach , 20 if you count the other years learning the craft in the minor leagues , from Boise , to Wichita. The seriousness of the writer, the expertise from the front office man, the commissioner, to those who have never lived it. Here it is...I have 25 World Series games under my belt, 7 elimination games, and a 7th game of a World Series. 5 World Series ,3 World Championships I know it don't mean much to those in front of a computer, with the answers and all the rules. So I'm gonna make a long story short.

I had a video camera on every 3rd base coach every single night, I spent hours logging tapes trying to steal your signs and finding a way to beat you. You as well did it, in New York I knew the Valentine Mets did it, I knew the Cubs did it, I knew the Dbacks, St. Louis did it, I caught them, that's when the fun begins , you **** em up by changing signs, you tell the boys " if I put a hit and run on first pitch don't do anything, they will pitch out and now they don't have the signs, and you're in a hitters count" the list goes on and on.....if you aren't smart enough ( and believe me this isn't rocket science, it's being somewhat aware) it's your fault, now the game is turned into no breaking up double plays , don't slide hard at home, don't block the plate.if you are not creative enough to derail them, you've stopped thinking.

As far as some of the greatest baseball writers who I love, read and listen to, and hang with. You are so off on the sign stuff. It's a high stakes poker game, big money especially as coaches . If you get caught , if your signs are stolen and you don't know in the moment they are close, they are on you...your not thinking, and now because of that the commissioner comes in not understanding, the writers write stealing signs is wrong.

We had an advance scout that could watch your 3rd base coach for 3 days and be real close to getting his signs. He would send his report and I would watch you, or have a camera on you, if you haven't played , you don't understand how important this part of the game should be. You don't understand I would not only try and steal your hit and run sign, I would put our hit and run on that my guys knew, then in the same sequence put the other teams hit and run on so when they look at their cameras that we all used to steal the signs they would see and in their minds " **** they have the same sign for hit and run we have".

It's propaganda war fare, its trying to beat you......so why you claim people aren't watching baseball because it takes to long, I say your taking the smarts out of it. ...I tried every night for 16 years to steal your signs either writing every thing you did down, or by looking at tapes because I had a camera on you, just like you had on me. Please leave the game alone, and every writer who wrote articles on this..be in church Sunday,because I know for a fact everyone of you looked at body language , vibe, and found a way to snake another writer to get the feature, get the win., leaving it with no creativity, no thinking, and the dumbing down of the greatest game ever......not that I know anything about it....Peace Tim Flannery.



And another from 2014.

https://www.sfgate.com/sports/shea/article/Claps-taps-and-the-game-behind-the-signs-5347597.php 
cajunpredfan
6 years ago
I agree with you USNGunner, it's part of the game. Played through high school and at every level we tried to steal/figure out the opponents signs. And, as Flannery stated, you can really f with a team if they think they have your signs.
KingoftheCove
6 years ago
Thanks Gunner!
That is a great piece.
Always liked Flannery.
teedubbya
6 years ago
Need to read the flannery article later.

Stealing signs is age old. Electronics and technology use to do so isn’t and has never been acceptable.

Baseball is a traditional game. Right now they are drawing the line there. Maybe that’s worthy of discussion, but right now the Astros etc were forewarned. It was not unclear and they knew it. They chose to cheat.
frankj1
6 years ago
good read, Vince. Stealing signs is one of the fun parts of baseball.
It's no more cheating than having signs in the first place. Signs are a silent way of telling your team what to try, what to do, what to expect, and stealing them has always been allowed.

So it was randomly determined in recent years to not allow the incorporation of now available tech tools. Why not?
But as long as they are banned, then those charged are guilty of the way they stole and communicated what was stolen, but the end result...stolen signs...remains part of the game.

It's messed up. And Cora just may get the Pete Rose treatment.

And a .231 lifetime hitter still won't be able to hit a curveball.
teedubbya
6 years ago
Specifically told it was forbidden before doing it anyway.

You can argue if it should be forbidden or not, and work to change it, but you can not do what has been expressly forbidden and clearly communicated and not expect severe consequences. And presumably all of your peers are following the directive and not doing so. It is then an unfair advantage.

I’m for changing the rules but not retroactively to benefit those inclined to break them as they feel fit. Tegridy... it’s not just a farm.
frankj1
6 years ago

Specifically told it was forbidden before doing it anyway.

You can argue if it should be forbidden or not, and work to change it, but you can not do what has been expressly forbidden and clearly communicated and not expect severe consequences. And presumably all of your peers are following the directive and not doing so. It is then an unfair advantage.

I’m for changing the rules but not retroactively to benefit those inclined to break them as they feel fit. Tegridy... it’s not just a farm.

teedubbya wrote:


yes. did not mean to sound opposed to the punishments

frankj1 wrote:
But as long as they are banned*, then those charged are guilty of the way they stole and communicated what was stolen,

*
"they are banned"..."they" being various technologies that were illegally employed to steal signs.
teedubbya
6 years ago
Got it. Wasn’t necessarily directing it to you. Figured you might be supporting them however since they really didn’t kill anyone.
frankj1
6 years ago

Got it. Wasn’t necessarily directing it to you. Figured you might be supporting them however since they really didn’t kill anyone.

teedubbya wrote:


all sports are doing the limbo without bending under The Hernandez Bar.


also, this literally just in (on my local news channel while I am typing)
Red Sox and Alex Cora part ways

WOW!
teedubbya
6 years ago
I can clearly remember more than one pats fan wanting them to get credit for releasing Hernandez. And that’s just in here.

Glad Cora is gone. The more I read the more I hope this involved go away for awhile. I think some players need a parking too.
frankj1
6 years ago
wasn't here.
we were begging the Pats to dump him the day they drafted him.
Whistlebritches
6 years ago

The New England Patriots of baseball......


Oh wait......Red Sox got busted too.

ZRX1200 wrote:




L'il brother you need a wedgie………………...one of those that crosses your eyes and makes your nose bleed.Cora was the bench coach for the Astro's back in 2017 when all this sign stealing mess started.Has schit to do with the Red Sox,cept we less than a month away from spring training with no manager.


Put that wedgie in the little IOU book...….looking forward to seeing you next trip out west.
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