| 101. Author: Burner02 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 11:10AM EST | |
Some sources claim tear gas was used some sources say it was not. Protesters were asked to move three times prior to the curfew of 1900. They would not disband, began throwing items and got moved.
Unless it has been added in recent years to riot control training handbook, there are no provisions for special handling of press personnel when they are mixed in with the protesters that are being forcibly moved. Next time I recommend to the press that they find a safer vantage point or to beat feet and get out of the way. |
| 102. Author: victor809 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 11:15AM EST | |
opelmanta1900 wrote:I think it could've been interpreted as strength had the crackdown coincided with the actual violence the protesters had shown the night before...
Instead, they waited 24 hours assuming the same violence would occur... It didn't, but the press conference was already started and the plans were already in place...
So they pulled the rip cord... But they were already on the pavement... And when you pull the rip cord on the ground you only have 2 choices... You can say oops or you can spread your arms and pretend to fly...
And now what we've got is a wounded duck standing in a Wal-Mart parking lot who thinks he's an eagle soaring above an Alaskan forest... An apt analogy. |
| 103. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 11:19AM EST | |
A play with words is happening. Pepper gas is not tear gas....
I saw it live. It wasn’t right. |
| 104. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 11:21AM EST | |
They did not begin throwing objects then got moved. Barr ordered it to clear the space for the prez to walk. And they didn’t do it because of curfew or in response to violence. They let the protests go on everywhere else. Instead they used military maneuvers including helicopters, some sort of gas or spray and horses to clear an area for a really strange photo op. It will be one moment that defines this presidency. It’s really weak and small, and it was on tv live as the idiot pretty much said it would happen. It was planned. |
| 105. Author: DrMaddVibe | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 12:18PM EST | |
teedubbya wrote:A play with words is happening. Pepper gas is not tear gas....
I saw it live. It wasn’t right. Statement from United States Park Police acting Chief Gregory T. Monahan about the actions taken over the weekend to protect life and property
Date: June 2, 2020
Contact: [email protected]
The United States Park Police (USPP) is committed to the peaceful expression of First Amendment rights. However, this past weekend’s demonstrations at Lafayette Park and across the National Mall included activities that were not part of a peaceful protest, which resulted in injuries to USPP officers in the line of duty, the destruction of public property and the defacing of memorials and monuments. During four days of demonstrations, 51 members of the USPP were injured; of those, 11 were transported to the hospital and released and three were admitted.
Multiple agencies assisted the USPP in responding to and quelling the acts of destruction and violence over the course of the weekend in order to protect citizens and property.
On Monday, June 1, the USPP worked with the United States Secret Service to have temporary fencing installed inside Lafayette Park. At approximately 6:33 pm, violent protestors on H Street NW began throwing projectiles including bricks, frozen water bottles and caustic liquids. The protestors also climbed onto a historic building at the north end of Lafayette Park that was destroyed by arson days prior. Intelligence had revealed calls for violence against the police, and officers found caches of glass bottles, baseball bats and metal poles hidden along the street.
To curtail the violence that was underway, the USPP, following established policy, issued three warnings over a loudspeaker to alert demonstrators on H Street to evacuate the area. Horse mounted patrol, Civil Disturbance Units and additional personnel were used to clear the area. As many of the protestors became more combative, continued to throw projectiles, and attempted to grab officers’ weapons, officers then employed the use of smoke canisters and pepper balls. No tear gas was used by USPP officers or other assisting law enforcement partners to close the area at Lafayette Park. Subsequently, the fence was installed.
Throughout the demonstrations, the USPP has not made any arrests. The USPP will always support peaceful assembly but cannot tolerate violence to citizens or officers or damage to our nation’s resources that we are entrusted to protect.
https://www.nps.gov/subjects/uspp/6_2_20_statement_from_acting_chief_monahan.htmOdd. Are you sure you were really there? |
| 106. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 12:20PM EST | |
Lol. It’s a shell game. 3 card montee etc. the willing buy it. Who made who, why and how. I saw what I saw. I’ll believe my lyin eyes.
But don’t wear a mask that’s a vast worldwide government lie. |
| 107. Author: Burner02 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 1:47PM EST | |
teedubbya wrote:They did not begin throwing objects then got moved. Barr ordered it to clear the space for the prez to walk. And they didn’t do it because of curfew or in response to violence. They let the protests go on everywhere else. Instead they used military maneuvers including helicopters, some sort of gas or spray and horses to clear an area for a really strange photo op. It will be one moment that defines this presidency. It’s really weak and small, and it was on tv live as the idiot pretty much said it would happen. It was planned. I don't have a problem with the photo op but must say it was not well executed. Didn't know that national guard troops wearing their helmet and PPE constitutes military maneuvers. It must have been the one mil helicopter used to monitor protesters that made the maneuvers. Pepper balls, CS gas and smoke make it a real protest. If the protesters didn't want get a taste, then leave as asked and return the next day. Problem avoided. As far as this defining this presidency, I think not. The left will find plenty more in their mind. |
| 108. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 1:53PM EST | |
I didn’t say national guard troops wearing anything constituted military maneuvers. *shrug*. Much more happened but I’m not trying to convince you. Your mind is made up and to be fair in the absence of new info so am I. |
| 109. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 1:53PM EST | |
They used smoke grenades and they used pepper paint guns on people who refused to leave where they were ordered to at curfew at a park. And there were fires which led to the curfew order. |
| 110. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 1:58PM EST | |
The night before. It was peaceful and the president wanted the space for a weird photo op to convince folks he actually has held one of those bible things before.
Things are pretty well documented. It was pre-planned. But I’m going on what I saw. No fires, no throwing and only pushed back for the photo which he made a clumsy proclamation that he was going to do. |
| 111. Author: DrafterX | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:00PM EST | |
meanwhile a retired cop was killed by protesters... but hey, Trump posed with a bible.. I'm sure the outrage is in the right place...  |
| 112. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:05PM EST | |
DrafterX wrote:meanwhile a retired cop was killed by protesters... but hey, Trump posed with a bible.. I'm sure the outrage is in the right place... It is possible to be mad about both and find both wrong. At least to most folks. |
| 113. Author: DrafterX | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:07PM EST | |
Shana said you can only be mad about one thing at a time.... That's why Spey left and stuff... |
| 114. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:10PM EST | |
I know. Screw Shana. |
| 115. Author: DrafterX | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:11PM EST | |
|
| 116. Author: victor809 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:15PM EST | |
teedubbya wrote:I know. Screw Shana. Free TW! Just getting a jump on it. |
| 117. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:18PM EST | |
“ Washington, D.C., descended into utter chaos Sunday as an 11 p.m. curfew kicked in, with fires set in Lafayette Square and the historic St. John’s Church burning.” |
| 118. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:19PM EST | |
“ Multiple fires broke out in Lafayette Park, and police told USA Today that two Target stores in the area had been broken into.
“It looks like a war zone outside the White House,” tweeted Democratic strategist and consultant Adam Parkhomenko above a short video showing fire and thick smoke behind graffiti-covered cement barriers.” |
| 119. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:20PM EST | |
This was Monday when that was not happening. It was peaceful at the time and purely for show. |
| 120. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:20PM EST | |
“ Meanwhile, firefighters fought a blaze set at St. John’s Episcopal Church, a historic house of worship across the street from the White House” |
| 121. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:20PM EST | |
Monday. |
| 122. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:21PM EST | |
So tell me the curfew was NOT STILL in effect. |
| 123. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:22PM EST | |
And when park police give an order to disperse at the curfew......
And we have the backdrop of the previous behaviors.
|
| 124. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:22PM EST | |
They did nothing to anyone but in that small space. It wasn’t to enforce curfew. It was for a photo op. |
| 125. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:23PM EST | |
It was an authoritarian planned move |
| 126. Author: DrafterX | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:25PM EST | |
it's ok to break da law if you do it peacefully.... and the police can't make you stop... |
| 127. Author: rfenst | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:29PM EST | |
DrafterX wrote:it's ok to break da law if you do it peacefully.... and the police can't make you stop... The police response must be approximately in proportion to any offense. |
| 128. Author: DrafterX | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:32PM EST | |
how should the police respond if people don't cooperate..??  |
| 129. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:32PM EST | |
So yes the curfew was still in place.
And yes, Park Police in fact gave a lawful order to disperse.
|
| 130. Author: opelmanta1900 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:33PM EST | |
DrafterX wrote:how should the police respond if people don't cooperate..?? "Rape em all to death" |
| 131. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:35PM EST | |
ZRX1200 wrote:So yes the curfew was still in place.
And yes, Park Police in fact gave a lawful order to disperse.
Evidently just in a one or two block area that happened to be where a planned photo op was |
| 132. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:36PM EST | |
And don’t forget bill Barr’s role. |
| 133. Author: DrafterX | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:40PM EST | |
Wheel's dead...  |
| 134. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:49PM EST | |
Misuse of power vs desired outcomes and our acceptance for bad behavior.
The irony...I wouldn’t get caught up seeing people’s acceptance where it isn’t. |
| 135. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:50PM EST | |
Z I know better. It’s a discussion. |
| 136. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:51PM EST | |
👍 |
| 137. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:52PM EST | |
The Cheeto colored lense isn’t from one side, it frustrates me when it’s present but really not the lasting issue. Levers of division n stuff |
| 138. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:56PM EST | |
Federal overreach is ok when it’s my team, federal overreach is ok when it’s incremental, federal overreach is ok because I really don’t like those people.
|
| 139. Author: rfenst | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:59PM EST | |
DrafterX wrote:how should the police respond if people don't cooperate..?? Depends how they are failing to cooperate. An obviuos example would be a sit-in. The cops wouldn't belong intentionally hurting anyone. Another would be the crowd attacking the police. That neccessitates extrem force. |
| 140. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 2:59PM EST | |
DrafterX wrote:Wheel's dead... Wonder if he’d prefer curfew or mask. It seems in here curfews need strict enforcement but masks or stay at home not so much. |
| 141. Author: DrafterX | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:00PM EST | |
ZRX1200 wrote: Levers of division n stuff  |
| 142. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:00PM EST | |
ZRX1200 wrote:Federal overreach is ok when it’s my team, federal overreach is ok when it’s incremental, federal overreach is ok because I really don’t like those people.
It’s partly true the reasons for it may vary by individual. |
| 143. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:04PM EST | |
rfenst wrote:Depends how they are failing to cooperate. An obviuos example would be a sit-in. The cops wouldn't belong intentionally hurting anyone. Another would be the crowd attacking the police. That neccessitates extrem force. Like throwing a painfully large pickle at them.  |
| 144. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:05PM EST | |
ZRX1200 wrote:Like throwing a painfully large pickle at them. Never been an issue for me |
| 145. Author: rfenst | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:09PM EST | |
ZRX1200 wrote:Like throwing a painfully large pickle at them. That would only be appropriate if the protestor is mooning the police. |
| 146. Author: ZRX1200 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:15PM EST | |
Are you a dill or sweet guy Robert? |
| 147. Author: Burner02 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:37PM EST | |
teedubbya wrote:I didn’t say national guard troops wearing anything constituted military maneuvers. *shrug*. Much more happened but I’m not trying to convince you. Your mind is made up and to be fair in the absence of new info so am I. You are the one that brought military maneuvers and helicopters (plural) up. I was just trying to help explain your take on the situation to the untrained eye and ear. Do you have any idea on how many fire teams were deployed? That would be some good info to have. Maybe we can check with Jonesy on his intel. |
| 148. Author: HockeyDad | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 3:42PM EST | |
Heard they fired white phosphorous 155mm artillery rounds. |
| 149. Author: victor809 | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 4:01PM EST | |
Hah.... Even the CDC is apparently defining what was used as tear gas
https://www.forbes.com/sites/rachelsandler/2020/06/02/trump-campaign-says-tear-gas-wasnt-used-to-clear-protesters-cdc-guidelines-say-otherwise/#5330a0211b69
I mean, I was willing to give this one to bunker baby, since I think it's perfectly plausible that civilians wouldn't know the difference between tear gas canisters shot at them, or pepper spray shot at them.
but apparently that was a lie of his as well. |
| 150. Author: teedubbya | Date: Wed, 6/3/2020, 4:12PM EST | |
Burner02 wrote:You are the one that brought military maneuvers and helicopters (plural) up. I was just trying to help explain your take on the situation to the untrained eye and ear.
Do you have any idea on how many fire teams were deployed? That would be some good info to have. Maybe we can check with Jonesy on his intel.
They did use military maneuvers. I didn’t say anything about what the guard or anyone else was wearing (etc). You chose to argue with something I didn’t say to prove what I did say wrong. That only proves it to yourself. If expanding what I was saying is for clarity let me clarify. It wasn’t what I was saying. |
