Abrignac
6 years ago

Anthony, the ones that everyone was rallying about were struck.

All that was being debated were the ones dsteig identified. I don't agree with them (I'm fine with former felons having a gun) but they are not the insane ones which started the rally)

Also, I don't know what page it was but they specifically discussed bringing guns and ammo and "throwing firecrackers into the crowd" to get the shooting started. Dunno why they didn't just start the shooting themselves if they wanted that... Sounds like a stupid rationalization to defend their actions....

victor809 wrote:



Not sure either, but you can’t fix stupid.

I do remember reading about that, just didn’t remember them specifying the venue.
Abrignac
6 years ago


Follow the constitution, yes of course, but is the constitution still applicable? Is either side entirely right or wrong? Of course not.

Speyside wrote:



Constitution not applicable? Maybe you should clarify. At face value that seems contrary to what you said before.
gummy jones
6 years ago
i heard the rally goers were all blood thirsty racists
Sunoverbeach
6 years ago
The problem as I see it is that the murdering fuggers are crazy at varying levels from batchit down to plain anger management issues. Figure out a way to address crazy fuggers and you have no more mass shootings and likely a large reduction in smaller scale shootings. If you just focus on the tool then crazy fuggers will simply find another one to use. Do I have a solution for crazy? Hell no. If I did I might still be with one of the ex girlfriends from years back
Mrs. dpnewell
6 years ago
I was amazed at how many of those armed black men at the rally where actually White Supremists. Who would have thunk?

David
frankj1
6 years ago
Barry White Supremacists?
victor809
6 years ago
Dunno why you think there's a bunch of black white supremacists... But I'll assume you came to that conclusion using your usual logic.
ZRX1200
6 years ago
Of course you don’t understand what Dave was saying....

Black lives Matter was there....ARMED and hanging out with the white guys who are being called names by fascists.
Speyside
6 years ago
Not really Anth. The constitution is amended from time to time, not very often. The constitution should be the basis for all law in our country, IMHO. Pehaps the 2nd amendment is to vague. I am just posing the question. I am not suggesting to amend. Though I would like clearer definition on the right to bear arms so there can be no over reach.
Abrignac
6 years ago

Not really Anth. The constitution is amended from time to time, not very often. The constitution should be the basis for all law in our country, IMHO. Pehaps the 2nd amendment is to vague. I am just posing the question. I am not suggesting to amend. Though I would like clearer definition on the right to bear arms so there can be no over reach.

Speyside wrote:



Seems pretty clear to me.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.



To put into perspective one must determine what was the sign of the times when the 2nd Amendment was ratified.

A well regulated militia
At that time we had a regular army as well as a militia formed by everyday citizens, not reservists, draftees etc. The militia was an all volunteer force whose members supplied their own arms. As such, should a militia be formed today, it would need to rely on its members supplying their own arms.

At the time of the revolution, the arms provided by the members of the militia where the exact type of weapons supplied to members of the regular army. It would be expected that if a militia formed today, its members would need weapons compatible with what they would be expected to face. Therefore, arms provided by members of the militia would need to be contemporary.

keep and bear arms
The potential militia members (virtually any citizen) need to keep those arms nearby and unencumbered so they may form up without delay

Shall not be infringed

to act in a way that is against a law or that limits someone’s rights or freedom:

Cambridge Dictionary wrote:



Arguments are made for banning military style rifles. Yet, the weapons of choice of the militia were period specific military style rifles.

Arguments have been made that in this day and age, a militia could not uprise. Certainly that same argument was put forth by many citizens in the tumultuous time of the revolution. Some would say it’s an impossibility now. Yet, that argument is irrelevant to the context of the 2a.
USNGunner
6 years ago
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This is spot on. Nothing to add, nor debate. That is what it says, and that is in fact what it means.

How an American can be ok with putting restrictions on other Americans because they don't like an activity or tool? That is the mob. That is oppression. That is simply wrong.

I despise Nazi's and the KKK. But they have a right to say and believe what they want. So long as they do not act on it and violate another persons rights or civil liberties.

That is what this country was founded on. The right to believe what "YOU" wanted without fear of being beat down by your government or neighbors.

You people that think otherwise need to rethink your positions. Seriously.
victor809
6 years ago
Anthony, weren't you the one who wanted ex felons not to have guns? Seems like an infringement/overreach to me.
DrMaddVibe
6 years ago
Laws, who knew?

At the crux of it all are the Founders words..."SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED".

They threw the yoke of Tyranny off and beat the world's superpower at that time to create documents that forged this nation. The Constitution and the Bill of Rights. To water them down is a severe injustice. Read the Federalist Papers and the quotes that our Founders had to say about the 2nd Amendment. Doesn't take a lot of time. Use the g00gl3.

I DARE some of you to.
Abrignac
6 years ago

Anthony, weren't you the one who wanted ex felons not to have guns? Seems like an infringement/overreach to me.

victor809 wrote:



Once a felon always a felon. There is nothing ex about that.

However, felons can still be citizens and so IMHO they too are entitled to the same 2nd amendment rights afforded others. Absent a bonafide emergency court order shouldn’t *common sense* legislation focus removing 2nd amendment rights *after* a person has been afforded due process? Otherwise, it seems the law is unconstitutional. Think about it. If a person isn’t a threat to society why should those rights be stripped once that person has paid his or her adjudicated debt to society. Seems pretty simple to me unless public safety is no longer the motive of those laws.
victor809
6 years ago
I never said it should. I have zero problem with prior felons having just as many guns as those who have not ever committed a crime. Give them handguns, rides, SMGs and grenades, I don't care. Your and my view is not the norm.
victor809
6 years ago
*rifles (not rides)
victor809
6 years ago
(f-ckers still have to get their own Uber)
Mrs. dpnewell
6 years ago

Seems pretty clear to me.



To put into perspective one must determine what was the sign of the times when the 2nd Amendment was ratified.

A well regulated militia
At that time we had a regular army as well as a militia formed by everyday citizens, not reservists, draftees etc. The militia was an all volunteer force whose members supplied their own arms. As such, should a militia be formed today, it would need to rely on its members supplying their own arms.

At the time of the revolution, the arms provided by the members of the militia where the exact type of weapons supplied to members of the regular army. It would be expected that if a militia formed today, its members would need weapons compatible with what they would be expected to face. Therefore, arms provided by members of the militia would need to be contemporary.

keep and bear arms
The potential militia members (virtually any citizen) need to keep those arms nearby and unencumbered so they may form up without delay

Shall not be infringed


Arguments are made for banning military style rifles. Yet, the weapons of choice of the militia were period specific military style rifles.

Arguments have been made that in this day and age, a militia could not uprise. Certainly that same argument was put forth by many citizens in the tumultuous time of the revolution. Some would say it’s an impossibility now. Yet, that argument is irrelevant to the context of the 2a.

Abrignac wrote:



Though spot on, I would like to expand on one point. In the 1700s the phrase "well regulated" did not mean what it does today. "Well regulated" at the time this amendment as written meant "well equiped, well supplied and well trained". A far cry from the "regulated and controlled by government" that many 2nd Amendment opposers like to suggest.

David
USNGunner
6 years ago

Though spot on, I would like to expand on one point. In the 1700s the phrase "well regulated" did not mean what it does today. "Well regulated" at the time this amendment as written meant "well equiped, well supplied and well trained". A far cry from the "regulated and controlled by government" that many 2nd Amendment opposers like to suggest.

David

Mrs. dpnewell wrote:



And this. The language is clear.

The haters call the 2nd amendment sanctuary counties treasonous while cheering for the illegal immigrant sanctuaries. You can't have it both ways hypocrites. Leave the law abiding folk the hell alone.

Hammer the criminals. That's how it used to work and we didn't have all these problems. Think about it.
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