FuzzNJ
  • FuzzNJ
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
15 years ago

It must suck not being able to think for oneself...:-k

I feel for the likes of fuzzy, brewski and polesmokers...Boogieman! 😰

Kawak wrote:



Interesting comment considering the topic and evidence presented.
HockeyDad
15 years ago
Boo hoo!

You need to get one thing straight. We control both parties. We manipulate everyone. You were manipulated into "raising awareness". Go ahead and rise up against the machine.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x205379 
wheelrite
15 years ago
Fuzz,,,

any reply to post #18 ?
FuzzNJ
  • FuzzNJ
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15 years ago

Fuzz splain,,,

How does ending the Death Tax hurt anyone ?

How do tax breaks for the wealthy benefit the 50% of people who pay no Fed.Tax ?

There is already Govt provided Health Care for the truly needy.so how does killing Obama care hurt them ?

Fuzz all your stuff is talking points from the Huffington Post and other America bashing Lib sources...

wheelrite wrote:



First it was renamed 'death tax' to make it sound evil by Frank Luntz. Second it only applies to estates worth more than 5 million. That excludes the overwhelming majority of estates. When the time comes, my family is fortunate enough to have to pay it should it stay at that level.

Secondly, people can't pay taxes if they have no money. The top 1% of people in the country hold more wealth now than they ever have. The middle class hardly exists anymore. It's not because of the lack of hard work, it's because of public policy.

As far as health care is concerned, the bill helps small businesses afford to give their employees health care, it allows children to remain on their parents policy longer which is great because the job market sucks and most starting jobs don't offer health care. And it stops insurance companies from dropping someone for whatever reason they want. Plus, more people with insurance makes a bigger pool. This is intended to reduce bankruptcies due to medical bills, the number one reason for bankruptcies in this country.

I'll ignore the last comment, it's just fluff and adds nothing.
FuzzNJ
  • FuzzNJ
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
15 years ago

Fuzz,,,

any reply to post #18 ?

wheelrite wrote:



Patience grasshopper. What, my life revolves around you or something?
HockeyDad
15 years ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Integration_of_Theory_and_Practice 

The Integration of Theory and Practice: A Program for the New Traditionalist Movement was an American conservative political activism call to action published in 2001 by the Free Congress Foundation



It is weird how all of a sudden it is making the rounds again in blogs. It seems like there my be some manipulation going on here.

FuzzNJ
  • FuzzNJ
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
15 years ago

Boo hoo!

You need to get one thing straight. We control both parties. We manipulate everyone. You were manipulated into "raising awareness". Go ahead and rise up against the machine.

HockeyDad wrote:



This is true, manipulation happens all the time.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x205379

HockeyDad wrote:



I bet you think that's clever.
wheelrite
15 years ago

First it was renamed 'death tax' to make it sound evil by Frank Luntz. Second it only applies to estates worth more than 5 million. That excludes the overwhelming majority of estates. When the time comes, my family is fortunate enough to have to pay it should it stay at that level.

Secondly, people can't pay taxes if they have no money. The top 1% of people in the country hold more wealth now than they ever have. The middle class hardly exists anymore. It's not because of the lack of hard work, it's because of public policy.

As far as health care is concerned, the bill helps small businesses afford to give their employees health care, it allows children to remain on their parents policy longer which is great because the job market sucks and most starting jobs don't offer health care. And it stops insurance companies from dropping someone for whatever reason they want. Plus, more people with insurance makes a bigger pool. This is intended to reduce bankruptcies due to medical bills, the number one reason for bankruptcies in this country.

I'll ignore the last comment, it's just fluff and adds nothing.

FuzzNJ wrote:



Wrong on all examples other than you wanting to give up your inheritance,which should be voluntary .

Kawak
15 years ago

If only we all had your worms eye view of the world Kawak . . . .

Brewha wrote:



You may want to think about that. Anything else is way beyond your capabilities.
HockeyDad
15 years ago
What I think is clever is that you got manipulated into starting a thread about manipulation and you used a highly manipulative title.

Those darn right wing elites!
FuzzNJ
  • FuzzNJ
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15 years ago

Wrong on all examples other than you wanting to give up your inheritance,which should be voluntary .

wheelrite wrote:




I'm convinced. Wow, your insight is remarkable as usual.
leonardo
15 years ago
That's from 2001? WTF? If the right wing elites are so good at manipulating, how the heck did the liberal elite take over first Congress and then the White House? Or does it take 9 years for the manipulation to become effective? This just gets confusinger and confusinger...
Ragin' Cajun
15 years ago


As far as health care is concerned, the bill helps small businesses afford to give their employees health care, .

FuzzNJ wrote:



I usually stay away from the polotics, but this statement is the exact opposite of what the plan accomplishes. I just finished a rather in depth CPE study of the health care plan provisions as I must be prepared to discuss them with my clients. The plan will actually force small businesses to drop the employer plans and pay the penalty. The funny thing too is the penalty per employee of not offering any plan is smaller than the penalty of offering a plan and having an employee use the exchanges. (2k vs 3k)

Another note, the 'cadillac' plan 40% penalty on the insurance companies that starts in 2018 will actually be imposed on approximately 60% of current plans if the government does not change the threshholds.

As to the OP theory, if you don't think this same mentality and 'plan' has been considered and used by the left you are either naive or stupid. Niether policital party has your best interest in mind, just their own pursuit of power and money.
wheelrite
15 years ago

I'm convinced. Wow, your insight is remarkable as usual.

FuzzNJ wrote:




With all due respect,Fuzz
Convincing you does not concern me.Preventing people with your Politcal and Social opinions from being in a postion of authority does concern me.

FuzzNJ
  • FuzzNJ
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
15 years ago

I usually stay away from the polotics, but this statement is the exact opposite of what the plan accomplishes. I just finished a rather in depth CPE study of the health care plan provisions as I must be prepared to discuss them with my clients. The plan will actually force small businesses to drop the employer plans and pay the penalty. The funny thing too is the penalty per employee of not offering any plan is smaller than the penalty of offering a plan and having an employee use the exchanges. (2k vs 3k)

Another note, the 'cadillac' plan 40% penalty on the insurance companies that starts in 2018 will actually be imposed on approximately 60% of current plans if the government does not change the threshholds.

As to the OP theory, if you don't think this same mentality and 'plan' has been considered and used by the left you are either naive or stupid. Niether policital party has your best interest in mind, just their own pursuit of power and money.

Ragin' Cajun wrote:




I do think the plan does not go far enough and it was a big sell out to insurance companies. From CNNmoney:

* By no later than 2014, states will have to set up Small Business Health Options Programs, or "SHOP Exchanges," where small businesses will be able to pool together to buy insurance. ("Small businesses" are defined as those with no more than 100 employees, though states have the option of limiting pools to companies with 50 or fewer employees through 2016; companies that grow beyond the size limit will also be grandfathered in.)

The Congressional Budget Office has estimated that the exchanges would ease small business insurance costs, albeit only marginally: premiums in the small-group market are forecast to fall between 1% and 4% under the exchanges, while the amount of coverage would rise by up to 3%.

* For the next four years, until the SHOP Exchanges are set up, businesses with 10 or fewer full-time-equivalent employees earning less than $25,000 a year on average will be eligible for a tax credit of 35% of health insurance costs. (Companies with between 11 and 25 workers and an average wage of up to $50,000 are eligible for partial credits.)

The tax credit will remain in place, increasing to 50% of costs, for the first two years a company buys insurance through its state exchange. The Congressional Budget Office predicts that the tax credit will affect about 12% of individuals covered via the small-group insurance market, lowering their cost of insurance by between 8% and 11%.

* Insurers will no longer be able to set rates or exclude coverage based on pre-existing conditions, and can vary premiums only by geographic location, age, and tobacco use.

These restrictions, however, would not kick in until 2014. Going into effect immediately: a ban on lifetime limits on coverage, and on "rescission" (canceling policies already issued) except in cases of fraud.

* Starting in 2014, businesses with more than 50 employees will be required to either offer healthcare coverage or pay a penalty of $750 a year per full-time worker. The coverage offered will also have to meet minimum benefits -- covering both a specific set of services and 60% of employee health costs overall -- or else employers will face additional penalties.

* So-called "Cadillac" plans costing more than $10,200 a year for individuals or $27,500 for family coverage (not counting dental and vision plans) will be subject to a 40% tax on the portion of the cost that exceeds the limit. Though the tax would actually be paid by insurers, it's expected that it would be passed along to plan holders in the form of higher premiums.

Furthermore, if the House amendments approved Sunday pass the Senate intact under the reconciliation process, some other small business provisions will change:

* Part-time employees would be counted toward the 50-employee minimum on pro-rated basis based on hours worked, bringing more small businesses into the group required to provide coverage.

* The $750-per-employee penalty for not providing insurance would rise to $2,000.

http://money.cnn.com/2010/03/22/smallbusiness/small_business_health_reform/ 
FuzzNJ
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15 years ago

With all due respect,Fuzz
Convincing you does not concern me.Preventing people with your Politcal and Social opinions from being in a postion of authority does concern me.

wheelrite wrote:



You claimed I was 'wrong on all counts'. I'm saying you are full of it.
wheelrite
15 years ago

I do think the plan does not go far enough and it was a big sell out to insurance companies. From CNNmoney:

* By no later than 2014, states will have to set up Small Business Health Options Programs, or "SHOP Exchanges," where small businesses will be able to pool together to buy insurance. ("Small businesses" are defined as those with no more than 100 employees, though states have the option of limiting pools to companies with 50 or fewer employees through 2016; companies that grow beyond the size limit will also be grandfathered in.)

The Congressional Budget Office has estimated that the exchanges would ease small business insurance costs, albeit only marginally: premiums in the small-group market are forecast to fall between 1% and 4% under the exchanges, while the amount of coverage would rise by up to 3%.

* For the next four years, until the SHOP Exchanges are set up, businesses with 10 or fewer full-time-equivalent employees earning less than $25,000 a year on average will be eligible for a tax credit of 35% of health insurance costs. (Companies with between 11 and 25 workers and an average wage of up to $50,000 are eligible for partial credits.)

The tax credit will remain in place, increasing to 50% of costs, for the first two years a company buys insurance through its state exchange. The Congressional Budget Office predicts that the tax credit will affect about 12% of individuals covered via the small-group insurance market, lowering their cost of insurance by between 8% and 11%.

* Insurers will no longer be able to set rates or exclude coverage based on pre-existing conditions, and can vary premiums only by geographic location, age, and tobacco use.

These restrictions, however, would not kick in until 2014. Going into effect immediately: a ban on lifetime limits on coverage, and on "rescission" (canceling policies already issued) except in cases of fraud.

* Starting in 2014, businesses with more than 50 employees will be required to either offer healthcare coverage or pay a penalty of $750 a year per full-time worker. The coverage offered will also have to meet minimum benefits -- covering both a specific set of services and 60% of employee health costs overall -- or else employers will face additional penalties.

* So-called "Cadillac" plans costing more than $10,200 a year for individuals or $27,500 for family coverage (not counting dental and vision plans) will be subject to a 40% tax on the portion of the cost that exceeds the limit. Though the tax would actually be paid by insurers, it's expected that it would be passed along to plan holders in the form of higher premiums.

Furthermore, if the House amendments approved Sunday pass the Senate intact under the reconciliation process, some other small business provisions will change:

* Part-time employees would be counted toward the 50-employee minimum on pro-rated basis based on hours worked, bringing more small businesses into the group required to provide coverage.

* The $750-per-employee penalty for not providing insurance would rise to $2,000.

http://money.cnn.com/2010/03/22/smallbusiness/small_business_health_reform/ 

FuzzNJ wrote:




It's a moot point anyway..
After 2012 We'll have a Tea Party Controlled Congress and White House.Obama and his Marxist poilcies will be a bad memory blip in American History ,like Jimmy Carter,LBJ and JFK...=d> =d>
FuzzNJ
  • FuzzNJ
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
15 years ago

It's a moot point anyway..
After 2012 We'll have a Tea Party Controlled Congress and White House.Obama and his Marxist poilcies will be a bad memory blip in American History ,like Jimmy Carter,LBJ and JFK...=d> =d>

wheelrite wrote:




And that's another thing, Obama is nowhere close to being a Marxist. Last year American corporations made 1.6 Trillion dollars in profit, the most ever. If Obama was a Marxist, how would that be possible?
wheelrite
15 years ago

And that's another thing, Obama is nowhere close to being a Marxist. Last year American corporations made 1.6 Trillion dollars in profit, the most ever. If Obama was a Marxist, how would that be possible?

FuzzNJ wrote:



it's called "Incremental Change"

don't you listen to Glen Beck ?


btw,
Profit is not illegal like weed...
Ragin' Cajun
15 years ago
Again, on the surface it 'appears' premiums could be lowered, but the reality is they will increase. The 40% 'cadillac' penalty will be imposed on approximately 60% of ALL current plans if the threshholds for imposing it are not changed.

Also, to date, over 200 companies have been granted exemptions from following the new guidelines. Instead of major corporations sharing in the burden of the increased rates for implementing the exchanges, it will fall completely on small businesses who will not be able to shoulder the rather large rate increases.
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