ZRX1200
13 years ago
Not in Oregon public schools!
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DadZilla3
13 years ago

Not in Oregon public schools!

ZRX1200 wrote:


A local school district moved quickly to deal with the possibility of another lunatic trying to harm their students...

Security guards now armed at Butler Area School District following Newtown tragedy

http://www.wpxi.com/news/news/local/wake-connecticut-tragedy-local-school-districts-re/nTYJy/ 

Note, the Butler Area School District is in a predominantly rural area with a strong tradition of gun ownership and hunting.

Also, "Butler is not alone in employing armed guards; 118 of Pennsylvania‘s 498 school districts use them, along with 14 alternative education institutions, according to the State Department of Education."

http://triblive.com/news/allegheny/3145448-74/butler-district-districts 
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tailgater
13 years ago
Arming our schools is not the answer.
Not even close.

If Newtown had a single armed guard, wouldn't Lanza simply have shot him first on his way into the school?

And what about the school bus? You want to gun down 20 kids, just jump onto the bus and start firing. Will we put an armed guard on each bus?

Or he could pull the fire alarm and snipe the kids from the woods.

Or forget about bullets. Pull a Timothy McVeigh and drive up with a load of fertilizer and lime or whatever causes the biggest boom.


Point is, we can't over react to a heinous crime like this. Or at least we shouldn't.

Armed guards. Metal detectors. Hell, let's bring in the dogs and demand a strip search.
Then they'll be truly safe.



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frankj1
  • frankj1
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
13 years ago
Dadzilla in #10...As a matter of history, a few opinions regarding the right of the people to keep and bear arms...

followed by several excellent quotes, thanks.

the exact nature of them being the reason for my questioning the NRA statement. I'm not being a "bed wetting" sneak attacker with a hidden agenda. I am searching among the majority here (who clearly support the rights of citizens to own guns) to learn if you heard the NRA quote the way I heard it...and if you are concerned that advocating for even MORE armed government presence in the name of security is contrary to what you all believe in, ie not allowing too much power in government in order to prevent tyranny.

So far, ZRX seems to have discredited the NRA, but I still don't feel like my real question is being addressed. Did this guy unwittingly open the door for potential abuse of power by the government, and should believers in gun rights shout him down?
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HockeyDad
13 years ago
As long as there are schools, there will be school shootings. We need to eliminate schools.
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SMGBobbyScott
13 years ago
I don't think so, he is just trying to placate and stem the tide of public opinion. Generally speaking the police have been an ally to the 2nd Amendment, they want us (citizenry) to have guns. Plus, I think that we are a long way off from a power grab or abuse of power. This is merely an ounce of prevention in the midst of a firestorm.
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frankj1
  • frankj1
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
13 years ago

I suggest a trip to Israel.....while there swing by a local school.More than likely you'll see at least 1 teacher outside with his or her students.Identify whats slung over her or his shoulder and then check back wit me.

IMHO it's about time we realized that there are people in this world that will harm children for no apparent reason.Yet we go after guns......FUQQING STUPIDITY OF THE HIGHEST ORDER.A mad man needs no gun to do the harm.....but a well armed staff could thwart their efforts along with expediting them to that special place in hell.


Ron

Whistlebritches wrote:


good argument, and I certainly understand about Israel. If the U.S.A was under similar daily attack threats by border crossing terrorists I would agree even more with you. But our most recent national debate stems from a random and rare breach in our daily sense of safety...hideous as it was, it was still (apparently) the act of a single lunatic with no political agenda (again I say apparently).

Do we want to react as though we are being confronted by religious zealots hellbent on wiping us off the map though? Does the NRA really want to empower the government to do more?
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frankj1
  • frankj1
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
13 years ago

Arming our schools is not the answer.
Not even close.

If Newtown had a single armed guard, wouldn't Lanza simply have shot him first on his way into the school?

And what about the school bus? You want to gun down 20 kids, just jump onto the bus and start firing. Will we put an armed guard on each bus?

Or he could pull the fire alarm and snipe the kids from the woods.

Or forget about bullets. Pull a Timothy McVeigh and drive up with a load of fertilizer and lime or whatever causes the biggest boom.


Point is, we can't over react to a heinous crime like this. Or at least we shouldn't.

Armed guards. Metal detectors. Hell, let's bring in the dogs and demand a strip search.
Then they'll be truly safe.



tailgater wrote:


pretty much how I see things. might even expand on it by adding there is a risk to freedom, more protection =less freedom. still curious how folks feel about this particular spokesperson.
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frankj1
  • frankj1
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
13 years ago

As long as there are schools, there will be school shootings. We need to eliminate schools.

HockeyDad wrote:


can't argue with that.
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frankj1
  • frankj1
  • Herf-A-Holic Topic Starter
13 years ago

I don't think so, he is just trying to placate and stem the tide of public opinion. Generally speaking the police have been an ally to the 2nd Amendment, they want us (citizenry) to have guns. Plus, I think that we are a long way off from a power grab or abuse of power. This is merely an ounce of prevention in the midst of a firestorm.

SMGBobbyScott wrote:


I tend to stand where you seem to be, having mostly trusted most of my life. not sure about most here though. Honestly looking for their input as I understand the fear of even cracking open the door at all. I don't think adherents of that school of thought are crazy. We've all seen what can happen under certain governments.
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SMGBobbyScott
13 years ago
I'm a cold dead hander...there will be a lot of water under the bridge before they can truly pull off a "power grab" like people are referring...
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edin508
13 years ago
The NRA is STUPID to suggest putting armed cops in schools.....


But Bill Clinton was brilliant to suggest the same thing...

http://beforeitsnews.com/opinion-conservative/2012/12/in-2000-bill-clinton-wanted-cops-in-schools-because-of-columbine-2546306.html 
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rfenst
13 years ago



Point is, we can't over react to a heinous crime like this. Or at least we shouldn't.

Armed guards. Metal detectors. Hell, let's bring in the dogs and demand a strip search.
Then they'll be truly safe.



tailgater wrote:



No, we shouldn't overreact, but an at least an armed cop at every school is a start. Its been my common experience for a decade or longer. Always see few patrol cars within a mile or so of each school- which is not a coincidence. As an aside, our synagogue has off-duty cops ANYTIME anyone is in the building. It all creates a better "sense of security" and just might help one day...
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rfenst
13 years ago

I don't think so, he is just trying to placate and stem the tide of public opinion. Generally speaking the police have been an ally to the 2nd Amendment, they want us (citizenry) to have guns. Plus, I think that we are a long way off from a power grab or abuse of power. This is merely an ounce of prevention in the midst of a firestorm.

SMGBobbyScott wrote:



He hasn't done anything to successfully placate his/NRA's foes. He did not come of well on "Crossfire" this morning. All he's done is speak out in a way that allows him to be in the center of the brewing storm, where i think he/NRA should have a proverbial seat at the table. His recommendation was nothing new, just a long-time coming for those in this country who haven't had their crap together yet- on this one.
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DadZilla3
13 years ago

Does the NRA really want to empower the government to do more?

frankj1 wrote:


Some would say our government is already empowered to do pretty much anything it wants to. Moreover, if things get so bad here that even our own military can't keep the necessary order, we have had a treaty in place with Canada for several years now that would allow Canadian troops across our border to lend a hand during a civil emergency.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=47dc5095-4da9-4faa-8464-fe01289b4b7a 
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rfenst
13 years ago

Some would say our government is already empowered to do pretty much anything it wants to. Moreover, if things get so bad here that even our own military can't keep the necessary order, we have had a treaty in place with Canada for several years now that would allow Canadian troops across our border to lend a hand during a civil emergency.

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/news/story.html?id=47dc5095-4da9-4faa-8464-fe01289b4b7a 

DadZilla3 wrote:



If it ever comes to the point of needing aid from a foreign country to keep order, we will be in so much trouble that any assistance won't matter.
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DadZilla3
13 years ago

If it ever comes to the point of needing aid from a foreign country to keep order, we will be in so much trouble that any assistance won't matter.

rfenst wrote:


You would think, but it certainly looks like both governments have decided to hedge their bets.
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wheelrite
13 years ago
Spoons and forks should be banned too,,,

They make fat people...
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fishinguitarman
13 years ago

Spoons and forks should be banned too,,,

They make fat people...

wheelrite wrote:







Big girls need love too!
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Brendan992
13 years ago
I graduated in 2002 from a school in Washington State. We had an armed cop on duty at all times and it was uncanny how much crime he prevented. At that time, the Russians and hispanics hated each other and would often bring weapons to school. In the years that I was there, he was also instrumental in some major drug busts on the school's campus. Sure, a lot could have happened regardless of his presence, but his presence was instrumental in preventing a lot from going down and who knows what might have been.

As far as I know, this continues to be the practice in place. I am not sure when it started. We also wore identification tags that had to be visible at all time.
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