HockeyDad
5 years ago
Stalin is dead.
BuckyB93
5 years ago

Stalin is dead.

HockeyDad wrote:



Didn't Axl write that? Maybe it was Mao Tse-Tung. I forget but I also think Tony's momma fits in there somewhere.

I'll have to check with Drafter.

RayR
5 years ago

Stalin is dead.

HockeyDad wrote:



Yep, Uncle Joe is dead, the Soviets were more successful socialists, they slaughtered lots more people. Hitler was a rank amateur socialist in that department.
RayR
5 years ago

Ray, you are totally wrong about Nazis being commies. I'll repeat it, ask Stalin.

And that makes neither of them any good, but it is the truth.
Yes, it challenges the neatly tied up bundle of evil dogma that you have been taught, but one day you'll realize that even you didn't come to your theories without outside influence.

Have yet to say you hate America, though you have claimed I have.
Clearly you dislike our way of governing though, so...
I have asked several times now....Where in the world would you be happy to live?

I'll open it up to make it easier.
What country meets your seal of approval in the last century?

frankj1 wrote:



Darn it Frank, what am I going to do with you? You still didn't read David Gordon's article? I've got more "evil dogma" too if you need it😂
From real historians and economists, none of them left-leaning progressive intelligentsia though—SORRY! The Democratic Socialists of America can supply you with that in Jacobin Magazine if you need to reinforce your indoctrination. They agree with you that Nazi's weren't socialists. Or don't you need "outside influence" because your truth came fully formed out of your own brain?8-[

Since when is real history dogma? You know what historical dogma is? They teach it in government school. Stuff like Lincoln invaded the Confederacy to free the slaves because wanted the black folks to be free and live amongst the white people as equals and vote and stuff. Oh how about this one, FDR saved capitalism from itself and the New Deal got the country out of the Great Depression. Those are real hoots too!😂
I know it's heresy against the conventional doctrine of the Church of Progressivism, but that's why we free thinkers love it! \:D/

You know, there's a lot of people who are voting now because they dislike our way of governing, if you stretch the imagination so you can call it that. Our government is more like in a perpetual state of anarchy, it seems to be a free-for-all, Constitution be damned The popular choices seem to be what flavor of state anarchy do you like and how much archy can you stand.



Smooth light
5 years ago
I think someone is wearing 🌹 rose-colored Ray-Bans, see the light walk in ENLIGHTENMENT!!💡💡
Do the walk of LIFE.🎶🎶🎶
frankj1
5 years ago

Stalin is dead.

HockeyDad wrote:


Exactly.
And so is Hitler.
And they were contemporaries.
Mussolini too.

But info that is finding, influencing, and manipulating Ray in these times is what the victims and descendants of the victims know all too well as "revisionist history". Ray has no connection other than the referenced writings of others. Despite insults tossed at his intellect by some , I've not done that and believe he has studied well, but has been given the wrong syllabus.

Nonetheless, I'll go with the teachings of those who were alive at the time. It's just so much more genuine than those with theories to prove and need history tweaked to accomplish that end.

Hitler and his little band of nazis hated Stalin's commies, despite the revisionist teachings that Ray has been recruited to believe. They were mortal enemies.
Mussolini dabbled in socialism but found fascism more expedient. He joined Hitler's mission.
Admittedly, there were elements of socialism adopted, but wicked smaht people take what works from other sources rather than lean entirely on failed dogma. That is where the connection ends.

Sort of like that great capitalist democracy, Israel. It is undeniable that they incorporate the elements of socialist thought that work for their country...just look at the Kibbutz system. Nothing more than communal farm communities, mostly.


There was an actual socialist party of influence in Germany as Hitler rose. But it was blocking his ascent. In order to recruit these workers, he used the word socialist to aid in making those workers defect from the considerable power of the social democrats or democrat socialists or whatever the party was known as back then.

And he went out to destroy and claim (for his super race) not just Russia but the socialist(ish) European nations.

But Hitler would deny any connection to leftist politics. And he had no connection to rational right of center politics either.
He and his league of contemporary acolytes that exist today know they are waaaay right fascists.

RayR
5 years ago

Exactly.
And so is Hitler.
And they were contemporaries.
Mussolini too.

But info that is finding, influencing, and manipulating Ray in these times is what the victims and descendants of the victims know all too well as "revisionist history". Ray has no connection other than the referenced writings of others. Despite insults tossed at his intellect by some , I've not done that and believe he has studied well, but has been given the wrong syllabus.

Nonetheless, I'll go with the teachings of those who were alive at the time. It's just so much more genuine than those with theories to prove and need history tweaked to accomplish that end.

Hitler and his little band of nazis hated Stalin's commies, despite the revisionist teachings that Ray has been recruited to believe. They were mortal enemies.
Mussolini dabbled in socialism but found fascism more expedient. He joined Hitler's mission.
Admittedly, there were elements of socialism adopted, but wicked smaht people take what works from other sources rather than lean entirely on failed dogma. That is where the connection ends.

Sort of like that great capitalist democracy, Israel. It is undeniable that they incorporate the elements of socialist thought that work for their country...just look at the Kibbutz system. Nothing more than communal farm communities, mostly.


There was an actual socialist party of influence in Germany as Hitler rose. But it was blocking his ascent. In order to recruit these workers, he used the word socialist to aid in making those workers defect from the considerable power of the social democrats or democrat socialists or whatever the party was known as back then.

And he went out to destroy and claim (for his super race) not just Russia but the socialist(ish) European nations.

But Hitler would deny any connection to leftist politics. And he had no connection to rational right of center politics either.
He and his league of contemporary acolytes that exist today know they are waaaay right fascists.

frankj1 wrote:



Frank you refer to "revisionist history" as if its a bad thing. The real reason some refer to "revisionist history" as a bad thing is it may debunk, include new insights or correct errors in the textbook history that they have become fully invested in. The purpose of the court historian's version of history is to glorify the state and whitewash uncomfortable facts.
In war, the winners write the history to glorify their side as the most righteous and noble, even if they weren't.
Gary North here explains why "revisionist history" is important.
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/02/gary-north/how-to-teach-revisionist-history/ 

You said "I'll go with the teachings of those who were alive at the time.". I agree with that 100%, it's important to go to the contemporary source material, otherwise how would you know if a particular historian is trying to pull the wool over your eyes?
Here's one to shove down the throat of an FDR New Deal idolater.
On on May 6, 1939, Henry Morgenthau, Roosevelt’s treasury secretary, was forced to admit the total failure of the New Deal to stop the Great Depression: “We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work. . . . I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started. . . . And an enormous debt to boot!”.

So in respect to Nazi's, here is a nice compilation of attributed quotes from speeches by the creepy dude with the weird little moustache—about socialism. I don't think anyone could possibly say that Hitler was denying any connection to leftist politics here. No Democratic Socialist would dare mention this stuff.
https://stoppingsocialism.com/2020/07/hitler-was-a-socialist-who-learned-from-karl-marx/ 
frankj1
5 years ago

Frank you refer to "revisionist history" as if its a bad thing. The real reason some refer to "revisionist history" as a bad thing is it may debunk, include new insights or correct errors in the textbook history that they have become fully invested in. The purpose of the court historian's version of history is to glorify the state and whitewash uncomfortable facts.
In war, the winners write the history to glorify their side as the most righteous and noble, even if they weren't.
Gary North here explains why "revisionist history" is important.
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2015/02/gary-north/how-to-teach-revisionist-history/ 

You said "I'll go with the teachings of those who were alive at the time.". I agree with that 100%, it's important to go to the contemporary source material, otherwise how would you know if a particular historian is trying to pull the wool over your eyes?
Here's one to shove down the throat of an FDR New Deal idolater.
On on May 6, 1939, Henry Morgenthau, Roosevelt’s treasury secretary, was forced to admit the total failure of the New Deal to stop the Great Depression: “We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work. . . . I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started. . . . And an enormous debt to boot!”.

So in respect to Nazi's, here is a nice compilation of attributed quotes from speeches by the creepy dude with the weird little moustache—about socialism. I don't think anyone could possibly say that Hitler was denying any connection to leftist politics here. No Democratic Socialist would dare mention this stuff.
https://stoppingsocialism.com/2020/07/hitler-was-a-socialist-who-learned-from-karl-marx/ 

RayR wrote:


you continue to pick quotes to back theories and miss the context.
Not gonna bother with school anymore.

But odd that you'd bring up Morganthau. He was what you are not, someone able to have a belief system yet work with the world around him.
He wasn't a backer of spending our way out of the Depression that FDR espoused, but his relationship with FDR got him to serve anyway.
If not for that country over politics willingness, it's possible no Jews would be alive today.
bgz
  • bgz
  • Herf-A-Holic
5 years ago
See, it's easier just to point out how big his "progressive bucket" is and call him an idiot.

Edit:

Don't get me wrong, it's good times.
delta1
5 years ago

I completely agree, and as such, each INDIVIDUAL officer should be held accountable for his/her actions. Full investigations, complete evidence and the results of the investigations should always be made public. However, defunding police, mob rule, riots based on lies and half truths, and the notion that once race should be treated differently by the police/justice system than other races is absurd.

Stogie1020 wrote:



that it is only an INDIVIDUAL officer who is accountable is one of the root causes of police brutality...most oaths administered to police require that officers must follow the policies of the agencies for whom they work...

departmental policies generally have ethics regulations governing the way an officer is expected to behave, and to report or stop misconduct by fellow officers...most officers fail to do so...the code of silence leads to police abuses that go un-reported and un-investigated...officers will knowingly lie on behalf of a bad cop...citizen complaints are not taken seriously, unless overwhelming evidence and legal representation occurs...


a study of police activities in the Bay Area by Stanford University a few years ago, a review of the NYPD's Stop and Frisk program, an investigation into the LAPD's traffic stops over the past 10 years have all shown that one race, the white race, is treated differently by police...seems all other races are policed more aggressively while the white race is protected and served...


these are broad generalizations...there are a few excellent departments...
frankj1
5 years ago

See, it's easier just to point out how big his "progressive bucket" is and call him an idiot.

Edit:

Don't get me wrong, it's good times.

bgz wrote:


believe me, I'd rather be joking with him and talking chit about the Bills/Pats game Sunday.
I really don't dislike Ray like some do, I encouraged his participation as I listen to all...until it becomes repetitious tedium.
Links do not substitute for knowledge born of experience.

Hopefully both add to their awareness in an exchange of ideas, but this has not been a two way street.
Ya can't debate dogma and being assigned to catch-all groups precludes being taken seriously.

Add to that some unwanted stress, and I'll take some of the blame that it lasted this long.

But isn't it a little telling that he thinks you and I are politically aligned? Is it just cuz we get along respectfully and appreciate the other's humor?

Nah, probably really because he doesn't even consider our statements.
bgz
  • bgz
  • Herf-A-Holic
5 years ago
Man, frank good wif words.

You and I have had our fair share of disagreements, but you're right, we've gotten along pretty good over the years. I know when I jumped on the boards I was pretty raw, but I've tamed a bit lol.

RayRay don't bother me... I know I joked about blocking him (actually did block the other guy though), but I find the dialog entertaining though quite repetative.

I think I just have an interest in how someone can think in such a binary way. Two buckets... the progressive bucket... and the other bucket.

Just knowing how complex systems get with relatively few variables, and to believe that the government can be run with a simple set of basic rules. I mean... that's fantasy pipe dream sh*t... it's like he's trapped in 1962 or something. Anyway, I find it interesting.

What he probably hasn't realized yet, I probably agree with him on a lot of things.
delta1
5 years ago
he can be zealous in his criticisms of others, especially libs...his beliefs seem to promote a return to the state of nature where everything will be magically better, because...no government...

he's really similar to evangelicals ....except he has faith in man in his state of nature...good luck ...

if you understand that, and forgive his incessant attacks on progressivism, despite centuries of evidence that much of the modern world, good or bad, happened while progressivism was a driving force
frankj1
5 years ago
what's his favorite cigar?
Smooth light
5 years ago
That's why I like history class.❤️

Wisdom comes from the mileage we get from past experience and knowledge, and grow in appreciation/understanding.🤔

Everybody plays the fool sometime 🌝
HockeyDad
5 years ago

what's his favorite cigar?

frankj1 wrote:



Tatuaje Limited Edition Progressives Suck.
Brewha
5 years ago

Tatuaje Limited Edition Progressives Suck.

HockeyDad wrote:


I would have guess Black Ops Deek - Churchill or Gordo....
MACS
5 years ago

"...you also had people that were very fine people, on both sides."

Buckwheat wrote:



Come on Julian... go look at the video for yourself. That's been debunked, but people keep pushing it.

More dem lies.
RayR
5 years ago

you continue to pick quotes to back theories and miss the context.
Not gonna bother with school anymore.

But odd that you'd bring up Morganthau. He was what you are not, someone able to have a belief system yet work with the world around him.
He wasn't a backer of spending our way out of the Depression that FDR espoused, but his relationship with FDR got him to serve anyway.
If not for that country over politics willingness, it's possible no Jews would be alive today.

frankj1 wrote:



The funny thing about Henry Morganthau is he was a farmer and didn't know much of anything to qualify him for Secretary of the Treasury. In the FDR administration, it wasn't what you know, it was who you know. FDR's neighbor knew Henry.😁 He was smart enough to know that you can't spend your way into prosperity and could see that the results of the New Deal was one gigantic flop. (I know, I know...the court historians say differently:^o )
The real guy behind the Treasury Dept. was economist Harry Dexter White, who would be instrumental in creating the IMF, the World Bank and the Bretton Woods System after the war and became the a director of the IMF for a short while before he was forced to resign. White was a Soviet fanboy and soon found himself in hot water as he was accused of being involved in spying and transmitting classified documents to the Soviet Union. After testifying before the House Un-American Activities Committee in August 1948, denying the charges that he was a commie, he suddenly had a heart attack which he survived, he went home to New Hampshire and had a second heart attack and died 2 days later. Suspicious huh? 🤔 😉

Frank, no more skool for you. You get a big fat F
The curriculum is too advanced for you. Quotes are bad I guess in context, even Hitler's own words can't convince you you've been ill informed.

It's back to CODSWALLOP U for you.[spank]
RayR
5 years ago

he can be zealous in his criticisms of others, especially libs...his beliefs seem to promote a return to the state of nature where everything will be magically better, because...no government...

he's really similar to evangelicals ....except he has faith in man in his state of nature...good luck ...

if you understand that, and forgive his incessant attacks on progressivism, despite centuries of evidence that much of the modern world, good or bad, happened while progressivism was a driving force

delta1 wrote:



Progressivism is a revolt against nature. It's like believing there is no law of gravity. It's like believing the gubmnet can overturn the laws of human action and change the world, “Remould it nearer to the heart’s desire.” as the Fabian Socialist said.

"centuries of evidence"?? "much of the modern world, good or bad, happened while progressivism was a driving force"??🤔
I know plenty of the BAD, but what is the GOOD? 🦄🌈
The only claim that I've heard before on this forum is there would be no Nintendo without progressivism.8-[ 😲 😕
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