I have finally figured out the logic that allows the same people to favor abortion and gun control.
They only want to kill the defenseless ones.

dmjdc

no one is in favor of abortion.

the people that accept abortion as an unfortunate part of the human experience, prefer it be done by medical doctors and not by back alley abortionists, who also kill or maim the patients, or the scraping of the uterus with a coat hanger.

there have always been and will always be abortions. the question is who should perform this surgical procedure.

this is not a religious issue with people who have abortions.

well i would never catagorically say "no one" and second in no way what so ever does it stricly have to be about religion. as a man of science i know the heart starts beating on the 20-22 day, and abortion is NOT only about who is going to perform the procedure, no way sir. sometimes its about a teenage mother not wanting to deal with a pregnancy, so what is her solution.....remove the unwanted person inside her.

You know...sometimes i look at my two young daughters as they play on the living room floor, and wonder how many unwanted and aborted children would have grown into the sweet, adorable, caring, loving little people that they are if only they were given the chance to grow instead of having their life line severed because some feel that is not nearly as important as making sure some irresponsible woman has the "right" to do what she wants. It makes me sad.

"no one is in favor of abortion."...Obviously someone IS! Otherwise we'd have a lot of murder charges on our hands.


Total killed in all U.S. Wars 1,150,244(including the Cival War!)

Deaths due to abortion since 1973 35,000,000

According to any Ethics class, it's not the doctors that favor this...

I swear by Apollo Physician and Asclepius and Hygieia and Panaceia and all the gods and goddesses, making them my witnesses, that I will fulfil according to my ability and judgment this oath and this covenant:

To hold him who has taught me this art as equal to my parents and to live my life in partnership with him, and if he is in need of money to give him a share of mine, and to regard his offspring as equal to my brothers in male lineage and to teach them this art - if they desire to learn it - without fee and covenant; to give a share of precepts and oral instruction and all the other learning to my sons and to the sons of him who has instructed me and to pupils who have signed the covenant and have taken an oath according to the medical law, but no one else.

I will apply dietetic measures for the benefit of the sick according to my ability and judgment; I will keep them from harm and injustice.

I will neither give a deadly drug to anybody who asked for it, nor will I make a suggestion to this effect. Similarly I will not give to a woman an abortive remedy. In purity and holiness I will guard my life and my art.

I will not use the knife, not even on sufferers from stone, but will withdraw in favor of such men as are engaged in this work.

Whatever houses I may visit, I will come for the benefit of the sick, remaining free of all intentional injustice, of all mischief and in particular of sexual relations with both female and male persons, be they free or slaves.

What I may see or hear in the course of the treatment or even outside of the treatment in regard to the life of men, which on no account one must spread abroad, I will keep to myself, holding such things shameful to be spoken about.

If I fulfil this oath and do not violate it, may it be granted to me to enjoy life and art, being honored with fame among all men for all time to come; if I transgress it and swear falsely, may the opposite of all this be my lot.

dmjdc

"making sure some irresponsible woman has the "right" to do what she wants".

who are you to judge some woman as irresponsible and decide what her rights are?

well ill tell you what rick, in my opinion, any person who decides to walk into clinic to have her child killed is irresponsible, and thats being kind, rick. who are you to think that this is acceptable behavior. by the way rick, i didnt remember asking your opinion. and since this board is for posting opinions, and i respect yours, how bout you back off a little.

I am of the opinion that a woman has the right to do what she feels is right for her. If that includes getting an abortion, then so be it. I do not think that anyone has the right to tell her that she can't get one. There are more than enough unwanted children in the world, no need to produce more.

J

dmjdc

sorry. i apologise. i just reread what i said and i should not have been as curt. thank you for pointing it out in a gentlemanly fashion.
rick

Our individual liberties and freedoms pretty much ensure that some people are going to do things others see as wrong. I am not arguing for abortion. I think it is the wrong choice. But it's a choice. We are almost at the point where we can stop performing surgical abortion. With pills like RU483(?) they are pretty much obsolete. I think the people picketing the clinics might do better if they set up a table to arrange adoptions.

What if a woman learns her unborn child has a genetic disease like Tay-Sachs? There is no cure, the child will suffer horribly and die by her 5th birthday. Is it compassion or selfishness to allow this child to be born? What about rape or incest? I agree that abortion should not be used as a convenience or for birth control, especially with the availability of "morning-after pills". I surely don't want to see it outlawed, either. This is my LIBERTARIAN, not liberal perspective. The government should never subsidize abortions.

In early 1977, MrsS went to the doctor for his confirmation of her pregnancy ... during the visit, he casually informed her that "if this pregnancy is not convenient for you and your husband, we can take care of it quickly and easily" ... I found that very casual and off-handed near-recommendation to be quite disconcerting ...

I can understand and accept abortions that are done for the health of the mother ... I can understand those done in instances where the child would have a less than viable existance ... I do not and can not condone those that are done because of convenience ... "unwanted" children can be placed for adoption and there are many loving people out there who'd be very willing to give those inconvenient and unwanted children a decent and wonderful life ...

It never ceases to amaze me that those in our society who most strongly favor abortion on demand are the same people who are most strongly against capital punishment ... they will march in protest and sign petitions on behalf of violent murderers but conduct their marches and sign their petitions in favor of the wholesale slaughter if innocent babies ... their utter lack of consistent logic is something I cannot begin to fathom ...

SteveS

change doctors. any doctor that would even suggest that is a money hungry no good sob.

The government as well as doctors, republicans, democrats, and any other groups have no right telling a woman what she can or cannot do to her body.

I am anti abortion for myself, but pro-choice for women and the US. And anyone who spouts off about adoption over and over needs to wake up and think about the care given to an unwanted child. I've seen pregnant women who drank and smoked and participated in illegal drug use without giving even passing thought to the fetus inside them. There's a difference between mercy and murder...

There indeed exist instances when an abortion is justifiable, and I think we've covered most above.
And none of us want additional government regulation.
But let's call a spade a spade. Abortion is the ending of a human life. Whether you are for or against it, it is an act which "kills" the baby.
The fact that the "pro-choice" crowd ignores this is quite obvious. Then they hide behind the religious theme. They haven't the balls to admit what they know to be true. Then they want my tax dollars to support it.
The government CAN tell you what to do to your body. In most states it is illegal to attempt suicide. We can't smoke marajuana. We can't clone ourselves. We can't walk around naked. We can't urinate where we choose. Heck, even oral sex and sodomy are illegal in many states.
But we continue to fight for the "right" to murder the unborn.
How very Civil of us...

The image of a big parade down Market St in SF with all the marchers carrying signs supporting a mans right to urinate where he chooses somehow springs to mind when I read 'gater's response (above) ... wonder what sort of coverage the press would give it ... and whether our esteemed Senator Boxer would be willing to sponsor some sort of congressional action ...

WE MUST BE FREE TO PEE...WE MUST BE FREE TO PEE...WE MUST BE FREE TO PEE...WE MUST BE FREE TO PEE...

NO PEE NO PEACE...NO PEE NO PEACE...NO PEE NO PEACE...NO PEE NO PEACE...

JJ ummm Bro yer startin to sound like the Rev. Jessie Jackson??? hhhhmmmmm we gunna start callin ya RJJ

now about this Anti Oral Sex States??? I'm not movin to one of them... I still got my Snorkle!!!!!


Hog

"It never ceases to amaze me that those in our society who most strongly favor abortion on demand are the same people who are most strongly against capital punishment... their utter lack of consistent logic is something I cannot begin to fathom"

Doesn't that "lack of consistent logic" apply to the fact that those most in favor of capital punishment are the same people that are most strongly against legalized abortion?

uncleb,you make a valid point. it is true that most liberals are prochoice and against capital punishment, and most conservatives are prolife and infavor of capital punishment. i used to be the later of the two, but i had a change of heart about two years ago. i personally am prolife and against capital punishment. i respect all views because i have been on both sides at one time. my past views were this: its ok to perform capital punishment because unlike unborn children, they have had the chance in life to make their decisions, good or bad, and i felt an eye for an eye was the answer. i now feel that it is not OUR right to take human life under any circumstances, in uterous or out. and my belief is based on a moral foundation i have set for myself, irregardless of religeon. but you make a very vald point.