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Last post 7 years ago by Brewha. 900 replies replies.
Poll Question : Is Global Warming Real?
Choice Votes Statistics
No, it’s just made up by the left wing Liberals. 10 11 %
Maybe, it’s a natural cycle - not really man made. 46 54 %
Yes, it largely caused by industrial pollution. 29 34 %
Total 85 100%

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Is Global Warming Real?
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SweetHavok Offline
#101 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 3:38 PM EST
Joined: 11-28-2012
Posts: 557
victor809 wrote:
Omniscient.

I've been on this forum for a long time, and for many of the years I attempted to engage in open conversation with other members. I learned my lesson. I have realized that I have a much more enjoyable outlook on this forum if my entire goal is to bloviate for a bit and mock people.

A conversation requires equal participation from all members, and honestly a large number of people have neither the reading comprehension nor the math skills required to actually be participants in a conversation.



bloviate?????



OK, since when is a prerequisite to know calculus or trigonometry, in order to have a intelligent conversation? I've learned a whole lot listening to my children, and trust me they don't know either one, well at least not yet anyways.

Equal participation? when you already stated that we are wrong and you are right, comes off a bit arrogant to say the least.

You posed this question here in these forums, while I'm a n00b by anyone's standards here I can easily tell that sarcasm, shenanigans, and jackassery is the norm here. If you want a real serious discussion about this I'm pretty sure you can find a more upscale forum discussion group somewhere, that will be better to your liking.
Brewha Offline
#102 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 3:39 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
Victor is Behemecoatyl?
bloody spaniard Offline
#103 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 3:50 PM EST
Joined: 03-14-2003
Posts: 43,802
Brewha wrote:
Using science to lie is truly nothing new – point taken.
However, the fault is not with the science. It is with those who twist it to lie and manipulate.
People do this with religion. But it is not the religion that is evil.
Marketing and spin aside - if they can be separated out – I think science is out best hope for our future.
Ogie?




Spelled it phonetically- Augie was Doggie Daddy's (Jimmy Durante impersonation) dear ole son in Hanna Barbera cartoon.

I don't know that science can be salvaged, Brew, but I hope so. Religion is sometimes driven by zealots and or well intentioned folks for a myriad of reasons, spiritual reward, altruism, power, money, fear, hatred (note the exploding vests) but science is mostly motivated by markets under the guise of man's salvation IMHO.
jpotts Offline
#104 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 3:54 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
Brewha wrote:
You seem to value scientists less than politicians. Now why would jpotts hate scientists?


Because I've worked with them in the past.

You want to see one of the biggest group of brain-dead lemmings? They usually have a PhD next to their name.

Brewha wrote:
The study of science made our modern life style possible. And the scientific field is more honest and honorable than many others that come to mind. While the body of scientific knowledge is replete with errors, they are found and corrected as time goes on. Science does not create dogma – that is the realm of others.


Hah! That'a a laugh!

Half of that lifestyle was given to you by people who were not scientists by any stretch of the imagination.

That's one of the biggest myths, right up there with how the government created the Internet (along with Al Gore).
jpotts Offline
#105 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 3:56 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
victor809 wrote:
Omniscient.

I've been on this forum for a long time, and for many of the years I attempted to engage in open conversation with other members. I learned my lesson. I have realized that I have a much more enjoyable outlook on this forum if my entire goal is to bloviate for a bit and mock people.


Well, the upside to this is the fact that you now realize you can be trained.

Wanna doggie biscut?
Brewha Offline
#106 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 3:57 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
Man needs science and religion both. But the trouble with any useful tool is that someone will find a way to misuse it.



Durante – geeze, it’s been years!
jpotts Offline
#107 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:00 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
hah cha cha...!
Brewha Offline
#108 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:05 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
jpotts wrote:
Hah! That'a a laugh!

Half of that lifestyle was given to you by people who were not scientists by any stretch of the imagination.

That's one of the biggest myths, right up there with how the government created the Internet (along with Al Gore).


I understand that way you feel. But you will change your mind when science finds a cure for senility . . .




Just sayin'
jpotts Offline
#109 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:25 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
Brewha wrote:
I understand that way you feel. But you will change your mind when science finds a cure for senility . . .

Just sayin'


No I won't.

Honestly, it is better for all of us that Rickamaven does not have full control of his faculties (or bladder function).
victor809 Offline
#110 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:27 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
SweetHavok wrote:
bloviate?????



OK, since when is a prerequisite to know calculus or trigonometry, in order to have a intelligent conversation? I've learned a whole lot listening to my children, and trust me they don't know either one, well at least not yet anyways.

Equal participation? when you already stated that we are wrong and you are right, comes off a bit arrogant to say the least.

You posed this question here in these forums, while I'm a n00b by anyone's standards here I can easily tell that sarcasm, shenanigans, and jackassery is the norm here. If you want a real serious discussion about this I'm pretty sure you can find a more upscale forum discussion group somewhere, that will be better to your liking.





Formal "Logic" has a foundation in algebra. If you cannot understand the basics of algebra, you are significantly less likely to form conclusions which are, for lack of a better word, rational. Think of it in the same way that knowing A+B=C would allow you to deduce B from A & C.

So I looked back at my first post in this thread, and you are correct, I used 2 question marks. However, if you note the phrasing, I wasn't asking anyone in particular that question, nor was I expecting an answer. These were rhetorical questions, as the immediately following sentence answered why one wouldn't. In other words, I went straight to the mocking. :)

Trust me, I'm just skipping the boring steps... ultimately any "conversation" on this place will reduce to individuals who don't actually read the posts they are arguing against yet are convinced they are wrong based on completely irrelevant information. I've danced this dance before.

As for sarcasm etc... you haven't been around long enough to see the truly ugly side of some of the arguments.
victor809 Offline
#111 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:28 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
jpotts wrote:
Well, the upside to this is the fact that you now realize you can be trained.

Wanna doggie biscut?


^ Here's a prime example of an individual who does not have a full grasp of math, and his arguments have always suffered.
jpotts Offline
#112 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:30 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
victor809 wrote:
^ Here's a prime example of an individual who does not have a full grasp of math, and his arguments have always suffered.


Just admit that ruggie was right, and you'll feel better about yourself almost instantly.
victor809 Offline
#113 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:32 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
jpotts wrote:
Just admit that ruggie was right, and you'll feel better about yourself almost instantly.


Ah ruggie... couldn't understand the mathematical concept of "average"... In fact, if I recall, he had no grasp of any statistical methodology...

And you couldn't seem to grasp it either.

And people wonder why I just jump to the mocking without bothering to hear your response any longer....
ZRX1200 Offline
#114 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:36 PM EST
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,614
Victor what medium did you use to illustrate your Math Superhero comic book?
Brewha Offline
#115 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:38 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
victor809 wrote:

And people wonder why I just jump to the mocking without bothering to hear your response any longer....


Actually, I don't wonder at all . . . .
Brewha Offline
#116 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:41 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
ZRX1200 wrote:
Victor what medium did you use to illustrate your Math Superhero comic book?

Captain Calculus?
Doctor Derivative?
Wait – Lieutenant Tenfingers?
jpotts Offline
#117 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:44 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
victor809 wrote:
Ah ruggie... couldn't understand the mathematical concept of "average"... In fact, if I recall, he had no grasp of any statistical methodology...

And you couldn't seem to grasp it either.

And people wonder why I just jump to the mocking without bothering to hear your response any longer....


No Victor, I had a grasp of it.

You just didn't like the fact that populations need to adjusted for size for apples-to-apples comparisons.

Plus, after the last 10 years of mostly working with people who have PhDs and Masters, I've come to conclude that the higher-education system in this country is basically f**ked. Which explains why so many of these "knowledgable" people with credentials make a boatload of really, really dumb decisions.

I and do mean dumb. Really, really...really dumb

However, I digress.
Brewha Offline
#118 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:52 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
I have seen a stronger correlation between privilege and advanced degrees, than between intelligence and advanced degrees.

This is where I springboard into my “education should be a public trust and not a business” speech . . . .
victor809 Offline
#119 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 4:59 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
jpotts wrote:
No Victor, I had a grasp of it.

You just didn't like the fact that populations need to adjusted for size for apples-to-apples comparisons.

Plus, after the last 10 years of mostly working with people who have PhDs and Masters, I've come to conclude that the higher-education system in this country is basically f**ked. Which explains why so many of these "knowledgable" people with credentials make a boatload of really, really dumb decisions.

I and do mean dumb. Really, really...really dumb

However, I digress.



.... yeah, I remember. You had no grasp of the concept that an average was already a normalized (adjusted for population size) number.

That's what I find so hilarious about your arguments... you won't stop talking about how stupid educated people are, yet you fail to grasp the simplest of statistical principles. It's almost like... maybe you couldn't successfully get educated, and now you're really pissed at anyone who did.

Naaah... that couldn't be it.

Your apology is accepted.
jpotts Offline
#120 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 5:10 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
victor809 wrote:
.... yeah, I remember. You had no grasp of the concept that an average was already a normalized (adjusted for population size) number.

That's what I find so hilarious about your arguments... you won't stop talking about how stupid educated people are, yet you fail to grasp the simplest of statistical principles. It's almost like... maybe you couldn't successfully get educated, and now you're really pissed at anyone who did.

Naaah... that couldn't be it.

Your apology is accepted.



Victor, it's not my fault that your graduating class was chock-full to the brim with dumba**es.

By the way, I love it when someone with a PhD ins some sort of computer sciences (not mentioning you, here, Victor) has to go to the Internet to print off something to tell me I'm wrong.

This is after the fact that I had to explain to them how an actual computer works.

Again: the majority of people coming out of these PhD and Masters programs are complete idiots. Which is also why your use of the top-end statistic was wrong, and needed to be averaged out.

Education and knowledge is cumulative across a population, Victor. It is not a static property.

Sorry, you still lose. You owe someone an apology.
ZRX1200 Offline
#121 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 5:12 PM EST
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,614
Maybe his professor owes an apology.
jpotts Offline
#122 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 5:25 PM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
I've got another story.

The last place I worked at, I used to go to lunch with this guy (he had a Masters in EE and was a real wiz, so he was the exception to the rule) on a fairly regular basis. One day, as he's driving to the resturant, he starts:

"You know, when you said" - I'll name the guy Sam - "that Sam was dumber than a box of rocks, I though, "There's Potts going off again. Exaggerating.' That was until last night. You know what? That guys IS as dumb as a box of rocks!" He then proceeded to tell me about a 1 am call my buddy had with Sam concerning a pretty high-profile project (at least for my company) where Sam - a guy with a Master's degree as well - couldn't understand some basic stuff as it came to technology.

To make matters worse, Sam was a subject matter expert for a HUGE company in one of their key operational areas. Nothing got implemented in that key operational area unless Sam signed off on it.

My only response was, "Your first mistake was admitting to me that I was right..."




(Which is what Victor is so aggressively trying not to do.)
Brewha Offline
#123 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:00 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
I have been rethinking this. We should be kinder to Victor.
He obviously has special needs, lacking a soul and all. I admit to having been taken back by misanthropic statements, but I think he is crying out for help. His boasting of intelligence is just a shell to protect his fragile image of self.

We need a kinder, gentler Cbid. I know I can count on you all to help.
ZRX1200 Offline
#124 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:06 PM EST
Joined: 07-08-2007
Posts: 60,614
You're really ruining a good ol Victor/Potts scuffle...
victor809 Offline
#125 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:08 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Potts... all you ever have is anecdotes about how dumb educated people are, and how in all your interactions with them, you're right.
Yet you show yourself to be 100% incorrect in a number of situations where: 1 -right/wrong is a mathematical property, not an opinion; and 2 - you're still unable to understand where you are incorrect.

Since you've shown in a number of situations where you are unable to understand an unambiguously correct answer (ie 2+2=4) , I can only assume that you make these same errors throughout the rest of your life. In other words, I suspect you are simply unable to understand that these people are in fact correct and not the idiots you think they are,

This reminds me of a coworker (I'm going to use a pottsian irrelevant anecdote!)... in his youth he had attempted a PhD in physics, but had left the department. He claimed that he left because he had discovered a completely novel way of understanding gravity, or something like that. And that his discovery was so groundbreaking and so novel that the entire physics department didn't understand it, and so they drove him out.

Well, that's all fine and dandy... sure, we all would like to believe in the genius underdog who's fighting the unbending university which didn't understand his brilliance. But the reality is that he'd tried for a PhD in Religion as well, and another in anthropology... failing out of all 3. In fact, after he started self-destructing at work, ultimately leading to his firing, it became clear that he simply was delusional, and his "novel understanding" of just about anything was simply a delusional inability to understand facts.

Kinda reminds me of you...
victor809 Offline
#126 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:09 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Brewha wrote:
I have been rethinking this. We should be kinder to Victor.
He obviously has special needs, lacking a soul and all. I admit to having been taken back by misanthropic statements, but I think he is crying out for help. His boasting of intelligence is just a shell to protect his fragile image of self.

We need a kinder, gentler Cbid. I know I can count on you all to help.


Brew.... none of us have souls. They do not exist.
Get a coat...
wheelrite Offline
#127 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:34 PM EST
Joined: 11-01-2006
Posts: 50,119
Brewha wrote:
I have been rethinking this. We should be kinder to Victor.
He obviously has special needs, lacking a soul and all. I admit to having been taken back by misanthropic statements, but I think he is crying out for help. His boasting of intelligence is just a shell to protect his fragile image of self.

We need a kinder, gentler Cbid. I know I can count on you all to help.


Sooo ,,,,

You're saying

Victor = Fredo Corleone ?

Think
Brewha Offline
#128 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:40 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
victor809 wrote:
Brew.... none of us have souls. They do not exist.
Get a coat...

A coat? A coat of what?

Asserting that we have no souls is heresy. You should know better than that. Better that you claim to have lost your own soul, or that I have lost mine than to say there are none. You would not want to be thought of as a godless man.
Brewha Offline
#129 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:45 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
wheelrite wrote:
Sooo ,,,,

You're saying

Victor = Fredo Corleone ?

Think

Nah - I don't think he's Italian. Russian maybe. Potts thinks Cromagnon . . .
Brewha Offline
#130 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:49 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
ZRX1200 wrote:
You're really ruining a good ol Victor/Potts scuffle...

Your right Z. Who am I to come between these to two love birds . . . .
yardobeef Offline
#131 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 6:54 PM EST
Joined: 10-25-2011
Posts: 849
wheelrite wrote:
Sooo ,,,,

You're saying

Victor = Fredo Corleone ?

Think


Leave the greenhouse gases, take the cannoli.
victor809 Offline
#132 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 7:13 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Brewha wrote:
Nah - I don't think he's Italian. Russian maybe. Potts thinks Cromagnon . . .


Interestingly, I'm more italian than any other nationality...
victor809 Offline
#133 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 7:14 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
Brewha wrote:
A coat? A coat of what?

Asserting that we have no souls is heresy. You should know better than that. Better that you claim to have lost your own soul, or that I have lost mine than to say there are none. You would not want to be thought of as a godless man.


Now you're just playing stupid....
Brewha Offline
#134 Posted: Thu, Jan 17 2013, 8:24 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
victor809 wrote:
Now you're just playing stupid....

And after all I have done for you. You would leave me without so much as a coat . . . .

Where is your charity?
jpotts Offline
#135 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 12:08 AM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
victor809 wrote:
Potts... all you ever have is anecdotes about how dumb educated people are, and how in all your interactions with them, you're right.
Yet you show yourself to be 100% incorrect in a number of situations where: 1 -right/wrong is a mathematical property, not an opinion; and 2 - you're still unable to understand where you are incorrect.

Since you've shown in a number of situations where you are unable to understand an unambiguously correct answer (ie 2+2=4) , I can only assume that you make these same errors throughout the rest of your life. In other words, I suspect you are simply unable to understand that these people are in fact correct and not the idiots you think they are,

This reminds me of a coworker (I'm going to use a pottsian irrelevant anecdote!)... in his youth he had attempted a PhD in physics, but had left the department. He claimed that he left because he had discovered a completely novel way of understanding gravity, or something like that. And that his discovery was so groundbreaking and so novel that the entire physics department didn't understand it, and so they drove him out.

Well, that's all fine and dandy... sure, we all would like to believe in the genius underdog who's fighting the unbending university which didn't understand his brilliance. But the reality is that he'd tried for a PhD in Religion as well, and another in anthropology... failing out of all 3. In fact, after he started self-destructing at work, ultimately leading to his firing, it became clear that he simply was delusional, and his "novel understanding" of just about anything was simply a delusional inability to understand facts.

Kinda reminds me of you...



Lol.

Victor, ever stopped to think that maybe you have too elevated an opinion of people with acedemic pedigree?

And yeah, the majority of them I look upon with disdain.

History is filled to the brim with people who had a "novel understanding" of things, and were r-e-v-i-l-e-d by the accredited elite. It is unfortunate that the depth of your historical understanding is so shallow. But if it make you feel any better, I'll take my wratn and ire out on the tech support guys I've been on hold with for the last 30 minutes, whom all have PhDs, and can't figure out how to use their own system.

(And you still owe the guy an apology.)
jpotts Offline
#136 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 12:10 AM EST
Joined: 06-14-2006
Posts: 28,811
wheelrite wrote:
Sooo ,,,,

You're saying

Victor = Fredo Corleone ?

Think

I can just hear him now.

I'M SMAAAT! I CAN RUN STUFF!!! YOU'RE MY KID BROTHER, AND I WAS PASSED OVAH!!!
HockeyDad Offline
#137 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:35 AM EST
Joined: 09-20-2000
Posts: 46,134
Brewha wrote:
Using science to lie is truly nothing new – point taken.
However, the fault is not with the science. It is with those who twist it to lie and manipulate.



That is ridiculous. That would be like blaming the shooter and not the gun.
victor809 Offline
#138 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 9:10 AM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
jpotts wrote:
Lol.

Victor, ever stopped to think that maybe you have too elevated an opinion of people with acedemic pedigree?

And yeah, the majority of them I look upon with disdain.

History is filled to the brim with people who had a "novel understanding" of things, and were r-e-v-i-l-e-d by the accredited elite. It is unfortunate that the depth of your historical understanding is so shallow. But if it make you feel any better, I'll take my wratn and ire out on the tech support guys I've been on hold with for the last 30 minutes, whom all have PhDs, and can't figure out how to use their own system.

(And you still owe the guy an apology.)



Yes potts, I'm sure categorically deciding that anyone who has put the effort, research and years into a topic required for a PhD is "dumb" is definitely the direction to go. No way that can go wrong.

Give me a study showing IQ vs years education rather than your worthless anecdotes, and then you can start to sound less like a crazy bearded homeless man. Of course, the study will probably be developed by someone with a PhD, so I'm sure it must be wrong.... Brick wall
DrMaddVibe Offline
#139 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 9:39 AM EST
Joined: 10-21-2000
Posts: 55,440
victor809 wrote:
Jpotts, I'm a flaming tard. It's true I love rubby and advocating for homosexuals in Georgetown but if I told you that would you hold it against me? You know...that? Please.

Don't tell the cops.

SweetHavok Offline
#140 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 2:29 PM EST
Joined: 11-28-2012
Posts: 557
victor809 wrote:
Brew.... none of us have souls. They do not exist.
Get a coat...





victor, your apparent disdain for someone beliefs does not make any of your arguments any stronger. Its one thing to argue point vs. counter point its a whole other mater to make a mockery of their beliefs, that's just low. I myself respect others beliefs even though I do not necessarily agree with them. And from what I read in no way did he try to force his beliefs on you, simply made a statement.
DrafterX Offline
#141 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 2:36 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,552
SweetHavok wrote:
victor, your apparent disdain for someone beliefs does not make any of your arguments any stronger. Its one thing to argue point vs. counter point its a whole other mater to make a mockery of their beliefs, that's just low. I myself respect others beliefs even though I do not necessarily agree with them. And from what I read in no way did he try to force his beliefs on you, simply made a statement.



it's much easier to not take anyone seriously in here..... Mellow
victor809 Offline
#142 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 3:52 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
SweetHavok wrote:
victor, your apparent disdain for someone beliefs does not make any of your arguments any stronger. Its one thing to argue point vs. counter point its a whole other mater to make a mockery of their beliefs, that's just low. I myself respect others beliefs even though I do not necessarily agree with them. And from what I read in no way did he try to force his beliefs on you, simply made a statement.


Not sure what you're referring to, but if it's potts, you have to realize he and I have a very long history. Thousands of pages worth of "discussion". I can tell you every argument he will make, none of it has ever changed. point vs counterpoint is moot at that point (badum bum!).

Now, regardless of who you're referring to, "beliefs" are ridiculous within a discussion which should have a scientific basis (whether you agree with global warming or not, I'd like to think that everyone can agree that it is a scientific topic)... one can have assumptions, suppositions, educated guesses, estimations and even the occasional fact...

I mean, if I'm sitting on the dock with a temperature sensor in the water and you tell me you "believe" the water is 34F, while my temperature sensor is telling me its 55F, I'm going to mock you for your beliefs.
SweetHavok Offline
#143 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:22 PM EST
Joined: 11-28-2012
Posts: 557
ok, seems I jumped the gun on this one a bit, my bad.



And as far as relying on instruments, for reliable data, apparently you haven't heard of faulty equipment. Personal experience and beliefs have led me not to always rely on instruments. Don't know how many times I have seen mechanics in the Army work on a vehicle because it doesn't start. I immediately check the gas tank itself, knock it a few times and realize its empty. Then tell the mechanics its out of fuel and thats why it doesn't start. But they say its reading full, half or whatever the gauge says. I repeat the knocking on the gas tank so they can hear the hollow sound of an empty tank. Mind you I'm no mechanic I usually work in a warehouse, logistics.
victor809 Offline
#144 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:30 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
SweetHavok wrote:
ok, seems I jumped the gun on this one a bit, my bad.



And as far as relying on instruments, for reliable data, apparently you haven't heard of faulty equipment. Personal experience and beliefs have led me not to always rely on instruments. Don't know how many times I have seen mechanics in the Army work on a vehicle because it doesn't start. I immediately check the gas tank itself, knock it a few times and realize its empty. Then tell the mechanics its out of fuel and thats why it doesn't start. But they say its reading full, half or whatever the gauge says. I repeat the knocking on the gas tank so they can hear the hollow sound of an empty tank. Mind you I'm no mechanic I usually work in a warehouse, logistics.


Of course an instrument can be bad... you're kind of missing the point though. You double checked an instrument, using another instrument (your ears... not as accurate as a gauge, but still going to give you a ball-park). At no time are you simply relying on "belief".
Belief would be if the gauge said full, knocking on it suggested it was full, cameras installed in the tank showed it to be full, and the engine was running... yet you still said it was empty. Belief is absent of fact, supposition, estimation or assumption....
DrafterX Offline
#145 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:31 PM EST
Joined: 10-18-2005
Posts: 98,552
I blame ethanol.... Mad
SweetHavok Offline
#146 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:38 PM EST
Joined: 11-28-2012
Posts: 557
victor my poor victor


1) I made an assumption, which is otherwise known as a belief

2) relying on my senses instead of instruments validated my assumption

simple enough for you?
SweetHavok Offline
#147 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:41 PM EST
Joined: 11-28-2012
Posts: 557
DrafterX wrote:
I blame ethanol.... Mad







yup, only ethanol I like is the one I can Beer
Brewha Offline
#148 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:42 PM EST
Joined: 01-25-2010
Posts: 12,182
HockeyDad wrote:
That is ridiculous. That would be like blaming the shooter and not the gun.

Nice try HD, but your attempt at misdirection are as thin as the vial on an 18 year old belly dancer.
In heals.
With one of those big rhinestones in her belly.
And castanets. . . . .
victor809 Offline
#149 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 4:51 PM EST
Joined: 10-14-2011
Posts: 23,866
SweetHavok wrote:
victor my poor victor


1) I made an assumption, which is otherwise known as a belief

2) relying on my senses instead of instruments validated my assumption

simple enough for you?



as·sump·tion [uh-suhmp-shuh n] Show IPA
noun
1.
something taken for granted; a supposition: a correct assumption. Synonyms: presupposition; hypothesis, conjecture, guess, postulate, theory.

be·lief [bih-leef] Show IPA
noun
1.
something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat.

These are similar words, and many times are interchangeable but not in this case. The assumption you made was that the gauge was incorrect, this was postulated, and then verified. "Belief" in this case would be that you believe all gauges to be incorrect all the time, without any need to verify. Either was, I suppose we are splitting hairs.

If you don't think your senses are instruments, then contemplate the idea of a microscope.
SweetHavok Offline
#150 Posted: Fri, Jan 18 2013, 5:14 PM EST
Joined: 11-28-2012
Posts: 557
victor809 wrote:
as·sump·tion [uh-suhmp-shuh n] Show IPA
noun
1.
something taken for granted; a supposition: a correct assumption. Synonyms: presupposition; hypothesis, conjecture, guess, postulate, theory.

be·lief [bih-leef] Show IPA
noun
1.
something believed; an opinion or conviction: a belief that the earth is flat.

These are similar words, and many times are interchangeable but not in this case. The assumption you made was that the gauge was incorrect, this was postulated, and then verified. "Belief" in this case would be that you believe all gauges to be incorrect all the time, without any need to verify. Either was, I suppose we are splitting hairs.

If you don't think your senses are instruments, then contemplate the idea of a microscope.





Apparently you've never taken a science class. When you want to test a idea, you must first form a hypothesis, in which you state an assumption of how you believe things will turn out. Then you go about trying to find out if your hypothesis is correct.Assumptions play a key role in science so don't be so quick to discredit them, and although not all assumptions that are made will turn out to be true, much can be learned from them as well.

And yes senses are a type of instrument, just not the type you can pick up and put in your coat pocket, they are the intangible type.

As far as beliefs, relying on my beliefs has saved my life on numerous occasions, stayed clear of a situations when everything seemed normal and everyone else thought nothing could go wrong. Did I have to take out a beaker, microscope, thermometer. No, I believed in the intangibles such as my instincts.

*Just on a personal note so no one makes an assumption because of my profession, the situations in which my life was spared had nothing to do with combat, as stated before I normally work in a warehouse, just work hazards in what was supposed to be a routine work day. Not trying to take credit for something I don't do.
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